El Dobro - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:13:43

I would say it's a Granada ring that was in a 6, because it didn't have any engraving that a 6 ring would have.

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:18:58

quote:

---

Originally posted by Cabin_Hill

quote:

---

---

I hate to ruin your day Steve but you have nothing more than a Gibson parts banjo with some of Wade Mainers original Granada parts. The ring (parts from another banjo) from the TB-6 came from FON 9301-31 not Wades banjo. Selling this banjo as Wade Mainers banjo is a false statement. 

This same topic has been batted around on the HO for years. Threads discussing: How many parts do you need to make a real prewar Gibson banjo.

What other parts are not original to Wades banjo?

 

---

Trust me on this one You did not ruin Steve's day.

davepicks5 - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:19:48

As I was growing up, my father had two favorite groups    Bill Monroe and The Bluegrass Boys and The Mainer's Mountaineers, he loved the energy of Monroe but the simple mountain style of JE and Wade, a bit of  contradiction in style but great musicians in their own right.

I enjoyed watching this video......every last second of it..  youtube.com/watch?v=IfLljLVlpI...e=related    

It allows us a brief glimpse into the world of Wade and his lovely wife. They truly loved entertaining people and it showed.......

It causes me to stop and reflect on myself........ hope it does the same for all of you.

The banjo in his hands is one of the great pictures of all time.

David

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:33:27

Steve didn't contradict himself as it is listed in the shipping records with ship date Steve gave as style 6 granada ring. Steve was commissioned to to the restoration by the owner. He didn't buy the parts he simply did the work as the owner didn't feel competent to do it. The owner owns all the components.

Edited by - banjodr on 08/20/2012 16:46:28

BANJOBOB549 - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:34:36

quote:  Bill,  As tacky as it sounds, Once the Bridge, Head, and strings have been changed,,None are original from the factory,,If I were in the mood (I,m Not) for another flathead, Period parts from any banjo to try and restore one as close to original as possible would not bother me.  This debate will never end regarding those old banjos,,,,,,,,,

---

Originally posted by wbelm

BANJOBOB549........ I have a call into this Stewart character, don't know too much about him.....Won't answer the telephone, but already know he's guilty........I just know it.

---

Bronx banjo - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:39:28

Wow, El Dobro, how Zen! It brings to mind this question: If Gibson sold a nickel plated banjo with Bella Voce wood and designated it in the shipping ledger as a TB 75, what is it? The answer is the sound of one hand clapping.

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:39:40

Oh and I guess the Butch Robbins RB-4 and the Snuffy Jenkins RB-4 are merely parts banjos too!.......wait for it.........

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  16:51:29

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bronx banjo

Wow, El Dobro, how Zen! It brings to mind this question: If Gibson sold a nickel plated banjo with Bella Voce wood and designated it in the shipping ledger as a TB 75, what is it? The answer is the sound of one hand clapping.

---

Didn't that actually happen?...not one hand clapping but the TBella 75 Voce I think...maybe.....seems like I remember it

Dave, I'm typing up club memberships remember?

Edited by - banjodr on 08/20/2012 16:54:41

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  17:00:11

BTW the feel of that neck is amazing and the frets are original well worn first 5 frets but almost untouched beyond that. Inlay was weird to get used to up the neck for some reason. Love the flying eagle peg head with hearts and flowers board. Fun experience getting to play it before the restore and after.

RB3WREATH - Posted - 08/20/2012:  17:12:46

quote:

---

Originally posted by f5loar

I've not heard the price on this one but if it's not at least half the price of an all original RB G. than it's priced too high.  I didn't understand the part about having it's original frets.  80 years of Wade picking on it didn't wear out the originals?  That should be in the Guinness Book of World Records for longest lasting frets in Gibson history.    A Loar F5 or prewar D45/D28 is worth half the price if it's been refinished even if by the factory.  I would think this banjo would be in the same situation of old parts were found to replace the original metal parts.   But if they did recover the original parts to this banjo then you are talking full price.   I too think Wade was ripped off by someone at Gibson when that tone ring was changed out.  I guess you could say Gibson ripped off Earl too when they kept his old fretboard and replaced it with the bow ties. 

---

RB3WREATH - Posted - 08/20/2012:  17:15:14

quote:

---

Originally posted by f5loar

I've not heard the price on this one but if it's not at least half the price of an all original RB G. than it's priced too high.  I didn't understand the part about having it's original frets.  80 years of Wade picking on it didn't wear out the originals?  That should be in the Guinness Book of World Records for longest lasting frets in Gibson history.    A Loar F5 or prewar D45/D28 is worth half the price if it's been refinished even if by the factory.  I would think this banjo would be in the same situation of old parts were found to replace the original metal parts.   But if they did recover the original parts to this banjo then you are talking full price.   I too think Wade was ripped off by someone at Gibson when that tone ring was changed out.  I guess you could say Gibson ripped off Earl too when they kept his old fretboard and replaced it with the bow ties. 

