cockneybanjo - Posted - 11/15/2011:  00:00:08

I was at a session last night and someone came along with a Deering Vega Old Time Wonder, I've never seen one of these "in the wood" before and I was very impressed. Not cheap but not stupidly expensive either, and all the banjo you would ever need for most players.

banjoes - Posted - 11/15/2011:  04:09:39

Alternatively, vintage Little Wonder pots have always been somewhat undervalued and correspondingly under priced. They seem to go for $200 - $400 on Ebay with skin head if you're lucky and including tenor or mandolin neck usually with appropriate case. Hickler offers a very nice Vega style neck (to your scale, scoop, peghead choice, specification) requiring only final finish & tuners for $250 (last time I checked).

Even after shipping UK duty & tax & set up a personalised banjo with history and class for slightly less than the factory reproduction?

Just a thought.

spoonfed - Posted - 11/15/2011:  08:45:56

I believe that the Deering line of Vega banjos gets a very bad press here, they are too expensive, they are not real Vegas, those comments are posted here quite regularly by folks who dont own these instruments or play them ! I was in the market for an open back to sing with last year,I tried a number of good, and not so good instruments trying to keep an open mind all the while. One of those I tried was a 1920s Vega tubaphone pot with a repro neck, just about as sweet a sounding banjo as ever there was ! My needs however were for something a little more roadworthy  (I gig a lot !) adjustable truss rod and co rods are important when you cart your banjo from a steaming hot club to a freezing vehicle often ! The point is I bought the Deering Vega little wonder (no tone ring, more mellow sound ) I mic up at every gig so volume is academic to me, for the price I paid it is the sweetest banjo I own, and its improving with every gig it does. I am proud to be a fan of these instruments, they are great !

cockneybanjo - Posted - 11/15/2011:  09:02:38

Interesting question. If you pay $300 ( say ) for a pot and $250 for a neck, that's £600 ( at least ) shipped into UK. Add in say £80 for a set of tuners, which gives you a budget of £300-ish for final assembly, on the basis that Eagle Music sell them for £1,000, near enough.

banjo bill-e - Posted - 11/15/2011:  09:55:18

The only reason that I did not buy a Vega Little Wonder was because the dealer was such a rude jerk.
I really liked that little banjo. I like the regular Little Wonder better than the Old Time Wonder, but the main difference is just the Fiberskin head. I agree that they get bad press here, but they do have their charms. In the U.S. at least, street price is much better than the unrealistic "list price". I hate to see them badmouthed because they are sweet banjos.

Michael Smith - Posted - 11/15/2011:  10:05:03

I have a Deering Old Time Wonder and I love it. easy to play, nice mellow sound. it's the one I play at home 95% of the time. I have not owned the Little Wonder, but used to play one in a friend's store every time I went in and really liked the way that one played too.

spoonfed - Posted - 11/15/2011:  10:41:16

Yeah, right on ! lets hear it for Deering Vegas, one day I believe they will be seen as the great instruments they are in the same way that some of the Martin Vegas are now popular !

cockneybanjo - Posted - 11/15/2011:  11:10:10

interesting comment about "roadworthyness". I travel a great deal, all over the world and I have to say that my Gold Tone WL250 has been shown to be a seriously robust instrument.

H Kimball - Posted - 11/15/2011:  14:14:04

I own a Little Wonder, modified it with a fiberskyn head and no-knot tailpiece. Volume has not been a problem when I play with a group that includes two guitars and a fiddle. I like it and and have no plans to trade.  Its light weight is really nice too.  Don't look at the "internet suggested price", you can usually buy for less.  The frailin scoop on the OT Wonder is probably a good addition but you can play over the neck without one. 

maryzcox - Posted - 11/15/2011:  14:37:02

I once won a Deering Vega Old Time Wonder in a banjo contest and it was a wonderful old time banjo. It had lovely tone, it fingered well--was true all the way to the last fret. It had a beautiful old time sound and the gears were top of the line--so it stayed in tune well too. It was pretty too--in a basic, non flashy way. IMHO it is one of the most underrated old time banjos around.

