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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: A LUTHIERS LIFE


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/251124/17

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Kirk Jacobs - Posted - 05/07/2013:  20:52:46


You should feel pride.  If you were to photo me everyday it would be of my back looking at what you and others have posted for the day.  I've been enjoying it immensely.  I have enjoyed it so much that when you posted about working on the house you just sold, I felt like I had missed a chance to live in this special place called Paris TN.  So thank you for the trouble you have go through to share with us.



 



Once the warm tingling feeling wears off you can safely return to work.big


Edited by - Kirk Jacobs on 05/07/2013 20:55:41

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/08/2013:  18:46:02


Kirk,



Thanks so much!

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/09/2013:  05:56:00


5-9-2013



BACK ON THE QUEEN



Good morning from the Queen of the Mississippi! Eddie Coffey and I traveled from my home sweet home of Paris, Tennessee down highway 40 to 55 (where we went 70) to 20 to beautiful Vicksburg, Mississippi. Arriving there about 3:30.



Anyway most of this post is of that trip.



I am sure you are wondering about this photo of a quilt. Well after we got into Mississippi we stopped at the big Mississippi Welcome Station? Rest Stop. It's such a pretty thing that Eddie calls it the Taj Mahl. They were having an event. Eddie said that they must have known that we were coming. There was a bluegrass band playing, a blues player moaning, a bunch of displays and a quilt show... Just for us, imagine!







We got stuck in traffic outside of Jackson, Mississippi on Hwy 20. They were working on the freeway. We were going so slow that I got out the old archtop and started pickin'!





Soon we reached our destination. The QUEEN OF THE MISSISSIPPI a wedding cake docked in Vicksburg.





Here is our home sweet home away from home!





more tomorrow...



 

Dave1climber - Posted - 05/09/2013:  06:46:11


So it looks like another paid vacation!  big



Dan, "Johnny banjo seed", keep spreading the news.  big

Kaelri - Posted - 05/09/2013:  08:18:46


ha ha ha ha. I like that phrase, Dave! Johnny Banjo Seed! Funny and so apropos!  That is EXACTLY who Dan is! Spreading the Good Banjo News up and down the Mississippi and across Tennesee!



Ellen smiley


Edited by - Kaelri on 05/09/2013 08:20:24

dougzbanjo - Posted - 05/09/2013:  13:33:37


Maybe I missed this part, but what got you started in this business in the first place Dan? Its pretty interesting.

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/10/2013:  20:26:05


Dave & Ellen,



Danny Banjo Seed... I like it!



Doug,



It is a long, long story. I will post it some time soon (although a few posts back I did talk a bit about how I started doing this river work).

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/10/2013:  20:41:07


Friday about 10:27 and 32 seconds...



ON THE QUEEN IN MEMPHIS



We had no real internet until just a bit ago. The first mate Robert told me that there was some problem with the satellite hookup. I still find it amazing that I can post (at least some of the time) when I'm out on the rivers like this! What an very nice day yesterday and today have been.





Here I'm teaching a banjo workshop with those little banjos... Folks sure have a good time doing the frailing lick!





Here Eddie is helping me perform some classical or parlor style banjo. We played the Sunflower Dance, Spanish Fandango and an Irish tune South Wind.





This is our Home Sweet Home away from home...It is a crew quarter. Not really set up for Four Banjos, Three Guitars, a musical saw, our duds and an upright bass!





See you tomorrow!

Dave1climber - Posted - 05/11/2013:  04:30:30


In as much as you find it pleasing, I by virtue of the power vested in me (not much), do here by christen you, "Danny Banjo Seed".  Raise glass (coffee cup) in toast!  Keep picken and grinning!!  clown  clown  clown

DEmery - Posted - 05/11/2013:  06:25:19


Dan it looks like the weather has cooperated and all the folks are enjoying the music. We have known each other for a decade or so; and nobody can wear red saddle oxfords and orange socks like you. Goes well with the green monster banjo. David E.

dougzbanjo - Posted - 05/11/2013:  07:29:59


quote:

Originally posted by DanKnowles

 

Dave & Ellen,




Danny Banjo Seed... I like it!




