Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/04/2012:  14:17:32

In early 2011, with no banjo experience or interest in particular, I stumbled upon the J. Romero Banjo Company web site and caught a bug. I became consumed with openback banjo design and construction until this banjo finally popped out this weekend. There's still much to do, but I can't wait any longer. I'm proud to post my new slotted peghead banjo in the white for my builder friends to check out.

Here are the specs:

• 
  12" birch block rim with figured maple veneer and Koa cap


• 
  Honduran Rosewood tone ring (I first saw the overhang from uncle.fogey's Black Locust rim here and liked it)


• 
  25.7" scale five-long figured maple neck. It's bolted on at the moment, but I plan to make a coordinator rod from leftover neck wood.


• 
  
  
  custom brass brackets, inspired by J. Romero Banjos, generously machined by my father-in-law on a wire machine
  
  


• 
  
  
  slotted peghead with individual slots and through holes, generously designed by Nick Hendrix of Soulrender Guitars
  
  


• 
  
  
  shopmade brass tension hoop, another J. Romero Banjos design I couldn't live without, generously rolled and brazed by a family friend
  
  


• 
  
  
  Rickard brass hooks, nuts, and No-Knot tailpiece
  
  


• 
  
  
  calfskin head (Rickard)
  
  


• 
  
  
  photos by my dad
  
  

Builder's medley

blockader - Posted - 11/04/2012:  14:24:39

Very nice.

Harry - Posted - 11/04/2012:  15:17:02

Why do I like this, I'm not even an old-time player .

Why do I hate this? This is your first attempt?

Well, anyway, great job!!!

beegee - Posted - 11/04/2012:  15:17:27

It has a very clean, classic look, understated elegance.

Knuckled Under - Posted - 11/04/2012:  15:18:35

Looks great! I can understand the bug!

R. Blakeslee Gilpin - Posted - 11/04/2012:  15:46:24

Shawn - I've been waiting to see how this turned out! The hardware, pot, etc. all look fantastic. I'm not crazy about the headstock myself but hey, that's why it's your banjo! Awesome job and sounds great too. Can't wait to see #2...

BNJOMAKR - Posted - 11/04/2012:  15:54:02

Good looking craftsmanship!  

aeroweenie - Posted - 11/04/2012:  18:35:12

Well done, fantastic for a first banjo!

Dan Drabek - Posted - 11/04/2012:  19:03:40

An interesting and pleasing design. Nicely built.

DD

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/05/2012:  09:04:25

Thanks for the kind words, everyone. I have some ideas for #2, but I'll try to stay focused and finish this one, first.

dickinnorwich - Posted - 11/05/2012:  11:26:15

Excellent job. You should be very proud.....and the banjo is nice, too.

ronwalker49 - Posted - 11/05/2012:  11:44:23

extra nice..

rudy - Posted - 11/05/2012:  17:35:15

Shawn, Wow!

You’ve obviously put a lot of thought into the genesis of this design. It’s good to borrow from many influences and then add your own spin, it’s how we progress as a community of builders.

I’d hate to think that current builders would still be locked into a dominance of tack head minstrel-influenced designs, which would have been the case if makers from 100 years ago stubbornly resisted any modification in existing design.  (Think all the “pre-war” protagonists and their solid resistance to any instrument design that Earl didn't play, IMHO it's a sure-fire way to ensure banjos of becoming irrelevant to any future roll in the culture of progressive musical trends... )  It’s great that the open back builders of present give a nod of respect to designs of the past, but it’s also good to recognize that boundaries are meant to be challenged.  Your third string path and tuner location are a Case in point and certainly unique, the only concern for me would be the sharp angle up to the nut.  That may or may not create problems for you in regard to tuning, time will tell.  It’s great that you have such a supportive family and friends in your new-found obsession.  Building an entire instrument is a daunting task to say the least, and it’s always a plus when you have family and friends that become so actively involved, right down to the great photo work!

It’s very difficult when you get to the “in the white” stage, especially when the first dulcet tones spring forth from your creation.  I’ve got a new slot head tunneled fifth 12” that I like so much that it’s out doing paid gigging with me until I get the next one with a 11” pot done.  Only THEN I’ll be able to tear it down for finishing. 

Congratulations on a job well done. 

RG - Posted - 11/05/2012:  18:47:05

Nice job and a good looking banjo, always fun to play something you made...

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/05/2012:  19:17:53

Dick, you make a fine point. I also helped make a second daughter during the banjo craze. The older sister actually asked to play the banjo, so she had my heart captured at that particular moment.

