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Originally posted by Old Hickory

And does simply being unaware of or uninterested in something the same as choosing not to engage with it? To what extent is American mountain music part of my cultural heritage? I believe a stronger case can be made for no than yes. My family has only been in this region since WWII. And wasn't in America for very long before that.

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If you identify as American then you inherit all aspects of American cultural heritage. 
Our cultural heritage is not defined by or limited to our own lived personal experience. It is the totality of ideas, institutions, and creative legacy of our nation's cultural history. A migrant will likely feel a relationship to both the heritage of their country of origin and their new naturalised country. It's why naturalisation tests the cultural knowledge of applicants.

So, yes it's very clear cut; Appalachian music is a part of your cultural heritage. That heritage is present whether or not a person engages with it or is even aware of it. In that sense knowledge is everything. Otherwise we can unwittingly live as paupers in a palace.

"If you identify as American then you inherit all aspects of American cultural heritage. 
Our cultural heritage is not defined by or limited to our own lived personal experience. It is the totality of ideas, institutions, and creative legacy of our nation's cultural history."

!!??

That's quite a declaration and imposition!   Has the latest buzzwords -- "Identify"  "Inherit"  "Totality"  "Creative legacy"

But the question is, is is true?

Not in my observation.  There are many "cultures" because of the many types of immigrants compared to the relatively short duration of existence of the United States as a sovereign nation.  This is unlike European, Mediterranean, and Asian countries, where the quoted statement may have some validity.  The cultures in the U.S. fit together, but they are not unified. 

I think it would be difficult to find 10 people in the U.S. who would agree with the quoted statement.



If the assertion is:  "Everybody accepts every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then there should be some evidence.  

If the assertion is:  "Everybody ought to accept every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then that's just an opinion, not a fact.

We only know what we know.
Was someone disrespectful?

Alex:  If the assertion is:  "Everybody accepts every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then there should be some evidence.  
If the assertion is:  "Everybody ought to accept every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then that's just an opinion, not a fact.

I'm no expert, but what if the assertion is [should be?] simply that every cultural aspect in the U.S. exists?  

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Originally posted by EEB
If you identify as American then you inherit all aspects of American cultural heritage. 

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So post-church Sunday ham is part of my cultural heritage?

-  -  -  -  -

And are you aware of how big the U.S. is and how different are its many regional and local cultures that developed independently?

It's a stretch to say that by being born here 75 years ago I inherit "all aspects of American culture" seeing as that includes regions as culturally varied as the Blue Ridge, New Orleans, Chicago, the plains, East Texas, New England, the Spanish-influenced Southwest. I could go on. But why?

The lobsters didn't care what I knew about foreign music.

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Originally posted by Alex Z

"If you identify as American then you inherit all aspects of American cultural heritage. 
Our cultural heritage is not defined by or limited to our own lived personal experience. It is the totality of ideas, institutions, and creative legacy of our nation's cultural history."

!!??

That's quite a declaration and imposition!   Has the latest buzzwords -- "Identify"  "Inherit"  "Totality"  "Creative legacy"

But the question is, is is true?

Not in my observation.  There are many "cultures" because of the many types of immigrants compared to the relatively short duration of existence of the United States as a sovereign nation.  This is unlike European, Mediterranean, and Asian countries, where the quoted statement may have some validity.  The cultures in the U.S. fit together, but they are not unified. 

I think it would be difficult to find 10 people in the U.S. who would agree with the quoted statement.



If the assertion is:  "Everybody accepts every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then there should be some evidence.  

If the assertion is:  "Everybody ought to accept every cultural aspect in the U.S.," then that's just an opinion, not a fact.

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This Irish heritage website does a good job of outlining the nature of cultural heritage:

https://www.heritagecouncil.ie/about/what-is-heritage

I'm stunned that you react as if this is a massive new imposition that you are required to give your involuntary consent. The good news is that you can relax and continue exactly as you were. Nothing happened! 

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Originally posted by Old Hickory

quote:

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Originally posted by EEB
If you identify as American then you inherit all aspects of American cultural heritage. 

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So post-church Sunday ham is part of my cultural heritage?

-  -  -  -  -

And are you aware of how big the U.S. is and how different are its many regional and local cultures that developed independently?

It's a stretch to say that by being born here 75 years ago I inherit "all aspects of American culture" seeing as that includes regions as culturally varied as the Blue Ridge, New Orleans, Chicago, the plains, East Texas, New England, the Spanish-influenced Southwest. I could go on. But why?

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Of course. Cultural heritage is the totality and that includes regional cultures. 
I have visited various parts of the U.S. though mostly NC, VA, WV and TN in relation to music. But regional cultures exist in every country and are not dependent on scale. Here in the U.K. you can travel 50 miles and observe distinct changes in older housing related to regional building material and method. I still use a an old billhook in my garden (yard); there are regional patterns of billhook blade shape that will tell me which part of the U.K. they were forged. Hedging method used to vary by English county. The detail is endless and beautiful...and all part of our cultural heritage.

Cultural heritage helps form our identity; the sense of who we are. 
 

Lord help me…someone. Anyone! Lol.

There are still schools in the U.S. right? (joking)

after you get past earl it does kinda get confusing ,,,, just pick your favorite and run with it. after all we all are different ya know !

EEB,

You're a good writer and a good debater.  You are overusing the rhetorical debate technique of making an assertion or declaration and then treating that statement as a fact that the opposing party is supposed to respond to.   I'm not falling for it.

This could go on forever.  