Doug,




It is a long, long story. I will post it some time soon (although a few posts back I did talk a bit about how I started doing this river work).







Dan, I was refering to being a luthier. Thanks

Steven M - Posted - 05/11/2013:  12:49:11


Wow that is one small cabin, cosy!

Dave1climber - Posted - 05/11/2013:  14:20:31


quote:

Originally posted by Steven M

 

Wow that is one small cabin, cosy!







When I was in the Navy aboard ship that some space would have six "racks", bunks.

cbcarlisle - Posted - 05/11/2013:  21:12:36


But, Dave, I don't think the Navy would allow One banjo player on board, let alone six in the same space.

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/12/2013:  05:38:32


MOTHERS DAY 2013



HEADING TO VICKSBURG



Good morning from the QUEEN OF THE MISSISSIPPI. As I am writing this we are underway headed to Vicksburg, Mississippi. A show later today and then we head home.



Yesterday was change over day, the guests from the last cruse left and new ones joined us. That is always exciting and interesting. New folks, new faces...



Here is the QUEEN IN THE EARLY MORNING DOCKED IN MEMPHIS.





The weather finally came up nice to give us this beautiful sunset.









Earlier and before we left out Eddie and I played tourist and visited the Peabody Hotel. Here I'm on the roof.







I purchased a new bow tie in Memphis. I'd never tried to tie one before. Here Eddie's trying to help me out.





After an afternoons worth of trying I finally got it!





More quite soon!



 

jbalch - Posted - 05/12/2013:  06:01:07


The new bow tie is perfect with those COOL shoes....

BNJOMAKR - Posted - 05/12/2013:  06:12:09


Looking sharp!



I'm just waiting for the plaid pants and pokie-dotted shirt! wink big

Dave1climber - Posted - 05/12/2013:  14:37:52


Danny Banjo Seed



If you follow Marvin's thought you will have to take up golf!!  clown

Kirk Jacobs - Posted - 05/12/2013:  15:38:52


And protect your wardrobe from the like of Greg Rich  big

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/13/2013:  06:35:01


John, Marvin, Dave & Kirk,



Thanks four your comments and wardrobe advice...as to the Golf advice I did dress up for the Masters Golf Tournament (of course I was doing a show that evening), does that count?

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/13/2013:  07:57:44


5-13-2013



OH IT'S GOOD TO BE BACK HOME AGAIN!



Eddie and I drove in from Vicksburg yesterday afternoon. Our show had been moved to earlier in the day (before lunch) so we were able to get on the road around 2 PM. Funny but the trip home was quicker than the trip to the boat. I guess these two old horses were in a hurry to get to the barn...I know i was!



Still the trip was full of interesting people and events.



During turnover day (when the passengers are changed) Eddie and I were moved from our crew quarters to real staterooms! Boy talk about feeling uptown! We were on the second deck and so each had a little balcony. I shot these next couple of photos Sunday morning looking from my balcony.



Looking forward...





Looking aft...





Here is another of the Knowles fashion shows...



I'm ready for the mornings show...





After we landed in Vicksburg I walked up the hill to get the minivan. There are so many interesting details on these old buildings that I can't stop making photos. This is from the Army Corps. of Engineers building.







On the way home on interstate 55.





In Memphis I saw this fella with my fashion since.





More soon!



 


Edited by - Dan Knowles on 05/13/2013 07:59:42

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/13/2013:  18:55:24


5-13-2013



TAILPIECE TYME



Today I spent recovering from yesterday's traveling, working here at the house and going to a board meeting



 at the Lee Academy for the Arts... So I haven't taken any photos. Still I figured that y'all might likethis short trip through the LUTHIER'S ARCHIEVE.



So tonight we take a little look at my way of making a tailpiece. My design is a simple one, similar to the old No-Knot style. This is how I do it.



I lay out the tailpiece using this template.





Cutting it out...





Slicking up the sides...





Laying out the bends & notches...