Rudy, thanks a lot. Your thoughtful comments mean a whole lot. As I mentioned, it all started with Romero, a builder who is great at preserving great old designs while also moving them forward. I started with his personal banjo as the baseline looked around at the designs of other modern builders (many from Craig Evans' excellent series) and ideas here on the Hangout. I even drew inspiration from Bob Benedetto and a few other archtop guitar builders (thus the Koa trim). The peghead arose from conversations with Nick in trying to find a tunneled fifth string design that was pleasing to me personally. He drew this up in 3D and I locked onto it. So far the third string is tuning ok, but yes, it is steep. Don't ask me how I managed to lock the string. I'm sure I'll wonder if it's possible every time I attempt it.

Finishing could be a problem! But frankly I needed this evaluation phase to check out some playability concerns (head deflection, neck angle, action, neck feel, etc), so eventually I will need to tear it down, address some of those, add the coordinator rod, and finish it. At the same time I can't wait to see the grain light up under finish, so that drives as well.

You make a good point about support. It's been immensely satisfying to talk through and work on various parts of the project with folks close to me. My wife may have jokingly coined the phrase "banjo widow" at some point, but she and the girls have been very encouraging throughout, as well. There's nothing like a three-year-old telling you, "Wow, it's beautiful!" or "Pretty good! Pretty good banjo!" to keep you going.

rudy - Posted - 11/05/2012:  19:52:26

quote:

---

Originally posted by Shawn Hoover

Dick, you make a fine point. I also helped make a second daughter during the banjo craze. The older sister actually asked to play the banjo, so she had my heart captured at that particular moment.

Rudy, thanks a lot. Your thoughtful comments mean a whole lot. As I mentioned, it all started with Romero, a builder who is great at preserving great old designs while also moving them forward. I started with his personal banjo as the baseline looked around at the designs of other modern builders (many from Craig Evans' excellent series) and ideas here on the Hangout. I even drew inspiration from Bob Benedetto and a few other archtop guitar builders (thus the Koa trim). The peghead arose from conversations with Nick in trying to find a tunneled fifth string design that was pleasing to me personally. He drew this up in 3D and I locked onto it. So far the third string is tuning ok, but yes, it is steep.

 Don't ask me how I managed to lock the string. I'm sure I'll wonder if it's possible every time I attempt it.

Finishing could be a problem! But frankly I needed this evaluation phase to check out some playability concerns (head deflection, neck angle, action, neck feel, etc), so eventually I will need to tear it down, address some of those, add the coordinator rod, and finish it. At the same time I can't wait to see the grain light up under finish, so that drives as well.

You make a good point about support. It's been immensely satisfying to talk through and work on various parts of the project with folks close to me. My wife may have jokingly coined the phrase "banjo widow" at some point, but she and the girls have been very encouraging throughout, as well. There's nothing like a three-year-old telling you, "Wow, it's beautiful!" or "Pretty good! Pretty good banjo!" to keep you going.

---

 Yup, that's exactly why I do the in-the-white stage, too.

On a related note, I recently bought a slot head 12 fret 000 guitar and I was also concerned about the ease of locking the string.  After some research I found that many slot head owners don't lock at all, they cut the string 2 inches longer than the length to the post and bend a sharp 90 degree angle in the last 3/8"-1/2" of string before sticking it through the post hole.  It turns out they were 100% correct, no lock necessary, no slipping, and the string comes off easily if a rapid change is needed.  I hate trying to unlock a string in a dark bar!  My slot head banjos are doing just fine using the same technique.  I would have never guessed,as I've been doing a string lock on all my instruments for somewhere in the neighborhood of 40 years.  you're never too old to learn!

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/05/2012:  21:08:20

quote:

---

Originally posted by rudy

On a related note, I recently bought a slot head 12 fret 000 guitar and I was also concerned about the ease of locking the string.  After some research I found that many slot head owners don't lock at all, they cut the string 2 inches longer than the length to the post and bend a sharp 90 degree angle in the last 3/8"-1/2" of string before sticking it through the post hole.  It turns out they were 100% correct, no lock necessary, no slipping, and the string comes off easily if a rapid change is needed.  I hate trying to unlock a string in a dark bar!  My slot head banjos are doing just fine using the same technique.  I would have never guessed,as I've been doing a string lock on all my instruments for somewhere in the neighborhood of 40 years.  you're never too old to learn!

---

Excellent. That's what I'll do next time. In fact, I'm pondering a new design in which all five slots are open only to the bottom, like the third string slot on this one, and I knew I couldn't even attempt it without a simple stringing technique. I was hoping there was an answer out there, and this might be it.

HolyGrass - Posted - 11/06/2012:  15:00:33

wow, that thing looks great! And especially great for your first build; you put my first attempt to a deep, deep shame.

I like the funky headstock; my main player has a tunneled fifth string. Does the tuner protrude into your hand sometimes?

