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GrizClaw - Posted - 04/14/2014: 14:42:03
What the Helix are you talking about Larry?
Helix - Posted - 04/14/2014: 17:42:23
See how easy it is Rick, See how Janet doesn't comment, just chuckles. this, too is a message.
I am also thankful for the banjos I have turned loose, I'm a citzen, I own a trademark.
I will watch this with great interest. With my 2006 tone ring.
GrizClaw - Posted - 04/14/2014: 19:38:55
quote:I plan to add one of your banjos to my small collection one day.....Rick
Originally posted by Helix
See how easy it is Rick, See how Janet doesn't comment, just chuckles. this, too is a message.
I am also thankful for the banjos I have turned loose, I'm a citzen, I own a trademark.
I will watch this with great interest. With my 2006 tone ring.
AntonLargiader - Posted - 04/27/2014: 07:18:37
Janet,
I've been reading up on the Goodtime line just to try to understand the changes that have been made over time. Here's what I have found. Can you add anything to this or maybe correct the order?
1996 introduced with the Gumby peg head.
At some point the Special was introduced with the Mastertone-style steel tone ring
At some point the tension hoop was made thicker
In 2008 all of them got the 3-ply pot ('3' stamped under the tailpiece for a while).
June 2009 fiddle peg head started phase-in
At some point the Classic was introduced with planetary tuners, spikes & dark stain
At some point the Midnight Special was introduced with planetary tuners (numbered on back of peg head).
At some point (late 2009?) the Crow version of the Goodtime & Goodtime 2 was introduced as part of a package.
In early 2010 the regular Special got the fiddle head and the new tone ring ('P' stamped under the tailpiece).
Late 2012 the Rare Bird Alert package came out (open back only?)
AntonLargiader - Posted - 04/27/2014: 11:45:50
Right. I also looked through the reviews and found some purchase dates that were much earlier than I had seen in the press. I wish I could edit my posts rather than write the list all over again, but the current list is:
- 1996 introduced with the Gumby peg head.
- 2001 or earlier the Special was introduced with the Mastertone-style steel tone ring
- 2001 or earlier, Goodtime 2 introduced.
- At some point the tension hoop was made thicker
- 2007 or earlier, Goodtime Special Classic but without planetary tuners
- June 2008 or earlier, Goodtime Classic with fiddle peghead (but without planetary tuners at first) instrumentalley.blogspot.com/s.../goodtime
- In 2008 all of them got the 3-ply pot ('3' stamped under the tailpiece for a while).
- June 2009 fiddle peg head started phase-in on the regular Goodtimes
- October 2009 Midnight Special (planetary, numbered on back of peg head) and plectrum bluegrasstoday.com/two-new-goo...e-banjos/
- At some point (late 2009 into 2011) the Crow version of the Goodtime & Goodtime 2 was introduced as part of a package.
- In early 2010 the regular Special got the fiddle head and the new tone ring ('P' stamped under the tailpiece).
- Late 2012 the Rare Bird Alert package came out (openback and reso) similar to the earlier Crow
- April 2013 Zombie Killer
BTW my intent isn't so much to catalog the different model introductions as it is to pin down what improvements exist and which models have them (or when they got them). For instance, if a GT Special has the new peg-head, it probably has the new tonering also and definitely has the 3-ply rim. Stuff like that. Sometimes they go hand in hand: a Zombie Killer automatically has the new rim simply because it was introduced afterward.
Edited by - AntonLargiader on 04/27/2014 12:02:32
Helix - Posted - 04/29/2014: 05:47:48
It's still ok to ask, it's not ok to defame someone who asks, this, too is a message. This isn't about big boys, it's about being coy (chuckle) with some one who asked, if you don't know, then it's ok to say you don' know, but if you don't know and you start with nonsense, then that, too is your creation. I never mentioned being squashed or pushed around, YOU did, and that's called a tell.