Shaping the tangs...







Basically formed...





 





After a whole bunch of sanding and filing it is now ready for engraving and plating.





More tomorrow...

DEmery - Posted - 05/13/2013:  19:01:38


Those are fine tail pieces. The first one I had from you was on the ebony banjo and later a special one that is engraved used on the Flesher Jubilo. Still have it if you ever need one. David E


Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/14/2013:  20:02:05


Oh David,



The temptation may stronger grow!

Kaelri - Posted - 05/14/2013:  20:13:42


Thanks for posting the tailpiece archival pics! But now I have a question! I notice that between pictures # 6 and #7, the bottom (?) of the tailpiece, the part with the hole in it for attachment....well it has suddenly become perpendicular. Did you remove that part from the original piece and re-attach it? Or do you somehow bend it up? Just curious...but don't give away any trade secrets if I ask something you can't tell. smiley



 



Ellen

Kaelri - Posted - 05/14/2013:  20:15:41


Oh! Upon further study...it looks like you removed it and re-attached it. So I probably answered my own question. enlightened


Edited by - Kaelri on 05/14/2013 20:16:02

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/14/2013:  20:25:25


5-14-2013



SHOP, TEACH & PLAY



What fun! Today along with teaching I was able to work building a Bluegrass resonator banjo for some clients. Here I discuss the various merits of different styles of construction and quality of parts with my friends the Abraham's.





I also was able to turn the bluegrass rim. Here I'm loading uo the rim into my lathe to begin fitting the tone ring.





Truing the ledge...





When ever possable I like to do this job that I call "freeing the tone ring". I open the rim so the tone ring is able to "ring". This whole technique allows the tone rings flange to vibrate more freely and not act like a inert piece of metal. I have noticed an increased clarity and bass response.







I like to have about 5/16" free space.





Our Grand grandson Chandan (now 14 it's hard to believe) was in a play in his middle school tonight. Not only was he one of the stars of the show (no grandpa bias here!) but he played the Troll in Hansel & Gretel!





I wish I could say that I designed his wardrobe!





More tomorrow...

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/14/2013:  20:32:10


Ellen,



The lines in photo #4 show the placement for both the string hanger post nibs (how bout that fer a long 'un!) and the bend point. #5 onwards shows the tailpiece already bent, It's just difficult to see. What I neglected to show was the bending of the blank. I'm not sure that there were any photos of that in the achieve. It is bent from a solid piece of brass though.

Kaelri - Posted - 05/15/2013:  05:26:10


Ahhhhh, now I see! I must've had tired eyes while reading & looking at the pictures last night!



Thanks, Ellen

jbalch - Posted - 05/16/2013:  03:34:47


Dan: I just shipped Bob Campbell's banjo for you to clean & repair.  This banjos belonged to his grandfather.  It means a LOT to him.  I know Bob will appreciate your work.  Here is a photo of his grandfather playing the banjos in 1923:




Edited by - jbalch on 05/16/2013 03:38:28













 

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  06:11:07


John,



THIS LOOKS LIKE FUN!!! For me this is one of my great privileges, working on family heirlooms like this one. I look forward to seeing it soon. Thank you John and Bob.

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  06:55:51


5-15-2013



PAINT - CLOSE



Stair painting or more accurately tread painting. This is how my day has started for several days now. I live in a 113 year old house that we are fixing up (I love it!). These treads were originally painted grey. In fact all of the floors were painted a nice battleship grey. The bank we bought this house from had all of the main floors refinished a nice mahogany brown. So now because of all of the tacks, nail holes and such paint is really the only viable choice. So here I am painting the treads.





I got to thinkin' that y'all might want to know what the ol' Luthier was listening to as I work...well this is todays batch. Bob Wills, Lightnin' Hopkins, Doc Watson and Paul Simon. Just as a FYI I started with Mr. Simon.





David VanHouser of PBS's Creative License asked me for a few additional photos of me ringing  wood. I thought y'all might like to see this process too.



The piece is held 1/3 of the way down , on the side, then thumped with the thumb about 1/3 of the way up with it by your ear.