The brackets are also super cool. i've been trying to figure out how to make something similar, but haven't stumbled upon anything yet

Waltj - Posted - 11/06/2012:  15:57:56

Great job! Thanks for sharing.

Walt

Waltj - Posted - 11/06/2012:  15:58:54

Great job! Thanks for sharing.

Walt

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/06/2012:  18:11:34

quote:

---

Originally posted by HolyGrass

wow, that thing looks great! And especially great for your first build; you put my first attempt to a deep, deep shame.



I like the funky headstock; my main player has a tunneled fifth string. Does the tuner protrude into your hand sometimes?



The brackets are also super cool. i've been trying to figure out how to make something similar, but haven't stumbled upon anything yet

---

Thanks for the kind words. Hey, there's no shame around here! Sometimes I wonder why I couldn't do something simpler and maybe complete two or three simpler instruments in the same time, but this is how I had to go.

I've had no trouble with the tuner. I initially envisioned the third string bump as a form of volute, but it turns out the way the neck shaft blends to the headstock acts sufficiently as a handstop so I don't even hit that bump, let alone the tuner.

Romero's brackets are cast. Mine were essentially cut in 2D from bar stock on an accurate machine. To do it by hand would be challenging. I'm not sure if I'd be up for it myself. I would refer you to rudy's several bracket fabrication guides and suggest perhaps making a jig that somehow pushes the bracket straight into a sanding drum of the correct radius to flatten the back and round out the J.

Dave1climber - Posted - 11/07/2012:  05:25:07

Very nice clean lines, elegant simplicity. When you have the finish on, please post photo's.  Do you have some woodworking skills from before this project?

Dave

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/07/2012:  07:10:02

Thank you. I have a fairly useless shelf in my shop that I made in 8th grade. I think we sold the clock at a garage sale. Other than that I did my research and went very slow.

Greg Galbreath - Posted - 11/07/2012:  08:46:12

Great looking banjo! The peghead design is super cool. It looks like you have the right approach in going slow, working out your designs in advance and doing your research. I can't wait to see what else you come up with in the future.
Greg

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/07/2012:  11:47:32

Thanks, Greg! I spent a lot of time staring at the beautiful banjos on your web site and watched your interview with Craig more than once. Nick was tempting me to integrate a backstrap into the design (yours are so impressive), but I had to draw the line right there.

Greg Galbreath - Posted - 11/08/2012:  07:06:18

Thanks Shawn! - Yeah, backstraps are pretty tough. I still don't feel like I have them completely figured out, although they are amazing looking when they do work out.
Greg

blockader - Posted - 11/08/2012:  07:32:25

quote:

---

Originally posted by Shawn Hoover



Thank you. I have a fairly useless shelf in my shop that I made in 8th grade. I think we sold the clock at a garage sale. Other than that I did my research and went very slow.

---

man, i gotta say, i assumed you had a bit more woodworking experience than that as awesome as this banjo is. how much would you build something like this for to sale?

-justin

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/08/2012:  08:20:32

Thanks, blockader. I just figured out on Friday whether I could make a banjo that makes music or not, so I don't have a price list just yet. But I saw your offline message, and we can chat.

Jonnycake White - Posted - 11/09/2012:  09:29:09

I like the innovation in the head stock a lot.  I probably wouldn't copy it but I'm glad someone is doing it.

I would suggest getting your coordinator rod or dowel stick or whatever made and installed as soon as possible.  As rigid as your rim seems to be, it will slowly distort under the constant pull of those five steel strings.  It will be almost imperceptible but your neck angle will change and then one day you've got 1/2" high action to deal with.

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/09/2012:  16:58:29

Thanks, Jon. I'll try not to wait too long, but I'll keep an eye on it and try to keep the tension down in the meantime.

Shawn Hoover - Posted - 11/20/2012:  05:08:54

Here's the wood coordinator rod installed. It still makes me nervous to crank up to full tension not knowing what might explode, but it is more stable in terms of wah-wah when flexing the neck now.

coordinator rod installed

coordinator rod heel detail

coordinator rod

rudy - Posted - 11/20/2012:  06:15:36

Shawn, Your coordinator rod is very interesting with the inserts used for attachment.  I'm not keen on the gap between the rod and rim myself, but it's a functional design.  Another thought for you would be to tunnel the rod and use all thread running from your neck heel to your attachment point outside the rim below the tailpiece.  You could always do that later if you cared to make a new rod, though.  Here's a rough shot of the same idea on the Walnut 12 slot head I did recently.

There's also a shot of the router setup for cutting the inlay channel. The pot photo makes the inlay appear odd, but it's actually quite nice!

Dowel stick