Turn the tables, if you were Linda Mansur, the creative one, and your husband was the organizer, or tag along, or whatever, we could never approach Linda because she's too busy, and some of his answers would sound shallow.
Wow pitchforks and what?
So here's to your success, taunting me about your 2010 tone ring, like hitting me over the head with it, has caused dents in your tone ring. Unwise responses require review.
As for Deering Banjos, I can't wait to get my hands on one.
Mad Jack Gallows - Posted - 04/29/2014: 17:07:37
According to Deerings patent application, I used THEIR vertical sided tone ring last year when I built my first banjo, knowing next to nothing. For them to attempt to patent something like a rolled flatbar tone ring is both laughable and sad. Whats next, a patent on the 11in. banjo rim? Something else folks have been using for ages? I am willing to bet I'm not the only one who will vow never to buy a Deering product just because of.... whatever the heck the motive behind this is. You couldn't GIVE me a Deering after learning of their patent application, and I am one of the BROKEST dudes any of yall probably know and will damn near play anything, hahaha. Anything other than a Deering that is...
Janet Deering - Posted - 04/30/2014: 06:02:26
A patent does not prevent you from building that idea for yourself. Our patent applies to very specific dimensions both of height and width in combination that makes the best tone in a rolled tone ring. It does not stop all rolled tone rings. It simply protects what we have discovered so that we can produce our sound that is uniquely special to Deering.
paulrobertwagner - Posted - 04/30/2014: 06:54:43
Janet, thanks for the clarification. Are there patents on other Deering tone rings? I know that many of them, like the Twenty Ten and Kruger tone rings are unique. Also, how many prototypes would Greg, Jens and Phil go through before they get the sound they're looking for?
Thanks for the good work you all do in Spring Valley!
dpete210 - Posted - 04/30/2014: 09:19:15
It is sad and unfortunate that some decide how to interpret things the way they want to interpret them, therefore arriving at an off-based conclusion or belief that is simply wrong. Short version: open mouth, insert both feet." It doesn't take much common sense to realize that the patent the Deerings are registering is not for the rolled ring per se, but for THEIR design/content of the ring they have produced. This discussion should be moot/done with simply by reading Janet's clarification, "Our patent applies to very specific dimensions both of height and width in combination that makes the best tone in a rolled tone ring. It does not stop all rolled tone rings. It simply protects what we have discovered so that we can produce our sound that is uniquely special to Deering."
If you were a builder, would you forego your rights and smile while someone takes what took you sweat, time, trial and error, and money to develop and then claim it as theirs without the protection of a patent?
Everyone is free to "discover" their own recipe for a rolled ring or tone ring. Go for it. Just keep in mind for those who don't want to accept reality that the design/content the Deerings have created belongs to them. May the conversation switch back to Deering banjos. 
sctoney - Posted - 04/30/2014: 09:55:42
Well said, dpete.
As I see it, this was a case of:
(1) "the sky is falling, the sky is falling......"
and
(2) Hubris (by the accusers): Hubris often indicates a loss of contact with reality and an overestimation of one's own competence (--this excerpt taken from Wikipedia)
Just an observation................
Now, as you said, let's switch back to conversations about Deering banjos!
Helix - Posted - 04/30/2014: 13:37:15
The discussion was about Deering all along, I notice how some questions got glazed over.
I'm sorry, Mad jack, as you read the circuitous patent, you'll see how these people feel they can defend their patent. Great.
Some of us are correct, speaking out seems to be troublesome to some. I'm not surprised to see that.
Back to the popcorn.
ildertongap - Posted - 04/30/2014: 15:21:15
Hi Janet
Have to say that I am very pleased with both my Deering banjos, a 2013 Calico and a 2013 Vega Senator (bought both from Greg at the Twelfth Fret in Toronto, Ontario, Canada). I think it is a good idea to patent the unique tone rings that you have developed, and are an integral part of your business plan. If the patent application meets the established criteria it should not be a problem for other builders who are looking to create instruments with their own unique sound. Keep up the great work!!
