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A place for former and current students of Fiddlin Al to post videos of their progress, share comments and ask questions.

51 Members, Created 2/18/2013 -

Administrators: MiG-19 (owner)


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Playing with a backing track

From EMiller on 3/19/2013 9:29:33 AM

For you guys who've been taking lessons from Al for a longer time, when did you develop your ability to play with a backing track or other people? I found a backing track of Cripple Creek so I tried to play along and can't seem to keep time. It seems like I a doing my thing and it doesn't match (to my ear) with the backing track.

14 Comments

MoPac fan says:
3/19/2013 9:34:02 AM

Some of those backing tracks don't make sense. I was trying to play along with one, I think it was Sally Ann, and it didn't make any sense. It wasn't what I was playing, which was Scruggs version of Sally Ann.

EMiller says:
3/19/2013 9:37:39 AM

Thanks Randy!! That makes me feel better because cripple Creek sure didn't seem to Jive with what Al taught me.

banjolasse says:
3/19/2013 9:48:33 AM

I´ve trying to play along with backing tracks a few times but think it´s too early for me. But to play along with Earl and Foggy Mountain Boys is much easier with a slow downer. I have Amazing Slow Downer and just think it´s great.

daytripper says:
3/19/2013 9:50:45 AM

Jed Clampett would work quite well I guess as there's no other way to play it than Scruggs. I need the backing track LOUD else I can't hear it over the banjo; I typically use headphones over one ear so I can hear it. BIAB is much easier than a metronome or that browser-based beat looper with the grumpy guy on it.

Find a tune you're REALLY comfortable with and go from there. The fiddle tunes like CC & Sally Goodin are more difficult I find; I have simple arrangements of Redwing, Red River Valley and I'll Fly Away which I can play the tune and backup for at varying speeds now

If you do find a friendly jam, it's much easier to stay in time (or at least know where you are) when there's lots of other players, and a singer. And if that fails, there are more people to drown out your mistakes..!

MoPac fan says:
3/19/2013 9:55:00 AM

Best Practice is also a good slow downer program that's free.

bestpractice.sourceforge.net/

You can slow down the temp without changing keys, or change keys without affecting speed. Or you can slow down and change keys, which is what I do all the time. Earl is playing in G#, I drop it down 50 cents and slow Earl down to about 80 percent and then I can play along.

daytripper says:
3/19/2013 10:20:47 AM

If I slow him down *BY* 80% then I might have a chance to play along...

G says:
3/19/2013 10:23:52 AM

I have started using backing tracks also. I got the tracks from here on the BHO ... slow/med/normal versions of MANY tunes. There's an easy way to search for and download them in the media archive. I put them on my Samsung Tablet, and just plug it into a set of speakers.

From my perspective as a veteran beginner, there are two things you could mean when you say "keep time". One issue is simply keeping on the beat - not going too fast or too slow compared to the backing track.

The other meaning is if there is some discrepancy between the time signature of the backing track, and what you're using. (sounds like the issue mopick mentions ... the track doesn't "make sense")

Before starting to learn Sally Goodin, I always noticed a strange little "hiccup" in the timing. Like you're going along in 4/4 time, but in between two of those 4/4 measures, they sneak in two little beats. When I started learning it, I noticed it too, but it didn't pose a real difficulty because I was following the tab closely. But when I played with the backing track ... it didn't match! The backing track was apparently a version of the tune that does not insert the extra beats. I asked Al about it, and he basically said, yeah, there's just those two extra beats thrown in. (I think that may be more common in fiddle tunes.)

I actually searched here on BHO, and there was in fact a thread on this (Sally Goodin specifically)... so I knew it wasn't just me. Problem is, with Sally Goodin, some people play it with the extra beats, and some don't. Obviously all the players in a jam have to be consistent on this, or it creates a problem.

But it sounds to me like your problem is the former .. you are having trouble keeping a consistent speed, so you get out of time with the recording. My guess is that the better you can play the tune, the less that will happen. I did find that at first it was hard playing along with a backing track - it messed me up ... like I suddenly had this pressure and I just couldn't keep it together. Just like when you play with live people. But I quickly improved. Practice the song a lot, and then practice with the track a lot. It should come. While I consider myself a beginner, I HAVE been "playing" for 30 years. I played poorly, but that experience I think does allow me to develop speed and consistent timing quicker than I would as a "true" beginner.