Another, really nice underrated banjo is that latest Nechville--I think its called the Atlas? It breaks down for travel and it has beautiful tone and playability.

But--they get a bad rap in old time circles because they do not have the charisma of vintage banjos, or difficult to come by banjos--such as a Kyle Creed. 

But--they are really excellent banjos for the price--and in a hundred years or so--will be sought after as reliable, good sounding old time banjos :)

Best wishes,

Mary Z. Cox

maryzcox.com

erikforgod - Posted - 11/15/2011:  18:01:27

I think the Goodtime banjos are under estimated as well..

Although I will say I looked at the Deering Vegas...just a little beyond my financial reach but seemed like real nice banjos.

Edited by - erikforgod on 11/15/2011 18:05:11

japus - Posted - 11/15/2011:  20:25:17

I have an Old Time Wonder along with a Hartford.

If I had to choose between them I would take the Vega, however I do love the Hartford.

I put on nylgut strings on the Vega and that made a huge difference in the sound, I did not want a tone ring and the nylgut's give a nice mellow

but still great sound...

Davidprat - Posted - 11/16/2011:  12:13:18

I have played severañ Vega Old time wonder, nice banjo, really nice sound and easy to play, but the over priced, there are quite a few  banjo as good or better than the Vega for less money.

Emiel - Posted - 11/16/2011:  12:40:13

I once played a Deering Vega Oldtime Wonder and I liked it a lot. Very nice sound. The Deering Vega No. 2 Tubaphone I own is fantastic...

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 11/16/2011:  15:42:10

I find it very hard to recommend the Deering version of the Little Wonder (which does not have any tone ring and certainly does not have a Little Wonder tone ring) when the Enoch Tradesman is under 1000.

It is simple economics. The Deering Vegas I have played have been okay banjos, but the prices on them in music stores has meant I don't play them for more than a couple minutes.

majikgator - Posted - 11/16/2011:  17:44:41

I also don't know from a value perspective, i do like these banjos and unlike many i like Deering banjos in general other than their price tag, you can get a handmade instrument from a smaller luthier for about the same price. i think they are an attractive banjo, well made, great sound but very quiet along the lines or maybe even quieter than an Enoch Tradesman. If you are only playing with a trio or something you are probably OK though. Being that you are in the UK the Deering may be easier to get hold of than an Enoch a Reiter or a Ramsey. if not i would play any banjo by these three makers and then look at the Deering in that light, IMHO you might be happier with one of these but every banjo is different even if the same model, that's the nature of wooden string instruments, they aren't equal, similar maybe but not = .

maryzcox - Posted - 11/16/2011:  20:18:00

quote:

---

Originally posted by oldwoodchuckb

I find it very hard to recommend the Deering version of the Little Wonder (which does not have any tone ring and certainly does not have a Little Wonder tone ring) when the Enoch Tradesman is under 1000.

It is simple economics. The Deering Vegas I have played have been okay banjos, but the prices on them in music stores has meant I don't play them for more than a couple minutes.

---

 Come on. woodchuck, don't judge a banjo by the price--banjos are not a bag of carrots on sale at the market--or an energy efficient dishwasher--they are works of art and music.  For example, the Deering John Hartford is a little pricey--but it has a lot of  charisma--and hey--nobody else sells one at any price

It's like saying, "Why would anyone pay $200 to handknit a sweater out of NORO yarn when you can buy a perfectly good sweater at Goodwill for 2.00 to keep you warm? Its because Eisaku Noro is a once in a lifetime fiber artist and if an earthquake hits Aichi province in Japan--you will miss a once in a lifetime chance to feel and touch the silk and wool of a real artist.