---

Speaking to the frets I have played for 30 years on my RB3 and I still have the original frets and my RB75 also has the original frets. They were very high frets and hard

Joe

RB3WREATH - Posted - 08/20/2012:  17:27:25

I need to chime in here. If Gibson had no scruples about putting parts together and selling banjos as floor sweeps then why is it off key to bring a banjo with all of the important wooden parts original, including the 5 string neck and find original metal parts that may have been chosen at the factory for this banjo and bring this back together to restore a very important instrument. This is just righting the wrong that Gibson did in the 60s. If there were a bin fill of tone rings and another of hooks and nuts and so on what is the difference between this and when it left the factory The wooden parts mean so much more than the metal ones if you can find them as pre war and I feel the price reflects the issues.

Joe

El Dobro - Posted - 08/20/2012:  17:55:03

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bronx banjo

Wow, El Dobro, how Zen! It brings to mind this question: If Gibson sold a nickel plated banjo with Bella Voce wood and designated it in the shipping ledger as a TB 75, what is it? The answer is the sound of one hand clapping.

---

It's a TB75, the ledgers don't lie. My T-T left the factory with curly maple wood, but the ledger had it listed as a TB12, which was specified to have walnut, so it's a TB12. 

desert rose - Posted - 08/20/2012:  18:18:33

I see a money making oppertunity here.

How many would pay money to know cabin hills REAL identity.

Many of us know

Scott

bluegrassboy - Posted - 08/20/2012:  18:37:37

some people said wades banjo was over priced at 100k with the 'new' parts on it. NOW, it has period correct parts, and is still over priced at 195k. for cryin out loud, make up your minds! some times i think i need to move on because of crap like this! the ones that pick everything apart aint gonna buy any way. what if you came across a 33 r-b3, but was told grandad sent it back to gibson in '35 and had it converted to a granada? oh well, pass i guess, cause its a parts banjo. everyone wants an unplayed original, these instruments are 70-80 years old. they were used for their purpose, make music. back in the day, i remember people buying old flatheads, martin guitars, gibson mandolins, and never looking at a serial number, or asking about the finish. all they cared about how it SOUNDED. lets knock off this petty b.s. and work more on your right hand, thats the 'secret' to tone

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  18:41:25

quote:

---

Originally posted by desert rose

I see a money making oppertunity here.

 

How many would pay money to know cabin hills REAL identity.

 

Many of us know

 

Scott

---

Give me a "T".......

Hey how come no one is biting on the Butch Robbins/Snuffy Jenkins thingy?

Edited by - banjodr on 08/20/2012 18:42:55

Mike Casey - Posted - 08/20/2012:  18:53:43

I believe the replaced parts have been factored into the asking price. I, for one, would pay their asking price if I had it. I wouldn't care that the replaced metal parts didn't come from this banjo. The banjo is as original and that is good enough for me. True, the die hard, original only, collectors don't think as I do. It's a parts banjo to them. I respect their position, but they might have to pay more than $195,000 for an all original if they can find one. The only ones who will ever know what this banjo really goes for are likely not going to tell, except to the IRS. This banjo is not only in great condition for an original five string Granada it is rich with country music history and sounds like a million bucks... let's see, $1,000,000 minus $195,000,,, that leaves you another $815,000 to seek out the real deal if there is one out there.

pick it - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:06:31

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

Oh and I guess the Butch Robbins RB-4 and the Snuffy Jenkins RB-4 are merely parts banjos too!.......wait for it.........

---

 have they had the tonerings changed out too?

belabanjo - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:14:54

Can't we all just be happy and support the true restoration of this great banjo. 

Great job Steve

pick it - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:19:29

quote:

---

Originally posted by belabanjo

Can't we all just be happy and support the true restoration of this great banjo. 

Great job Steve

---

 sure I'm happy,I really don't care one way or the other.

southerndrifter - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:24:01

I think the banjo had better tone when Arthur played it.

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:24:52

quote:

---

Originally posted by pick it

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

Oh and I guess the Butch Robbins RB-4 and the Snuffy Jenkins RB-4 are merely parts banjos too!.......wait for it.........

---

 have they had the tonerings changed out too?

---

BAM! Hook, line, and sinker!.....tonerings..NO  thumbscrews straight from Butch himself traded 2 apiece thought it was funny.

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:27:38

quote:

---

Originally posted by southerndrifter

I think the banjo had better tone when Arthur played it.