Maybe this shows it better.





Thump, thump.





I had to pull and re-glue this Coronado guitars bridge today. Out come the fake pearl dots hiding the bridge bolts.





Heat in the form of this heat lamp is applied to the bridge to soften the glue.





And off it comes. You can tell that the make did quality work here. RIGHT! no Notice the finish that was not removed from under the bridge.





Scraping off the old finish.





Glued and clamped...





Ah yes, you may have wondered about the word closing in the title. Well at 2:00 PM this afternoon we closed on selling our house that we used to live in. Now we are out of debt!!! Big, Big, Big Hip, Hip Hooray!!!!



When I got back to the shop I had a make up guitar lesson with one of my favorite students, Munghi. Sophie my dog was there and before we picked... well you can guess the rest.





More veri soon!

Nuts - Posted - 05/16/2013:  08:33:53


I'm curious what the dowels are for that are sticking up out of your bridge clamping caul?

Dave1climber - Posted - 05/16/2013:  09:57:22


Ah yes, you may have wondered about the word closing in the title. Well at 2:00 PM this afternoon we closed on selling our house that we used to live in. Now we are out of debt!!! Big, Big, Big Hip, Hip Hooray!!!!



 



Congratulations!!!



Dan, I know that out of debt feeling well, having a paid for home for a long time feels so good!!



Having to do home maintenance, not so much.  clown


Edited by - Dave1climber on 05/16/2013 09:59:33

Kaelri - Posted - 05/16/2013:  10:45:49


Dan & Dave,



Paying off a mortgage is so freeing! It sure feels good in the soul! My husband and I are in the process of doing the same thing, or at least a similar thing as you are doing, Dan. Glad to know we aren't the old "oddballs" out there! ha! Besides, it puts me closer to acquiring BAS , ha ha. 



Ellen

Steven M - Posted - 05/16/2013:  12:42:03


quote:

Originally posted by jbalch

 

Dan: I just shipped Bob Campbell's banjo for you to clean & repair.  This banjos belonged to his grandfather.  It means a LOT to him.  I know Bob will appreciate your work.  Here is a photo of his grandfather playing the banjos in 1923:










Is that really the same banjo as those in the pics you provide, for a start the headstock is quite different and also the gentleman in the pic above has a banjo with the fifth string on the lower part of the neck and not the upper.

Bufo Bill - Posted - 05/16/2013:  13:27:30


Out of debt . . . Now that sounds like a challenge to me. Better dust off your beer goggles,and brush up your blackjack skills, Dan!
All the best from Bill. :D

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  18:41:53


Paul,



Those little dowels are the handles for the clamp jacks... ah shucks, I'll just try to make a photo of the thing to show you what they are and do.



Dave, Ellen & Bill,



Thanks... it feels good to know that the bank can't have our home.  Bill I just realized that no gambler that I've ever known was out of debt...But maybe this time...big.



Steven,



Verlie, Verlie Interesting...



and observant. I didn't notice. This may take some thought.

Dan Drabek - Posted - 05/16/2013:  18:53:30


quote:

Originally posted by jbalch

 

Dan: I just shipped Bob Campbell's banjo for you to clean & repair.  







Wow--If I counted correctly, that banjo has 50 brackets! Guess that head isn't going anyplace. smiley



DD

jbalch - Posted - 05/16/2013:  18:59:57


It is the same banjo. It passed directly from the fellow in the photo to his grandson. Regarding the peg facing down. Some old photography methods reversed the image. It is very common to see that a right handed player posed holding the banjo backwards ( left handed and upside down) so the final image would appear correct.



I think there is something wrapped around the middle of the peg head disguising the shape a little. Perhaps this was something used to hang the banjo on the wall.



 


Edited by - jbalch on 05/16/2013 19:00:41

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  20:44:41


THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE!!!



Will1717 - Posted - 05/16/2013:  20:52:05


Dan:



Sorry I missed you today. I was busy rolling the inserts for banjos to come.  I'll give you a call tomorrow.