Geoff
bluegrassbanjopicker - Posted - 05/01/2014: 11:28:29
Dear Greg and Janet,
I have had the pleasure to play two Deering Bostons and a Deering openback(not sure what model it was) and I am proud to say you guys do excellent work there in California.
When did you first start building the Deering Banjosaurus?
Also, I am currently trying to finish a banjo project (my best actual handmade banjo) which I am trying as much as possible to be identical to the Deering Boston. I call my banjo the "Bostoneer."
I got the inspiration to do this after borrowing a fairly new Boston banjo from a friend, to play at a family reunion last year.
Thanks again for your service!
roadstar75 - Posted - 05/01/2014: 11:56:53
I'll bet it's probably possible to print out a banjo using new High tech 3D printers, it would be plastic and the sound might be lousy but by adding some parts like the head and brackets you are in the banjo business. That much power in one persons hands should be regulated, before you know it people everywhere will be printing banjos. Just me but if I wanted a banjo identical to a Deering, would probably just buy the real thing. Plus it's great to get this topic back on track, where ever that is going. We are now resuming banjo practice, back to plucking.
Richard
Calico owner
Janet Deering - Posted - 05/01/2014: 13:04:21
I'm currently in Shelby, NC at the first Five-String Fest where we are sponsoring the SE Bluegrass competition this weekend with the prize being a beautiful Terry Baucom banjo. Many great players are here.
Therefore my answers will be brief.
The recent patent we got for our 2010 tone ring design is our first tone ring patent. Greg made a dozen or more samples of various kinds before we settled on what works best.
He tried various materials as well as shapes. It was over several months so I lost count.
We made the Banjosaurus in the early 90's, it took several years to complete.
If your in the area I hope to see you at Five String Fest.
Janet Deering - Posted - 05/13/2014: 13:22:13
I'm back from Merlefest followed by Five-String Fest. Congratulations to Brandon Green who won First Place and selected the Terry Baucom Banjo in the SE Banjo Championships at Five-String Fest. There about 13 terrific players gathered for this tough competition. While this was a first year festival with a great line up we look forward to seeing it grow to something significant in the future.
psikes - Posted - 05/19/2014: 14:02:21
My word, you would think that Gibson, Vega, etc. never took out a patent on any of their work! What in the world could be wrong with a company patenting their intellectual design and property? If it does not infringe on another patent then it would seem to be the thing to do. If I designed and built something unique you can bet your boots that I would patent it for self preservation. Same with copywriting a song, I could care less who sang it, but I would sure like credit for my efforts. A proud Deering Golden Era owner as well as Nechville Saturn.
Phil
Helix - Posted - 05/20/2014: 14:50:18
Paul robert wagner up above has the right idea. The irony is that the Deering he plays has an earlier tone ring, and the Helix he plays has a new profiled one by Recording King, and that my friends is how the universe works it out.
Sorry, Janet to hurt your feelings, your answers weren't professional enough, we don't know how to reach Greg or Jens, those guys. No access.
The one thing I suggest: The Deerings recognize their workers, they can't do this alone. Gibson would never recognize anyone.
Bill Rickard in Canada needs to recognize his workers.
Geoff Stelling needs to recognize his workers.
Both Gold Tone and Recording King recognize their workers and the contribution they make. They make the banjos. Import partnerships are better than straight imports.
So how about Deering and the others you rub shoulders with? Wouldn't you like to sincerely thank a member of your team?