---

It did for sure he was using my picks! Ha now that's funny! no really he was he didn't bring his with him..it's still funny

wuzapicker - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:31:13

My former post wasn't meant to dis Mr. Huber or the Wade Mainer banjo. What ever it's state, it IS and will forever be known as the Wade Mainer Granada. Maybe it belongs in the Hall of Fame, but that isn't my call to make. I enjoyed listening to it as Mr. Huber played it. Knowing he put it together and set it up I expect it was done right. I would imagine there aren't more than a handful of shops that could have got the right vintage parts together to make it happen. But Mr. Huber did.

I know if I recked my car, I would want the shop that could pull the right parts together to make it right again. And I wouldn't worry about where the shop sourced the parts as long as they weren't stolen. I think the same principle applies here. Only, even if I could afford to buy this banjo, I don't want the anxiety and responcibility that comes with owning it.

southerndrifter - Posted - 08/20/2012:  19:32:57

Another curious point: If Gibson replaced ALL the metal with new RB-800 parts of the period, didn't the rim have to be altered to accept the flange? Huber states that the replaced flange was a nickel prewar flange that he had gold-plated. I was just under the impression that prewar rims were a little different in size than the ones from the late 60s.

banjodr - Posted - 08/20/2012:  20:02:37

If I'm not mistaken, the original gold flange(s) that were tried for one reason or the other didn't fit as well as the nickel so the nickel was used. I don't remember anything being said about rim alteration to fit the 60's stuff but it could have been done and touched up as I think there was an overspray at some time also.

Rick Polston - Posted - 08/20/2012:  22:16:18

quote:

---

Originally posted by southerndrifter

Another curious point: If Gibson replaced ALL the metal with new RB-800 parts of the period, didn't the rim have to be altered to accept the flange? Huber states that the replaced flange was a nickel prewar flange that he had gold-plated. I was just under the impression that prewar rims were a little different in size than the ones from the late 60s.

---

I believe a flange can be milled to fit the rim if you choose to not alter the rim, maybe the flange used was milled and the one used required less milling than the others (just a guess). Old flanges can get out of round (oval or egg) and pull up - each in a different shape from the other due to head and coordinator rod tension. I imagine Steve will tell the whole story.

plunka5 - Posted - 08/21/2012:  03:43:21

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

BTW the feel of that neck is amazing and the frets are original well worn first 5 frets but almost untouched beyond that. Inlay was weird to get used to up the neck for some reason. Love the flying eagle peg head with hearts and flowers board. Fun experience getting to play it before the restore and after.

---

Dave, this is very intreresting...were there any recordings made of the banjo with the "Gibson-replaced" parts from the 90's to compare it to the replacement pre-war parts?  Thanks!

banjodr - Posted - 08/21/2012:  04:49:50

I remember some YouTube videos I think of Wade playing the banjo in his later years

plunka5 - Posted - 08/21/2012:  05:41:00

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

I remember some YouTube videos I think of Wade playing the banjo in his later years

---

I've watched the David Holt interview with Wade and his wife, and others....I was wondering if Steve Huber or yourself recorded with the banjo (as a comparison) in the previous state to what it has emerged into now (which is a monster).  Thanks

banjodr - Posted - 08/21/2012:  06:17:10

I didn't record it BR (before restoration) Steve may have as a reference but I doubt it. He is can chime in if he did. I did play it briefly BR and it was very good also. Not sure how parts fit at that time. Steve can maybe enlighten us on that. I know it kicks now. The thing that was interesting was playing Steve's banjo (shop banjo basically VRBG) up next to the Wade. There were differences for sure but still real good both ways. I think the thing that I like the most on the Wade is the neck. Square frets aren't too comfortable up the neck but the feel is silk.

wuzapicker - Posted - 08/21/2012:  06:55:11

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rick Polston

quote:

---

Originally posted by southerndrifter

Another curious point: If Gibson replaced ALL the metal with new RB-800 parts of the period, didn't the rim have to be altered to accept the flange? Huber states that the replaced flange was a nickel prewar flange that he had gold-plated. I was just under the impression that prewar rims were a little different in size than the ones from the late 60s.

---

I believe a flange can be milled to fit the rim if you choose to not alter the rim, maybe the flange used was milled and the one used required less milling than the others (just a guess). Old flanges can get out of round (oval or egg) and pull up - each in a different shape from the other due to head and coordinator rod tension. I imagine Steve will tell the whole story.

---

I knew an plectrum player named Sid Steel in Napa CA who had a 1934 OPF Flathead PB3.  Sid is now deceased, but he told me that when he bought the banjo it had a broken resonator flange.  He took it to a repairman who had a new flange, but it didn't fit Sid's PB3.  So the repairman used a spoke shave tool to shave the inside of the new flange until he achieved a good fit on the original rim.