The same applies to some of these banjos that seem overpriced. If no one buys them--then they may stop making them and then you will have lost your chance forever to play such a fine instrument.

I just love banjos :)

love ya,

Mary Z

maryzcox.com

AlpacaLips - Posted - 11/16/2011:  23:18:26

quote:

---

Originally posted by maryzcox

 Come on. woodchuck, don't judge a banjo by the price--banjos are not a bag of carrots on sale at the market--or an energy efficient dishwasher--they are works of art

---

Fine, don't judge the banjo by the price, but judge the price all you want. A banjo may be a work of art, but that doesn't make it priceless. Some paintings aren't worth a tube of red ochre. Deering makes good instruments, but they charge too much. The only reason I own one is because I found it used for 1/6 of what Deering asks, which is about 1/4 of the street price, and about 1/2 of what it's worth to me. (And that last figure is the only one that matters when it comes time to slap down the Benjamins.)

erikforgod - Posted - 11/17/2011:  04:44:26

I think Deering banjos are worth the price...hey if you like it and if it is what you are looking for, then its worth the extra money...

Davidprat - Posted - 11/17/2011:  06:39:48

Here in Europe the price for a  Deering Old time wonder is around 1300 euros, a few years ago I had the chance to play some in stores in USA and the price was around 1000 $, as it has been said before is a great banjo but there are quite a few banjos for less and as good as the Vega.I know as a maker that an instrument takes a lot of hour to be made, I can ask for an instrument the "real" price it would be too high, some instruments has something special but some high end factory made banjos are not more than a  banjo with some fancy inlay... And to make such a job with a CNC  doesn't take that much time...

spoonfed - Posted - 11/17/2011:  07:30:33

As regards to there being much better banjos available, that is a matter of opinion pure and simple ! for my purpose there is no other "woody" banjo better than the Deering Vega models under discussion here , that of course is also a matter of opinion, my opinion ! which is why I bought one. To hint that its not a real LW because it does not have a tone ring is also a nonsense. Deering own the Vega name for better or worse , and as such have the right to manufacture banjos sporting any name they choose ! If the banjo police could learn to live with change and development instead of hanging on to a mystical yesterday when everything was better they may just be surprised to learn that not everything must remain static in the world, (it cant be a Ford cos it aint black  and old Henry said..... !)

weetmans - Posted - 11/17/2011:  07:47:00

Hi, MaryZ,

I have an Atlas and I think it is wonderful. Quite a bit pricier than a Deering Vega, though. For the price I paid for the Atlas, I could get a real Vega Little Wonder, and have change for strings, etc.

majikgator - Posted - 11/17/2011:  08:21:26

A "woody" under discussion at a lower price is the Enoch Tradesman - listen here in multiple tunings and setups played by the brilliant Paul Brown, The last two tracks would probably be best for comparison, the Enoch Dobson model cost more of course (just 5 years ago the Tradesman went for $600 at Elderly) The No tone ring or loop or even wooden tone ring banjos to me have a very nice warm sound but lack volume. Unfortunately very few 11' Tradesman banjos were made. i believe the Enoch banjo would at least hold it's $value better at least in the range of the next decade or so, no telling what history will have to say but if you like the old time wonder better then don't listen to any of us buy the sucker, it's a great little banjo, great sound and well made, it'sa  banjo for the big boys for sure.

spoonfed - Posted - 11/17/2011:  08:21:34

I have a "real" vega little wonder ! mine was made last year.

amosrides - Posted - 11/17/2011:  11:17:35

I am just getting started, so by no means does my opinion count for much, but of all the banjos (in my range) I played at zepp's the OTW was my favorite. It had a much fuller and woody sound than the others I tried including some Tradsmans, but one was fret-less and both had nylguts, so I am sure that made a difference. No doubt it had fuller, woody tone than the Goodtimes, which I have seen some say it was equal just more expensive.

That being said, I'd really like a used Ramsey Woody or Reiter Round Peak.