Edited by - Helix on 05/20/2014 14:51:16
Janet Deering - Posted - 05/20/2014: 16:13:59
It is sad and unfortunate that some decide how to interpret things the way they want to interpret them, therefore arriving at an off-based conclusion or belief that is simply wrong. Short version: open mouth, insert both feet." It doesn't take much common sense to realize that the patent the Deerings are registering is not for the rolled ring per se, but for THEIR design/content of the ring they have produced. This discussion should be moot/done with simply by reading Janet's clarification, "Our patent applies to very specific dimensions both of height and width in combination that makes the best tone in a rolled tone ring. It does not stop all rolled tone rings. It simply protects what we have discovered so that we can produce our sound that is uniquely special to Deering."
If you were a builder, would you forego your rights and smile while someone takes what took you sweat, time, trial and error, and money to develop and then claim it as theirs without the protection of a patent?
Everyone is free to "discover" their own recipe for a rolled ring or tone ring. Go for it. Just keep in mind for those who don't want to accept reality that the design/content the Deerings have created belongs to them. May the conversation switch back to Deering banjos.
Right, Pete. From my observation when a person comes up with a really good idea there are often others who object and try to make that person look bad, and the right thing to do is just carry on. We have lots of exciting projects in the wings. Greg is just now finishing putting together his new shop dedicated to Research and Development. He has a wonderful team of competent people working with him and so we will have lots of new and exciting banjo ideas to explore with a place to do the work. In the past we have had to work on things like this after hours. The coming years will be some of the most exciting years for all of us at Deering Banjos and for banjoists everywhere. Thanks for your encouragement.
sctoney - Posted - 05/20/2014: 16:45:18
Good grief Y'all. Janet has explained it all very well. GIVE IT A REST........GET OVER IT!
GrizClaw - Posted - 05/20/2014: 17:09:46
Janet and Greg...I've owned 3 Deering banjos and I've loved every one of them. I've also owned Bart Reiters, Enoch Tradesman, Gold Tones, etc. Deering banjos are my favorite. The more ignorant comments I read that are directed at you good people the more loyal I become....when funds permit I see an Eagle II in my future. Keep up the good work and just ignore those who can't say anything positive or recognize how much good you've done for the banjo world. Regards, Rick
Edited by - GrizClaw on 05/20/2014 17:10:51
Marcibb - Posted - 05/20/2014: 18:21:38
quote:
Originally posted by Montanarick
Janet and Greg...I've owned 3 Deering banjos and I've loved every one of them. I've also owned Bart Reiters, Enoch Tradesman, Gold Tones, etc. Deering banjos are my favorite. The more ignorant comments I read that are directed at you good people the more loyal I become....when funds permit I see an Eagle II in my future. Keep up the good work and just ignore those who can't say anything positive or recognize how much good you've done for the banjo world. Regards, Rick
I with you on that one rick.
Janet Deering - Posted - 05/27/2014: 14:51:37
When we began making Goodtime banjos seventeen years ago we intended to only make the Goodtime open back model. However with customer requests and our desire to please, we added more models and styles.
Today the Goodtime banjo selection has grown from one banjo to about 8 models in six styles which translates into 48 choices. Now, to bring it back to simplicity, we have created a new landing page:
goodtimebanjos.com
We hope newcomers to the banjo will find this easy to understand. Check it out and let me know if you have any suggestions.
OldCrook - Posted - 05/27/2014: 15:38:52
A longneck Goodtime would certainly justify yet another banjo purchase in my house. Can you do that without a truss rod? Thanks!!!!
Janet Deering - Posted - 05/27/2014: 16:34:31
I think it probably needs a truss rod. However, we don't have enough requests for a long neck to make it in a Goodtime model. If there were a whole lot more people wanting it, I'm sure we would figure it out.
psikes - Posted - 06/04/2014: 10:59:49
Janet, I love my Golden Era but the weight on my old arthritic shoulders does not love me anymore. Will the grandillo tone ring fir my pot or can one be made for it? Just wondering.
Thanks, Phil
pastorharry - Posted - 06/04/2014: 12:13:59
OldCrook-I believe the woodsongs long neck model by Deering would fill the bill for you. Look for a used one.
psikes-I asked the same question in a email to Deering, but unfortunately the expense was beyond what I could afford. They certainly can do it though.Shoot them an email for a quote...or better yet, sell the Era and get a Hartford.
