Initial Jam Strategy:  survival is winning, plan on a years long process, the steps are soft and movable

step 1:  speed, timing and emphasis

 - ensure the banjo is mostly in-tune and set to a key appropriate to the tune being played

 - lightly mute at the 12th fret and "play" anything with the right hand that is keeping with the rhythm and time

- learn more tunes and techniques during practice time

step 2:  guessing

 - ensure the banjo is tune to a key appropriate to the tune being played

 - bounce between I, IV and V chords while playing something with the right that keeps with the rhythm and time 

- learn more tunes and techniques during practice time

step 3:  hearing

 - ensure the banjo is tune to a key appropriate to the tune being played

 - match the I, IV and V chords to tune while playing something with the right that keeps with the rhythm and time 

- learn more tunes and techniques during practice time

step 4: initial survival curve complete

 - move with the group

- learn more tunes and techniques during practice time

Just remember, young or old everyone starts at the same place and you can learn.

Maybe try an app like Strum Machine when you get home. It plays the chords and shows them at the same time. You can adjust the speed as slow as you need.
Do that for endless hours and you’ll catch on.
Best luck.

I do have strum machine. Learning to play tunes is so much easier than guessing at jams

At my first jam I knew two tunes, Boneparte Crossing the Rhine and The Year of Jubilo. Two decades later I know about 200 or so. Picking up songs on the fly is a skill that takes time to develop and I am still mediocre at it. At the "Q" to the left of this page you can get a lot of information on "first jams" or " how to learn CH tunes" etc. It may look like people were easily cranking out tunes but believe me a lot of time and practice preceded all that. You jumped into the deep end of the pool, being lost is all part of the learning curve. I was two years in before I knew most/all the tunes in a particular jam, and months later before it happened again. Jamming is a journey where you never quite reach your destination, just enjoy wherever you are at! banjered

This was the absolute most fun I had. We did an orchestral with a Virginia reel in which some people had the high or low melody, some had the main part and some had the chords. I completely and totally got this. Picked the whole thing up in minutes. There was tab but I didn’t need it. The whole thing just made sense and I had never heard it before studying it.

youtu.be/bA87pw145aM

thars me in the shorts in the top right with my leg crossed in the chair.

if jams were like this I would not be lost at all!

Is your goal to play/jam with others?   ....or to acompany yourself or your family/friends singing a few songs 'round the campfire?  ... or???

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'Way back I took lessons for a few months.   We got to the point of my teacher having me chord [i.e. 1,4,5] in whatever key I wanted, and change chords whenever I wanted, and he'd follow me [rather than what seems to be the more conventional me-follow-the guitar-player approach]. I think it had the makings of a productive exercise, but it was just when we abandoned the idea of being snowbirds so we never got to give it a real test.

At the only banjo camp I've attended, at the "slow jam" portion somebody would hold up a placard  showing the chord we were supposed to switch to.  The visual cue seemed to help ... and so long as the lady was organized and paying attention it was a l-o-t easier to see than a guitar player's fat little fingers.   

I wish group instructors and slow jam leaders, particularly at camps, would provide a list of songs ahead of time with instructions for people to do before arriving including 1) listen to the listed songs over and over, 2) try to hum the tunes while driving or lawn mowing 3) learn the chords in the songs.

2) Make a practice of when listening to any music to make a game of guessing ahead of time when a chord change is going to occur.

3) sit next to the upright bass player at your jam who will walk to the next chord.

4) if all else fails do what I did and get some sort of bass and work through Andy Hohwald's upright bass DVD.

One more idea for you. I remember my first jam and it felt exactly like you describe...and I thought I knew a number of songs! Had no idea of how to make this work. I did go back and figured out to work on the chords of all the song that were played and at least have something to back up with. Also, you bring your phone and install strum machine and pull up the song that is called and at leas have a reference of what the chords are. After a short time you will get it.

My idea is for you to try and find some friends or other players who are also starting and make a private jam at your house. You can limit the songs and as you grow, the group will all learn together and you will be amazed about how much learn. I did this and really think it helped in many ways.

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Originally posted by jsinjin

if jams were like this I would not be lost at all!

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There are plenty of jams like this. But maybe not where you live.

They're called "slow jams." They are intened especially for beginners. The best slow jams are led by one or two people who are experienced players -- sometimes also teachers -- because someone needs to know what's going on and how to hold a group of beginners together.

It's been clear from your earliest messages here two years ago you've been going to jams that are wrong for you. They're at too high a level where all the participants are advanced players, already know a vast number of songs, and are excellent ear players who can improvise on songs they haven't worked up or are even hearing for the first time. If a jam is not organized or billed as "all levels" the participants don't expect to slow down for beginners.

If this camp session is the first time you got what was going on, I'd say it's possible you've been studying with the wrong teacher. It appears this session leader knows how to get people to understand what's actually happening in the music.  Maybe you didn't spend enough time making non-song chord noise before getting into tunes, where you're emphasizing melody, not always forming chords with your left hand, and so what's happening musically (the chord pattern and changes) is not clear.

