Thank you
This is VERY helpful ,Especialy the clear explanation of the Nashville system......Elwood
I heard Bill Evans and Bill Keith (On seperate occasions, not together) play a piece with someone harmonizing with them while they did it.... Both people played the melody. Can I assume that this is done in the following way.....
If Person A plays the melody in the Key of G, Then Person B Plays in the same song in the Key of B or D? That would be the Third and Fifth chords of that key.... How would one figure out how to do that on a banjo without a capo?
Does that question make sense?
No, you couldn't really harmonize a tune by playing the same tune in a key a third or fifth above. D has an extra sharp, C# and B has 5 sharps. You need to play a third or fifth above in the same key. So if the melody goes b - c - e - g your third would likely go d - e - g - b, say, and the fifth would probably be g - g - b - d. Well that's one way of harmonizing it anyway but all the notes are in the same key.
Usually you want to avoid parallel perfect fifths and octaves but not always.
j
I''d rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy.
Edited by - Joe Larson on 05/22/2008 08:02:33
quote:
Originally posted by mew0717
I heard Bill Evans and Bill Keith (On seperate occasions, not together) play a piece with someone harmonizing with them while they did it.... Both people played the melody. Can I assume that this is done in the following way.....
If Person A plays the melody in the Key of G, Then Person B Plays in the same song in the Key of B or D? That would be the Third and Fifth chords of that key.... How would one figure out how to do that on a banjo without a capo?
Does that question make sense?
Edited by - magnuscanis on 05/22/2008 08:30:14
[/quote]
Check out teoria.com. Go through all the material offered here at this site and you have a fairly comprehensive knowledge of music theory. Many of the questions you brought up are answered here and it is free.
Hope this helps
Have fun
Tom
[/quote]
Thank you for the link to the Teoria site. It is extremely helpful.
Leigh
I just copied and pasted your forum post into a Word Document for future reference!! Very helpful and clear! Thanks for all of your time and effort!
Ken Stevens
I apolgize ahead for being long winded, and hope I get some answers to my questions. I wanted to thank Texasbanjo personally for your time posting the information. It has helped me so much. I've played banjo for about 30 years now and consider myself to be a very good player. When working with new material I can usually pick out the notes and chord progression by ear. But, I've always been impressed by those who have the knowledge to find it when they can't hear it, or for whatever reason can't make sense out of it at the time.
A couple of years ago, I put down the banjo and took up the guitar for the primary purpose of learning fretboard logic and theory that I could someday apply to the banjo. One of the most popular writers of this information said the guitar was unique because of its tuning, which also allowed for connecting chord forms. He said this same logic could not be applied to another fretted instrument. When I tried to apply this to the banjo I attempted numerous diagrams to see if there was a pattern, and I wasn't able to do it. That is, until I went to banjohangout and saw this thread. WOW, do I feel stupid for not seeing it immediately, but the sky has definatetly opened up.
I found it yesterday and spent about 12 hours straight putting it into diagrams so I could see it, then playing it so my fingers could feel it and eventually my ears being able to hear it. I also found that all the chords in the circle fit the 3 banlo chords. For example, Em in the 1st circle is actually a D form played in the E chord position with the 3rd flatted. Simarly, the F# dim in the 3rd circle is a F form in the F# chord positon (one octave higher) and with the 3rd and 5th flatted. I didn't see this discussed anywhere on the thread. Maybe I missed it or it's taken for granted. Patterns make it so easy to find your way around the fretboard, i.e. notes, scales and chords. Why am I writing all this? If you can learn this simple exercise including learning the note names and sequence, you'll easily learn your fretboard. Again, notes, scales and chords.
I still have some questions and to keep it from getting confusing here, I'll be talking in the key of G. It seems to be agreed that the majority of bluegrass music is played in the Major mode, with the vii dim, F# dim and Bm seldom used. But, the F (i.e. Follow the Leader) and B (i.e. Dear Old Dixie) are often used??? Likewise, when the iim is played in the key of G, it's usually an A, not Am??? I thought it could be mixolydian mode which show the F and B chords as Major, but the D chord becomes a minor???