Mr. banjoboyd  likely has all he needs for his upcoming class, I hope the students enjoy it.

I'm outta here.

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Originally posted by Alex Z

EEB,

You're a good writer and a good debater.  You are overusing the rhetorical debate technique of making an assertion or declaration and then treating that statement as a fact that the opposing party is supposed to respond to.   I'm not falling for it.

This could go on forever.  

Mr. banjoboyd  likely has all he needs for his upcoming class, I hope the students enjoy it.

I'm outta here.

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Alex, if cultural heritage was an opinion or an assertion you'd have a point. But it isn't. I'm not kidding you or trying to get you to 'fall for' some weird idea. Really. Cultural heritage is just a common term for our history; the past that we inherit. It's just a presence like oxygen and sunshine.

You celebrate July 4th and could probably reel off names of baseball players that were your heroes when you were a kid? Those are just a part of your cultural heritage. Unique to Americans.

I don't celebrate either of those; I have a cultural heritage that is unique to my being English. That doesn't prevent me watching a July 4th parade while on vacation, or liking baseball or 'old-time' music (which I do). But those two examples remain part of American cultural heritage - not mine. I can only ever be an interested outsider. 

Did you look at the link I posted above? If you think my motive is 'suspicious', read the basic explanation on that official national body website.

:-)

This is a (potentially) productive discussion to have, but it is really outside the bounds of this particular thread. I don't expect any one person to be knowledgeable about every bit of banjo playing that has ever been recorded. So while I encourage people to think a bit critically about why they would suggest a particular recording over some other (in terms of pedagogical value, not just "it's a really good album"), people are ultimately referencing their own experiences as players and listeners, so there is inevitably overlap there.

@EBB what would be helpful for me at this stage is a handful of specific and readily available (i.e. digitized and ideally public) recordings that would give students some idea of banjo playing across different English contexts. I am really not in the position to randomly peruse archives, because of time constraints but more importantly because I don't necessarily know what I'm looking for to begin with (hence this thread)!

In response to Alex Z, again, I hesitate to set out a list of categories because it depends in part on how the course materials wind up being organized, and that depends in part on the amount and diversity of material. And there will inevitably be a disalignment between A) recorded material, B) scholarly writing, and C) everything else available on any given topic. For example, there is quite a bit of B when it comes to mid-19th century banjo, but no A (commercial recording didn't exist yet). When it comes to the banjo in trad/New Orleans jazz, there is a good amount of A but (as far as I can see) almost no B. Go figure. So the playlist will never be truly representative, and it will be more useful for some parts of the course than for others.

I think every curriculum has some inherent bias, inherent constraints and I think that's okay. Maybe even declaring a bias, or a truncated focus is the right way to go, if you can identify it. Trying to present an exhaustive study of the whole gamut of banjo history in one course is a tall order. You might even have to make decisions based on the level of engagement that you expect to come from your students on a particular topic.

Sounds like a great course - good luck!

My cultural heritage is right here which is where I grew up.
Countless generations of Mic Mac (and other tribes) Indians.Dad's Grandmother was full-blooded.
We have a Davis Island and Davis Strait on the chart.
I worked on boats for 50 years catching seafood in various ways.

I could open a north window in our home and throw a rock into the ocean.
I could open a south window in our home and throw a rock into the ocean.

Lots of music surrounding the Port Clyde General Store with my Grandmother 25 steps from our house and she was a very talented player of guitar,banjo,pump organ,piano and accordion and could sing trio and quartet harmonies.
She encouraged her 4 kids to play and sing and Dad and my uncles and aunts were excellent musicians and singers.And their kids...my cousins and of course my brother and sister.
Sis took a liking to Dad's pedal steel along with playing clarinet and sax.
Brother was "All-State" clarinetist 3 years.
Mom taught piano and played all the popular country songs as Dad and I played along with pedal steel,banjo and guitar.

Played 3 hours at the S,P,and Steam Museum today sitting beside my old pal from the Katahdin Valley Boys and his powerful D-35.He also builds fiddles.

Tomorrow night's jam at the Wiley's Corner Grange Hall is one of my faves soon to be replaced for the winter at the Camden American Legion which will go well into the winter.

I've got all the cultural immersion I can stand just staying home,along with my 1895 Brunswick "Novelty" 9 footer and Ollie Briggs 12 cue rack.I'm wicked into the cultural connection between old pool equipment and present-day shooting.

But that's just me.

Best of luck,EEB.

Don Reno - fastest five strings alive LP. Even beats my ultimate hero Ralph Stanley.....

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Originally posted by Ralph Stanley legend

Don Reno - fastest five strings alive LP. Even beats my ultimate hero Ralph Stanley.....

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One of my favorites, too.  I worked up a bunch of the tunes by slowing the turntable down to 16.  Our culture lost a lot when we all went digital!  

Ethan’s request could unleash a whirlwind of names within the small (though not *that* small) world of the four-string banjo. It is nearly impossible to list all the great—and truly legendary—banjoists who have been active from the early 20th century to the present day. We all have our own idols, possessing widely varying musical personalities and styles ranging from ragtime to classical music. Going against the grain, I would like to mention the player who is perhaps the least technically virtuosic and the least appreciated by fans: Lawrence Marrero. He provided accompaniment using basic, simple chords—much like his rare solos—and was anything but a virtuoso. Yet, he remains a key figure in the "New Orleans Revival" style. Countless jazz musicians in this genre would love to be accompanied by him—or by someone who emulates him. His technique favors simplicity, but his rhythmic consistency is simply exceptional—and, I believe, difficult to imitate.