When you get home from camp, look for slow jams. Preferably old time, since there won't be anyone leading clawhammer banjo at a bluegrass jam of any speed. And consider finding a new teacher.

I'm glad to read you're still trying jams, I've read some of the past threads on how this has been a bit of an exercise in frustration.

I've yet to get comfortable with jams, but one thing that has worked for me is watching the guitar player and chording along with them. It's sloppy, it's slow, but it's a step up from playing muted strings.

That's a skill of its own, but since most tunes are built around GCD or CFG, it's achievable so long as the guitar player isn't doing anything fancy.

For comparison, I'm at a point where if they play a tune I'm quite familiar with, I can happily play along. But I'm not really ready to improvise, or modify my playing much. And I only know 0-2 tunes per session.

For songs I don't know, often I can catch the chord progression before the tune is over, and if it comes up in a future jam, I'll be faster at that, and might start trying to guess a few melody notes. Especially if I can crib off a banjo player. Chords plus a couple important melody notes can be a surprising amount of fun.

For tunes that really catch my ear, I'll make a note of the name and practice at home before the next jam.

...which reminds me I need to attend another one, I've been absent from my local jam for a good 6 months now.

Some people were born to be drummers ha ha!

IMO you'd be surprised how much listening to the music helps you get a feel for the changes and general melodic patterns. I believe you've indicated that you don't really listen to music except for some classical here and there? I got pretty good at jamming pretty quickly in large part by making a playlist of our standard fiddle tunes and listening to them quite often. It helps that I really enjoy the tunes. Then again, I've always enjoyed pop music. And when I say "pop," I don't necessarily mean top 40 or Taylor Swift/etc (though I'm no snob about that stuff) - I think a lot of the bluegrass music we play could be characterized as pop given that the tunes are often catchy, in 4/4 time, etc.

I believe there is some special alchemy that happens when you spend a lot of time listening to the music and then also playing it (or attempting to play it) with an instrument in your hand. My first instruments were piano (private lessons) and clarinet (school band) as a kid. That was all sheet music. Play the notes on the page. Which is I believe what you've indicated you set out to do. I will acknowledge it's a pretty big mindset shift to go from that "classical" (for lack of a better word) approach to the "by ear" or "by feel" approach. But it's worth it. And I think it's good to be able to do both. The fact is that a lot of these tunes did not originate from sheet music, or at least, the popular recordings of them that we know and love were not played off of sheet music.

Personally I think it's really fun to show up to a jam and listen for the changes and throw in some fills, maybe noodle on a solo if you're feeling saucy. It's fun stuff. But you have to let go of any notion that you will play it exactly right, or play notes according to some recipe, formula, sheet music, etc. Basically what I'm saying is free your mind, maaaaan.

DonDublin makes a great point. One of my banjo teachers once told me that if you don’t listen to it you can’t play it and I’ve found that to be true. His idea of making a playlist of recordings of the songs you heard at the jam and listening to them over and over, maybe slowing them down and practicing changing chords while chopping, will really help you at a live jam. I’ve got over 3000 bluegrass songs on my phone and that’s all I listen to now. That’s not to say that’s absolutely necessary, but after a while you start hearing the fact that many songs have very similar chord progressions and then you have the key to unlocking playing along with a lot of songs you hear at a jam.

John

You're getting a lot of good help here. I've read a number of your posts, and can't help feeling like you've been missing something basic - in Medicine we call them "threshold concepts. Do you know what people are talking about when they refer to chords by numbers, ie 1, 4, and 5 (0r I, IV and V)? Can you relate the numbers to the key of the tune? Do you know which chords are the I,IV and V in each key?

Many fiddle tunes and folk songs are structured with fairly predictable progressions, combinations of I, IV and V, with the odd II or vi. There are a few patterns that are common, and you will start to hear, and even anticipate them.

Others have emphasized listening, and I couldn't agree more. Make a list of the tunes that are played, go online and listen/watch every version of those tunes that you can find (there will be many, some of them completely different tunes with the same name). You will start to hear the patterns.

The OP highlights a sadly ongoing issue which is the lack of practical help and nurturing to bridge the gap between playing alone and playing with others. Of course it is possible to make this transition alone. There are strategies and aspects that can be practiced that will help. But most, to a greater or lesser extent, flounder unnecessarily. Typically these attempts get partial and intermittent 'windows' of joining a tune. A frustrating hit-and-miss experience of sessions.

But this transition - to full on-the-fly fluidity and independence - is so much more smoothly and efficiently achieved with nurturing and mentoring. I can say that with confidence because we do it. The simple reason being that the necessary skills required are acquired progressively in situ. They can be taught, but not in the transactional way that technique is taught. The acquisition process is different.

The internet is a gift for finding one’s way to the banjo, basic lessons and the subsequent broadcasting your every move with that banjo.
But the internet also depletes and diminishes.

The context in which playing with others and playing by ear are most naturally acquired are the intimate space. We can describe that with words like ‘nurture’ and ‘mentoring’. What we’re really talking about is the traditional consistent space for social music; within family, with friends and neighbours. A (musical) kinship resource space that shares inwardly, not a broadcasting space that looks outward for ‘validation’.