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 11/17/2011:  12:17:46

Mary,

I should have explained that I prefer the sound and feel of the Tradesman too. I also find the Deering version of the little wonder too quiet for MY taste. I like some "woodys" - like my Lee and the Ramseys and to a lesser extent the Tradesman, so it is not strictly economics, although for the average single banjo player, the ability to be heard in a group can be pretty important too.

However when it comes to actually recommending banjos, my biggest recommendation for an intermediate level banjo (or above) is that the buyer should play every banjo he comes across and then buy the one that he likes, not the one someone recommends on the internet. We are all different and our ears are all different. My favourite banjo might be your useless junker. This is how I choose my instruments. Once you have the knowledge it takes to avoid the Banjo Shaped Objects out there, taste in sound and feel becomes important.

I think recommendations are only really vitally  important for beginner's instruments, where I am a solid member of the Deering Goodtime camp.

spoonfed - Posted - 11/17/2011:  13:05:40

I think the one thing that this thread really shows is how much choice there really is out in banjo land these days ! I started out 37 years ago playing guitar and you either had a nameless beater with action like a cheese grater that could quite literally draw blood, or you had wealthy folks who could buy you a Gibson or Fender, and I still have the scars ! to be able to buy a goodtime  or similar, for a fairly  modest outlay is only good news.

jhandsfield - Posted - 11/17/2011:  13:42:07

Given the changes in ownership of so many companies and the transfer of trade marks and trade names, it's hard to say that any mark is "real" or not real. I have had four Vegas and a Gibson over the years. IMO the quality of manufacture of the Vegas has never been better than in the Deering factory. Whether it has the sound you like is a different and highly subjective matter.

banjopaolo - Posted - 11/17/2011:  14:11:22

I always found deering banjos overpriced: I own a bacon peerless pot (same tonering of the little wonder) with a fantastic new neck by my friend Silvio Ferretti and paid for it less than a deering vega old time wonder, I also own two tenor (wich I mostly play) a 1929 Gibson Tb3 archtop 40 holes tone ring and paid for it around 2/3 the price of a new maple blossom and I own a vegaphone professional and paid much less than the new Vega Pro by Deering that has a really crazy price:
deeringbanjos.com/vega-profess...ret-tenor
that's something I can't really understand! But I must say that the same is for Ome or Stelling...
paolo

rhnewsome - Posted - 11/17/2011:  17:02:09

If the price of the Vega Little Wonder is too steep, I recommend that you take a look at the Deering Goodtime Classic. I bought a new one for less than $500 on Ebay just to have a light weight, open back, to practice on. Now I find that I play it almost all the time just because I love the sound. If you compare the construction to the Vega, you will find they are very similar.

When I need a louder banjo, I play my Deering Sierra that I converted to an open back. It has a bit crisper tone, but has good projection and sustain due to the tone ring.

I like both of them, but the Classic has more of the muted, old time tone.

RWJones1970 - Posted - 11/19/2011:  12:58:50

I bought a Vega Senator in Old Forge NY once for $1350 brand new. It was an excellent banjo and at that price I thought it was a bargain. I think the price may have gone up significantly since then and that's too bad. Deering makes a fine banjo but their prices are a bit high these days in my opinion. I would buy a Deering Vega Old Tyme Wonder if they made the neck a 23" short scale. I'm not interested in any longer length than that.

maryzcox - Posted - 12/01/2011:  21:02:56

quote:

---

Originally posted by amosrides

I am just getting started, so by no means does my opinion count for much, but of all the banjos (in my range) I played at zepp's the OTW was my favorite. It had a much fuller and woody sound than the others I tried including some Tradsmans, but one was fret-less and both had nylguts, so I am sure that made a difference. No doubt it had fuller, woody tone than the Goodtimes, which I have seen some say it was equal just more expensive.

That being said, I'd really like a used Ramsey Woody or Reiter Round Peak.

---