Janet Deering-I have to say you have handled some rather rude posts from person/persons with obvious agendas other than simple questions or comments ,with dignity and respect....never loosing your cool....hats off to you. btw; my go to banjo now is a Boston long neck that I removed the resonator on and refitted an older standard intermediate neck to....it sounds unbelievable, steel pot....whodathunkit? God bless y'all, PH
Janet Deering - Posted - 06/04/2014: 16:22:15
Phil, Yes, we can convert your Golden Era to a grenadilllo tonering. Call Carolina Bridges at 800-845-7791 and she can get you a quote of the cost to do so. I do understand the challenge of the weight of a heavy banjo especially as you get older. I always say it's like lifting weights, it beats going to the gym, you just play more banjo!
Janet Deering - Posted - 06/04/2014: 16:34:20
Pastor Harry, Thank you. I'm glad that you are enjoying the sound of your banjo with the steel pot. Greg and I have had a special appreciation for the Boston banjos ( and the old Intermediate banjos) because they have a very special sound that we could always hear clear as a bell when we were walking up to a parking lot jam at the San Diego Bluegrass Club meetings. When Bill Paul played his banjo it never ceased to amaze us that we could hear him on his Intermediate banjo before we heard many of the other players on higher end banjos back in the '80s. As it has played out since that time, the B6 is the favorite go to banjo for Nashville studio musicians playing banjo on country music recordings. That steel pot makes a great sound for recording and it isn't as heavy as other banjos. While it isn't what people usually think a professional banjo should be, it sounds great. I agree, whodathunkit?
Baltimonkey - Posted - 06/04/2014: 19:41:57
I understand that this thread is for Deering enthusiasts. So, for those of you who may be interested... I have a Deering Jens Kruger w/ Swiss Tenbrooks ring for Sale/Trade. Click the $ to see the ad, and feel free to PM me with any questions. It's a great, top-of-the-line Deering.
Baltimonkey - Posted - 06/08/2014: 11:04:33
quote:
Originally posted by Baltimonkey
I understand that this thread is for Deering enthusiasts. So, for those of you who may be interested... I have a Deering Jens Kruger w/ Swiss Tenbrooks ring for Sale/Trade. Click the $ to see the ad, and feel free to PM me with any questions. It's a great, top-of-the-line Deering.
This banjo is in the process of being traded to an instrument dealer
Janet Deering - Posted - 06/09/2014: 11:49:10
It does look like paradise! There is no better way to spend the morning than playing music with someone you love.
copperbanjo - Posted - 06/09/2014: 12:34:31
The thing that surprises me while I've been shopping for my first banjo
is the fact that on any number of internet sites, and also most brick n mortar stores,
Deering products sell for much less than they are listed on Deering's own website.
roadstar75 - Posted - 06/09/2014: 13:02:55
That seems to be a fact. Discounted prices on dealer websites all seem to be fairly similar but once in a while you can snag a really good deal, or look at used. Finding a used Deering professional level like the Sierra and on up fall into fairly fixed levels also just a little lower. I bought a new Deering Banjo off Amazon and got a great deal (to me anyway). Your best bet I think for used is on here, unless one pops up locally on CL or E-Bay. Goodtime banjos are for sale everywhere.
Edited by - roadstar75 on 06/09/2014 13:03:38
Baltimonkey - Posted - 06/09/2014: 13:11:04
quote:
Originally posted by Baltimonkey
quote:
Originally posted by Baltimonkey
I understand that this thread is for Deering enthusiasts. So, for those of you who may be interested... I have a Deering Jens Kruger w/ Swiss Tenbrooks ring for Sale/Trade. Click the $ to see the ad, and feel free to PM me with any questions. It's a great, top-of-the-line Deering.