40,001 Reads now!



Bill bigbig

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  21:06:49


5-16-2013



THE BIG NEWS IS ALREADY OUT



It is amazing to me I take a look at the number of reads this post has garnered... I am so touched and humbled that so many of you good folks would take a look at my life so often. Thank you...



Yep here 'tiz, Bob Campbell's banjo arriving from John Balch. As always John's packing is both careful and immaculate. It looks like I was surprised by the camera, that's odd since I was the one who set it...





I guess the first reason Bob sent this banjo to John was because of this tear in the vellum. When I get to working on this instrument I will replace the head but will save the original, it has Bob's granddads' signature on the inside. The instrument is not in bad shape, a bit of time and TLC and it will be singing again.





Here I attempt to explain all of this!





The clamps were pulled from yesterdays bridge re-glue so now the bridge pin holes must be reamed clean of glue.





After I got the guitar strung up it had an odd buzz. I tried to locate it using my stethoscope. It turned out to be that the saddle was a tiny be misfited. Some scraping and sanding and all was well. These doctoring tools do come in handy some times.





Near the end of the day my "cousin" Roland Knowles dropped by and got to telling me tails of his Snow ancestors... Mostly about his uncle who talked his way into the Navy at 14. Wound up as a head engineer. Was given a special commendation and then just walked away! I couldn't help but record him. The stories were just too good!



y



More tomorrow!



I promise...

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/16/2013:  21:08:57


Bill,



Don't worry about it... I'll look forward to talking tomorrow.

Nuts - Posted - 05/17/2013:  11:40:49


quote:

Originally posted by DanKnowles

 

Paul,




Those little dowels are the handles for the clamp jacks... ah shucks, I'll just try to make a photo of the thing to show you what they are and do.




 


Ah. so you have threaded rods to adjust clamping feet that are adjusted with the dowels for a single clamp bridge caul?

Steven M - Posted - 05/17/2013:  13:20:16


quote:

Originally posted by jbalch

 

It is the same banjo. It passed directly from the fellow in the photo to his grandson. Regarding the peg facing down. Some old photography methods reversed the image. It is very common to see that a right handed player posed holding the banjo backwards ( left handed and upside down) so the final image would appear correct.




I think there is something wrapped around the middle of the peg head disguising the shape a little. Perhaps this was something used to hang the banjo on the wall.




 







Sorry but reversing the image would not allow the fifth string peg to move from lower to upper, I am quite aware about negative reversal and this would not account for that. Also there really isn't anything wrapped around the peghead, its quite clearly not the same neck!

Steven M - Posted - 05/17/2013:  13:22:40


Some people really want to believe what is told them by relatives about heirlooms etc but as an antique dealer of almost 25 years experience I would never believe a word of what is told me by owners of anything they hold of value, sorry but that is the harsh truth!

CosmicMaskedAvenger - Posted - 05/17/2013:  15:51:39


quote:

Originally posted by Steven M

 
quote:


Originally posted by jbalch

 


It is the same banjo. It passed directly from the fellow in the photo to his grandson. Regarding the peg facing down. Some old photography methods reversed the image. It is very common to see that a right handed player posed holding the banjo backwards ( left handed and upside down) so the final image would appear correct.




I think there is something wrapped around the middle of the peg head disguising the shape a little. Perhaps this was something used to hang the banjo on the wall.




 








Sorry but reversing the image would not allow the fifth string peg to move from lower to upper, I am quite aware about negative reversal and this would not account for that. Also there really isn't anything wrapped around the peghead, its quite clearly not the same neck!







 



Negative reversal wouldn't, but posing with it left handed with the peg on the bottom would, as the poster stated.   Which would be the way a right handed person posing with a right handed bango in a left handed manner would pose.  Otherwise, the banjo head would be facing the guy's stomach if he posed left handed with the peg on the top.



 



All one has to do is try posing left handed with a right handed banjo to see that.   

jbalch - Posted - 05/17/2013:  18:13:00


There are lots of older images that exhibit this. The banjo player posed holding his instrument opposite-handed and upside down so the the printed image would look correct.



i observed this in old photos...but never understood it until I read the book by Phillip Gura: Americas instrument: the banjo in the nineteenth century. He discusses it and shows examples.