Another question. This thread stated a minor key (i.e. G) is a differant key than the major. If I'm playing a G scale/pattern and move this scale/pattern up the neck 3 semi-tones, am I now in the G minor scale, hence key of G minor? What is the differance between a relative and parallel minor?
Sherry,
This is an awesome post I have copied it and will print it out and try to digest all of the information. I just love this site and all the pickers willing to help beginners like myself.
Thanks
Randy
If you walk through the doors of life you won''t you get stuck looking at the same four walls.
Dear Tex,
You seem to be a theory expert.
Can you help me out?.
All of the notes in the score for FMB are licks submitted as 'picking style' to play over chords.(Mel Bay etc.)
A well known folk song that has the same chords as FMB sounds just like FMB when the banjo is played in the 'Scruggs style'.
Is the 'style' copyrightable????? Surely there is a difference between a Banjo PART and an original piece of music!!!!!?????
Xla.
Pick only the truth.
quote:
Originally posted by banjotech
I still have some questions and to keep it from getting confusing here, I'll be talking in the key of G. It seems to be agreed that the majority of bluegrass music is played in the Major mode, with the vii dim, F# dim and Bm seldom used. But, the F (i.e. Follow the Leader) and B (i.e. Dear Old Dixie) are often used??? Likewise, when the iim is played in the key of G, it's usually an A, not Am??? I thought it could be mixolydian mode which show the F and B chords as Major, but the D chord becomes a minor???
Another question. This thread stated a minor key (i.e. G) is a differant key than the major. If I'm playing a G scale/pattern and move this scale/pattern up the neck 3 semi-tones, am I now in the G minor scale, hence key of G minor? What is the differance between a relative and parallel minor?
Edited by - gjt1028 on 11/26/2008 06:54:16
quote:
Originally posted by Texasbanjo
Several people have asked if I would post my Begnning Banjo Theory lessons somewhere easy to access (so they wouldn't have to contact me off line).
Here's the entire booklet -- feel free to copy and use it as you wish.
Texas Banjo
I can't find the link to the PDF file. Is it still available?
Cliff Hebert
This is really helpful but not easy on the eyes.
Excellent intro to music theory.It ought to be printed on the head of every beginner banjo. When I started playing I only knew two things for sure. The key and the starting note.
Johnboy109
Say, is it just me, or is there no VOL I #4?
thanks
Let me ask if I have this figured out. A major scale has a pattern such as: C tone D tone E semitone F tone G tone A tone B
semitone C where a tone is the equivalent of 2 frets, a semitone is 1 fret. That was a C-major scale and no notes are said to be sharp or flat by a semitone.
Now, if I want to use the key of G major and start with the note 'G', then the F has to go sharp by one fret to fit the pattern of tone steps.
How am I doing?
We do not know where we are going.
Nor do most of us care.
For us, it is enough that we are on our way.
Le Matelot
You're doing just fine. If you're working on major scales, the "pattern" is: whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half (notes or frets, that is). You can figure out any MAJOR scale using that pattern.
If you want to figure out a D scale, you'll do the same thing and have 2 sharps: F# and C#, an A scale will have 3 and so on.
Let''s Pick!
Texas Banjo
Nicely done, and easy to understand. Thanks for sharing!
Terry the Banjo Gal
I understand the scale stuff (memorizing though is another story) but if Im trying to play a song along with a cd or with other people and I dont know what the chords are what is a guy suppose to do.I usually watch the guitar player I know all of the basic major chords on the guitar and the banjo lets say a song is in G what is the theory behind what chords are next is it like a chord with the 1rst 3rd and 5th notes of the scale to make the chord or is there some other formula for figuring this out.Also I dont understand why the sharp notes are put in the scales instead of the major note.Im lost at theory.
quote:
Originally posted by Texasbanjo
Let's see if I can define those words for you:
Scale: a group of 8 notes starting on the "root" note and ending one octave above the "root"note; i.e., if the "root" note is G, the scale would be G,A, B, C, D, E, F# and the G. If the scale was C, the notes would be C, D, E, F, G, A, B, and again, C. and so on.