Sid sold that RB3 to a fellow who hired Larry Cohea to build a new 5-string conversion neck.  I was at a CBA festival at Grass Valley and witnessed the owner and Larry together discussing the banjo with a small group of interested men.  Even here in California, a real prewar Flathead Mastertone draws some interest.

mrbook - Posted - 08/21/2012:  09:23:51

I thought the price at Elderly was a bit high with the replaced parts (and I generally think their prices are pretty fair), but if I had the money and the inclination to buy Wade Mainer's banjo I would consider the current asking price to be not too bad.

josh95843 - Posted - 08/21/2012:  10:00:52

You can post a topic on here about anything under the sun and at least 12 a holes will jack it up. Its pitiful people cant just be happy and enjoy a story. Make my stomach hurt reading some of this crap

Emiel - Posted - 08/21/2012:  12:34:56

quote:

---

Originally posted by josh95843

You can post a topic on here about anything under the sun and at least 12 a holes will jack it up. Its pitiful people cant just be happy and enjoy a story. Make my stomach hurt reading some of this crap

---

The BHO is pretty civilized compared to other forums... 

pick it - Posted - 08/21/2012:  13:16:32

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

quote:

---

Originally posted by pick it

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

Oh and I guess the Butch Robbins RB-4 and the Snuffy Jenkins RB-4 are merely parts banjos too!.......wait for it.........

---

 have they had the tonerings changed out too?

---

BAM! Hook, line, and sinker!.....tonerings..NO  thumbscrews straight from Butch himself traded 2 apiece thought it was funny.

---

 I don't need all the dramatics and BS .I ask you a straight up question ,I expect the same kind of answer.

Edited by - pick it on 08/21/2012 13:22:09

wbelm - Posted - 08/21/2012:  15:05:20

Well said Josh, I am with you. Your strong desire to be the best you can be, and your desire to learn from the guys that have gone before you, reminds me of the way we were at your age.

Some of you on this thread would argue with Earl Scruggs rather than listen and learn. Anybody else noticed this?

Ebanjo - Posted - 08/21/2012:  16:23:10

Well, I think it's a great thing that Steve put the Mainer Granada back together with period correct parts. And go back and read the old Mastertone label about replacing parts. And from what I was told, the reason Gibson replaced the fingerboard on Earl's Granada was because a cake of fiddle rosin had melted on it while it was under Don Reno's bed (at his home in S.C.) when he was overseas during WWII. Boy that old Granada sounds good in Arthur's hands.
Eric Ellis

banjodr - Posted - 08/21/2012:  16:29:16

---

---

 I don't need all the dramatics and BS .I ask you a straight up question ,I expect the same kind of answer.

---

Pick it....Pick it....Pick it................

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  19:32:41

quote:

---

Originally posted by mrbook

I thought the price at Elderly was a bit high with the replaced parts

(and I generally think their prices are pretty fair),

but if I had the money and the inclination to buy Wade Mainer's banjo

I would consider the current asking price to be not too bad.

---

Yup - - given it's provenance and the restoration done to it, I agree.

I will GLADLY pay you Tuesday,

For a Wade Mainer banjo today!

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  19:44:02

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjodr

I remember some YouTube videos I think of Wade playing the banjo in his later years

---

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  19:52:34

Let's not forget about the man, while discussing his banjo. 

Edited by - dmiller on 08/21/2012 20:04:25

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  20:03:12

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  20:16:32

From Greylock to Bean Blossom - Posted - 08/21/2012:  20:30:47

D.
thanks for the musical posts. I had not heard him much before and did not realize he had such a pretty voice.
Ken

Rooster59 - Posted - 08/21/2012:  20:48:24

dmiller, thanks for the clips. I really enjoyed those.
Also enjoyed the clips of the guys playing Wade's banjo at Steve's shop. Wish I could have been in the room while it was going on. I dream about getting to play one of those great old banjos but at the same time, I'd almost be scared to------the one at home would never be the same.

dmiller - Posted - 08/21/2012:  21:16:21

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rooster59

I dream about getting to play one of those great old banjos but at the same time,

I'd almost be scared to------the one at home would never be the same.

---

I hear you there, Rooster.  

There's always "one better" out there - - - somewhere.

picknman - Posted - 08/22/2012:  08:22:43

To my opinion that banjo is about as good as it gets. I think Mr. Mainer would be well pleased with his banjo in its present condition.

Come on powerball.

Doug J.    

larry p - Posted - 08/22/2012:  09:40:17

To my way of thinking the banjo is in the best shape it's been in since it went back to Gibson in the '60s. As Eric has pointed out, Steve approached the restoration in the spirit of what's printed on the 'Mastertone' label inside that banjo..It's the 'Holy Grail' of the prewar Gibson Mastertone any way you wanna slice it..