 



The history of this banjo is not in doubt. 


Edited by - jbalch on 05/17/2013 18:27:35

Dan Knowles - Posted - 05/17/2013:  21:33:50


5-17-2013



DAN WEIGHS IN



After reading Steven's very observant comments and John's able defense of the validity of this instrument I felt that I needed to take a closer look. Like Steven in my trade I have seen many, many older instruments (usually fiddles around here) that cannot be at all what their owners claim. Like Steven I have seen repeated evidences of the frailty of memory.



So I went back and took a good look at the banjo and photograph in question.



First I cropped and enlarged the photo that John posted. Then I took one of John's modern photos of the banjo and added it to the original photo. Also I changed the contrast so the older photo of the peghead could be seen more clearly. Steven was correct, the pegheads were defiantly not the same shape. But it was then that I noticed the odd out of symmetry of the upper photo.



I knew (and know) that this banjo is not totally original. It has obviously been messed with some over the years. Most all of these changes appear to have taken place quite a number of years ago. The rim, tension hoop and bracket hardware has been over painted with silver paint (not a terribly uncommon thing). Hooks and nuts have been changed or replaced and there has been at least one attempt at a neck reset, evidenced by a nail driven into the heel. Also the neck has been partially refinished.



e



Knowing all of this, tonight I went back to the shop to investigate.



This is the question that I was wanting settled in my mind was this, was this peghead re-cut?



As most of you know alterations like this are not that uncommon in the banjo world. In fact just the other day someone requested that I perform something similar to this on a Gibson banjo (I did not take the job).



Here are a couple of photos I took tonight...



 



This is what I found...



1. The front and back of the peghead seam to have un-disturbed original finish on them. 



2. The neck has been refinished from the heel to the hand stop aria of the peghead, then the new finish continues around the outside of the peghead.



3. The inner points are not at the same height in relationship to the nut.



4. The tuners are not equadistant to the edge in the upper part of the peghead, while the tuners in the lower part are.



5. The upper curve of the peghead is not even.



6. The angles of the cuts on the inner points are not the same.



Because of this I believe that the peghead has been re-carved (allbeit in an ok manner) from the original at some time. Bob told me that the instrument is in the same condition as when he inherited it some 40 years ago. This leads me to believe that the alterations happened before that time by persons unknown. It is even possible that his grandfather did the work some time between the 1923 date of the photograph and the late 60's early 70's when Bob received the banjo.



 



These are my thoughts regarding the photograph:



First the obligatory excuse...  The following statement does not necessarily reflect the opinions or beliefs or possible thoughts of  the operators of the BanjoHangout web site, nor should it be construed to be evidence in a court of law in any civilized state residing on the planet know as Mars. Nor should these opinions be held against the children of ,nor their children, yea unto the third and fourth generation. Amen.



First of all the number of J-hooks appear to be very similar. Also the banjo sports a no-knott tailpiece, similar to the one on the banjo in my shop. The tuning knobs are white or light colored same as the one in my shop.



I personally believe that the player shown is holding the banjo in a left handed manner and that the image was reversed for some reason. So this is why I think this: Look at the position of the hands in the photo that John posted. Both hands are not in the natural position of a player and by all accounts this man was a player.



As an experiment I made this photo of my mug holding the banjo in a left handed manner and converted it to grey scale then reversed the image to make it some what like the other photo. Although now days it is much quicker and easier to do this during the time period of this photograph it would have been a simple manipulation. Although the player in the photo looks serious, most banjo players that I know (myself included) have a bit of a twisted sense of humor...





Is this proof that this is the same instrument? Not that would stand in a jury trial (or maybe so). But now that I have examined the evidence that I have, my best bet would be that it is the same instrument as shown in the photograph, albeit altered from its earlier state and reversed in the photo.



As my buddy Bob Valentine says, "That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!"



 

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