Key: The "key" that the song is played in; i.e., in the key of G or the key of C or D or whatever key needs to be used to get the sound you want. In the Key of G, you will find different chords: G, B, D major chords, Am, Em and very seldom in bluegrass, F#dim.
Tuning: how the instrument is tuned string by string; i.e., the bluegrass banjo is tuned in open G: from the 1st to the 5th string: D, B, G, D, g. There are other tunings such as D tuning or various and sundry tunings for the old time or clawhammer type music.
Chord: A group of at least 3 notes making a major or minor chord. On a major chord you have the 1st, 3rd and 5th note of the "scale" that the chord is in; i.e., if you have a G chord, the notes would be G, B, D (and any of those inversions, D, B, G, B, or B, D, G, etc). A C chord would be C,E,G. A D chord would be D, F#, A and so on.
Does that help?
Let's Pick!
Texas Banjo
Edited by - DENNISNDODIE on 03/19/2009 14:57:14
I think the next thread should be "ear training 101"
Can anyone listen to a song once and pick out the harmonic movement?
Oh, yes, it's easy to listen to a song and pick out the notes and figure out the melody and then get the harmony. It just takes time, effort and practice and listening to songs over and over until you get your ear trained.
Somewhere on the Hangout I have several threads about ear training. You might want to use the search function to find them.
Let''s Pick!
Texas Banjo
It may be easy for some but not for me.Ive been playing banjo and guitar for over 20 yrs.Ive listen to thousands of hours of bluegrass music.I still cant figure out what key a song is in and what chords to play and chord changes within a tune.If I see someone play it or if I read/see it in a song book I can figure it out but just by listening to a song and knowing what key it is in and what chords are in it.I cant do it. I guess that is called talent and Im lacking in that area.I have learnt recently the I IV V theory now if I can learn when the odd chord is in a tune or how to listen to a tune and know the key it is in. I will have made some progress.
I''ve been sittin'' here thinkin'' back over my life
All of the good things the trouble and strife
Well my share of heartache yes so many I''ve had
But I still think the good things outweigh the bad
Well I''ve rocked my babies at night when they cried
I''ve seen the teardrops turn into smiles
And that''s when I realize all the bad luck I''ve had
And I know all the good things outweigh the bad
Well I never have riches no money to spare
Just a sharecropper''s wages is my only fare
Yes makin'' my livin'' just working the land
But I still think the good things outweigh the bad
Well I''ve rocked my babies...
Yes I''ve worked the cotton in the heat of the day
And then paid the landlord nearly all that I made
Well I''ve seen high water take all that I had
But I still think the good things outweigh the bad
Well I''ve rocked my babies...
Edited by - DENNISNDODIE on 03/24/2009 05:04:26
Start out with a song you know and know well. Listen to it and strum a chord -- any chord, at the first of the song to see if that's the key. Start off with G. If that doesn't sound right, barre to A and B and C and D and E and F. One of those chords will sound right at the first of the song. When you find that chord, that's normally the key the song is in (there are exceptions, but as a general rule, that's the key signature.) Now, if you know the key, you know the major chords. Let's say the key is G -- the major chords are G, C and D. The Minor chords are Am, Bm and Em. Normally yo'll use the G, C, D with perhaps an Em or an Am as the "off chords". Occasionally you'll have a Bm.
Works the same in any key. In the key of D the major chords are D, G, A and the minors are Em, F#m, Bm, C#m -- or, if that's confusing, the major chords are I, IV, V and the minors chords are ii, ii and vi.
I digress.
After you've found the chords to the song, write them down:
G, G, G, G,
C, C, C, C,
D, D, D, D,
G, G, G, G
or whatever the pattern is.
From that you can start trying to pick out JUST the MELODY notes. After you've done that, then you can incorporate those notes into rolls and later on put in slides, hammers, pulls, licks, etc.
Start slow with a song you know the tune to and in the key of G -- work from there. It'll happen.
If you can go to jams, that'll help your "ear training" more than about anything else. Learn a few guitar chords and watch the rhythm guitar picker. When he changes chords, so do you. Eventually you'll begin to "feel" the change and then you'll know it's coming and what it is.
Let''s Pick!
Texas Banjo