I doubt the problem is with the track, except in specific tunes like Sally Goodin. I would think CC is pretty consistent.

You could record yourself playing with the track and post it ... or (obviously), do that for Al and get his diagnosis :)

mcaple says:
3/19/2013 4:14:35 PM

One thing about Cripple Creek and band in a box is that the tab has a chorus then verse where as band in a box wants to play verse / chorus so you have to start on the second line of Cripple Creek and count yourself in on the "4 and" for the pinch. Then everything fits. Not sure if this could be the problem with your backing track but agree Band in a Box is the best (for me anyway).

G says:
3/19/2013 7:00:23 PM

Good point mcaple! I noticed that too. I'm not sure which part I think of as the chorus, and which as verse ... but the version Al teaches, uses the 2-3 hammer part (chorus?) basically as a intro line. Many people start by going straight to the verse (2-5 slide).

THAT will definitely screw you up if you're not aware of it.

MiG-19 says:
3/19/2013 10:20:16 PM

This is a great thread!

MoPac fan says:
3/20/2013 1:43:32 AM

Cripple Creek
(Kentucky, traditional)

Hey, I got a gal,
At the head of the creek,
An' I'm goin' up t' see her,
'Bout three times a week.

Kisses on the mouth,
Jus' as sweet as any wine,
Wrap myself aroun' her,
Like a sweet potato vine.

chorus:
Goin' up Cripple Creek,
Goin' on a run,
Goin' up Cripple Creek,
T' have some fun.

Goin' up Cripple Creek,
Goin' in a whirl,
Goin' up Cripple Creek,
T' see my girl.

I got a gal,
An' she loves me,
She's as sweet
As she can be.

She's got eyes,
Of baby blue,
An' her love,
Fer me is true.

chorus:

Now the girls up Cripple Creek,
'Bout half grown,
Jump on a boy,
Like a dog on a bone.

Roll my britches,
Up to my knees,
An' wade ol' Cripple Creek,
When I please.

chorus:

Cripple Creek's wide,
An' Cripple Creek's deep,
Gonna wade ol' Cripple Creek,
'Fore I sleep.

Hills are steep,
An' the road is muddy,
An' I'm so drunk,
I can't stan' steady.

chorus:
Cripple Creek's wide,
An' Cripple Creek's deep,
Gonna wade ol' Cripple Creek,
'Fore I sleep.

Roll my britches,
To my knees,
'An wade ol' Cripple Creek,
When I please.

chorus:

Drive in a buggy,
That's for me,
Watch the wheels roll,
Merrily.

Through the mud.
An' over the stones,
Buckin' horses,
Break good bones.

chorus:

I went down,
To Cripple Creek,
To see what them gals,
Had to eat.

Got so drunk,
I fell against the wall,
Ol' corn likker,
Was the cause of it all.

chorus

I went down,
To Cripple Creek,
To see what them gals,
Had to eat.
What they cooked,
I couldn't eat at all,
Harder than,
A brick in the wall.

chorus:

thelongcarabine says:
3/20/2013 4:51:12 AM

Thanks guys, can I throw a BIAB quetion in here. I'd be interested to know what settings you use. I got it recently and have the real band options, when I choose the real drums options it doesnt seem right. It could just be me, but it doesnt help the same way as the drums in the looper (with the grumpy old guy). Id be interested in knowing what settings you use. Id be happy to buy other options for it, but Im not sure what to get.

I think a diffrent beat could easily put me off and I wouldnt know that was what was doing it. As I say the looper feels right but I dont what thats called in BIAB. Thinking of two things at once still throws me.

Thanks

I am at the stage

thelongcarabine says:
3/20/2013 4:52:33 AM

Thanks guys, can I throw a BIAB question in here. I'd be interested to know what settings you use. I got it recently and have the real band options, when I choose the real drums options it doesnt seem right. It could just be me, but it doesnt help the same way as the drums in the looper (with the grumpy old guy). Id be interested in knowing what settings you use. Id be happy to buy other options for it, but Im not sure what to get.

I think a diffrent beat could easily put me off and I wouldnt know that was what was doing it. As I say the looper feels right but I dont what thats called in BIAB. Thinking of two things at once still throws me.

Thanks

loukiii says:
3/20/2013 12:20:28 PM

I got BIAB and I cant figure out a damn thing.


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