This banjo is in the process of being traded to an instrument dealer
Sorry gang... this trade fell apart at the last min (Dealer's banjo suddenly went up in price). So This Jens Kruger Banjo is back on the market for Sale or Trade.
sctoney - Posted - 06/09/2014: 13:20:07
The reason Deering's prices are higher than the dealer's prices is that they are protecting their dealers by not undercutting them. Very admirable of them. If Deering sold their banjos factory-direct at the same prices or lower than the dealers do, then they would be taking business away from their dealers, and the dealers would not be happy, and would probably drop the Deering line. I've seen it happen before in the products I dealt with I was still working. Bottom line: A good manufacturer sets up a good dealer network, works to keep them happy, then they both make money.
copperbanjo - Posted - 06/09/2014: 14:09:05
That makes perfect sense.
Now back to browsing the classifieds. :-)
starhopper - Posted - 06/13/2014: 05:45:33
Hey guys - I just purchased my fourth Deering - an "Eagle II" - got it brand new for $1500, which I consider a steal!
I have owned the Sierra, a Goodtime II (which I still have), and the beautiful Hartford (which I stupidly sold)!
I must say that the Eagle II is nearly as light as the Hartford, and yet has that bright Bluegrassy sound due to the new Twenty-Ten tone ring. I love it!
Now, all I need is a Deering Baseball cap and my collection is complete!
Lyle
copperbanjo - Posted - 06/13/2014: 06:42:16
Eagle 2 for $1500? I too consider that a steal.
Wish I could find that deal
starhopper - Posted - 06/13/2014: 07:08:09
quote:
Originally posted by copperbanjo
Eagle 2 for $1500? I too consider that a steal.
Wish I could find that deal
Yeah - It was sitting in my local music shop's banjo section with a $1500 price tag! Didn't take much convincing for me to decide to buy her! I thought it was a mistake!
Lyle
copperbanjo - Posted - 06/13/2014: 07:08:09
The eagle 2 is the banjo I have had my eye on. If I could find that deal I could buy it today. You are a lucky dog.
starhopper - Posted - 06/13/2014: 07:10:46
quote:
Originally posted by starhopper
quote:
Originally posted by copperbanjo
Eagle 2 for $1500? I too consider that a steal.
Wish I could find that deal
Yeah - It was sitting in my local music shop's banjo section with a $1500 price tag. Didn't take much convincing for me to decide to buy her - I thought it was a mistake!
Lyle
copperbanjo - Posted - 06/13/2014: 07:20:25
Maybe Janet will privately email me and match the price !!!
Yes I live in a fantasy world, ask my wife
starhopper - Posted - 06/13/2014: 07:43:46
quote:
Originally posted by copperbanjo
Maybe Janet will privately email me and match the price !!!
Yes I live in a fantasy world, ask my wife
Well, I was STUPID enough to sell my Hartford, so at least the deal on the Eagle II lets me sleep (a little) better at night!
paulrobertwagner - Posted - 06/13/2014: 11:19:30
quote:
Originally posted by starhopper
Hey guys - I just purchased my fourth Deering - an "Eagle II" - got it brand new for $1500, which I consider a steal!
I have owned the Sierra, a Goodtime II (which I still have), and the beautiful Hartford (which I stupidly sold)!
I must say that the Eagle II is nearly as light as the Hartford, and yet has that bright Bluegrassy sound due to the new Twenty-Ten tone ring. I love it!
Now, all I need is a Deering Baseball cap and my collection is complete!
Lyle
Lyle, I've got an Eagle II and Deering cap -- I say go for both, and post the pic!
Edited by - paulrobertwagner on 06/13/2014 11:21:02
starhopper - Posted - 06/13/2014: 11:43:44
Lyle, I've got an Eagle II and Deering cap -- I say go for both, and post the pic!
HA HA! Copy that!
Lyle
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