Camps and workshops are today’s go-to banjo leisure ticket. Fun activity. But the contact is by definition transient. Bluntly…useless for imbuing a person with the wherewithal to feel at home and fully integrate in any session.

Today we have to be ingenious and adaptive to create that consistent local space, where once it was simply called ‘home’. One certainty is that no matter how much we try and convince ourselves of the opposite, the internet is the antithesis of that musical space.

OP,
You do understand that if you knew the songs/tunes ahead of time, then got to practice those tunes. . . . . .this is called a Band.

Lots of folks in bands can be lost in jams, because of the unpredictable part. I myself, am atracked to this. That's why it's so exillerating. Skiing down a black diamond run is dang scary. Some go around. Hey, that's fine. Enjoy. And just a reminder: Nobody gets hurt by someone playing a bad note. It's just music.

I grew up in a very musical home.Dad played only by ear all his life and he told me early on,"I'll tell you the chords,but some day you'll just "get it" on your own.Nobody knows why...it'll just happen like a lightbulb turning on.
He finished by saying "When that light turns on let me know so I can stop having to tell you."

Play music with people that play well by ear.

There are a lot of lessons in osmosis.

quote:

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Originally posted by DonDublin

IMO you'd be surprised how much listening to the music helps you get a feel for the changes and general melodic patterns.

I believe you've indicated that you don't really listen to music except for some classical here and there? 

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And there you have it.

quote:

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Originally posted by Nopix

OP,
You do understand that if you knew the songs/tunes ahead of time, then got to practice those tunes. . . . . .this is called a Band.

Lots of folks in bands can be lost in jams, because of the unpredictable part. I myself, am atracked to this. That's why it's so exillerating. Skiing down a black diamond run is dang scary. Some go around. Hey, that's fine. Enjoy. And just a reminder: Nobody gets hurt by someone playing a bad note. It's just music.

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The essential difference between 'session' and 'band' summarised perfectly.

The wide gulf between playing alone, or rehearsed playing in a band, and session playing is the essence of being musically 'out on a wire' like a tight-rope walker. Alert and sensitive to what is happening around us, but trusting to the facility we have.

Relevant facility...

quote:

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Originally posted by Nopix

You do understand that if you knew the songs/tunes ahead of time, then got to practice those tunes. . . . . .this is called a Band.
 

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I think there's a middle ground where you know a lot of the tunes/songs likely to be called at a jam. 

If it's a bluegrass jam, I could point you to the 100-150 songs and tunes that you should be listening to to hang in the great majority of jams.

For old time it seems more jam-dependent. Some keep to a more narrow repertoire, others are more into obscure tunes.

quote:

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Originally posted by Nopix

You do understand that if you knew the songs/tunes ahead of time, then got to practice those tunes. . . . . .this is called a Band.

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I agree that practice is a big part of what distinguishes a band from a jam (even if the jam is smaller and limited to friends who get together).

But besides practice, there's arrangement: working out how the song goes, which incudes key, tempo, assignment of solos and fills, vocal parts, dynamics within the song, and -- maybe most important of all -- intros and endings. A band that begins and ends songs together almost immediately signals it's a band and not just some guys playing together.

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Originally posted by earlstanleycrowe

For old time it seems more jam-dependent. Some keep to a more narrow repertoire, others are more into obscure tunes.

 

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Developing the ability to play by ear makes repertoire redundant. We just listen and play. 
I think the inclination to cling to a small number of familiar tunes actually holds people back. We can all develop our ear. But that starts from firstly letting go of a counter-productive sense of what is 'safe' and instead trusting to one's ability and the scope of that ability to increase. Playing by ear isn't, as many imagine, a random leap into the unknown; it is hearing, breaking down and translating the new via your banjo with your existing technique and ability.

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Originally posted by Old Hickory

quote:

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Originally posted by Nopix

You do understand that if you knew the songs/tunes ahead of time, then got to practice those tunes. . . . . .this is called a Band.

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I agree that practice is a big part of what distinguishes a band from a jam (even if the jam is smaller and limited to friends who get together).

But besides practice, there's arrangement: working out how the song goes, which incudes key, tempo, assignment of solos and fills, vocal parts, dynamics within the song, and -- maybe most important of all -- intros and endings. A band that begins and ends songs together almost immediately signals it's a band and not just some guys playing together.

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I'm not here to argue, Ken.

I think you found a real issue 'upthread' where the OP was not known to listen to music (accept on occasion)

I think that right now it’s just not the best way for me to learn to play banjo. It’s such an incredibly high bar at this point I’m just not getting anything out of the jams. I keep trying to find an analogy but imagine you have never lifted any weights and the people around you are Olympic weightlifters doing advanced workouts and this is their only opportunity to do the workout and they need their focus. I’m at a point where guessing the tuning or getting to it can take me looking thjngs up and twisting the pegs forever and I normally play at very very slow paces in the 20-50 bpm. The songs I can listen to but they’re really incomprehensible to me with again, billions of notes, instruments coming jn and out, fiddles are incredibly loud, guitars move at high speeds and most to the banjo players just play so fast. It’s just not an enjoyable thing for me.