Cap - Posted - 04/09/2026:  09:40:08

I think it quite interesting that The old Granada is somehow a great sounding Banjo, because its rare. The real fact is Sonnys Banjo will never sound the same again. When we listen to the recordings of that Banjo, its not the instrument. The Hands, spirit, talent, knowledge and hard work of one of the Masters Sonny Osborne is what we are really listening to. Please remember that, so that we don't give an inanimate object some magical power or tone it really doesn't have. It's just a Banjo.

BobbyE - Posted - 04/09/2026:  10:31:31

Not saying 50/50 but why can't it be a combination? A great player and a quality instrument?

Bobby

randybartlett - Posted - 04/09/2026:  10:51:48

quote:

---

Originally posted by BobbyE

Not saying 50/50 but why can't it be a combination? A great player and a quality instrument?



Bobby

---

I vote with Bobby but offer 60% player and 40% banjo to partially agree with OP.  ;)

Owen - Posted - 04/09/2026:  10:59:59

I realize I'm an outlier* w.r.t. a lot of things banjo, but to me something either sounds good or not good .... I don't have the wherewithal or the desire to analyze it.  YMMV??

* and I guess that's good .... IF everybody was like me, banjo/music would be in a sad state indeed.  

Texasbanjo - Posted - 04/09/2026:  11:22:17

I've heard good pickers pick up an entry level banjo and make it sound good. I've heard beginners pick up an expensive instrument and make it sound terrible. A lot of the sound is a combination of banjo and player. I won't go 50/50, but somewhere in that range.

martyjoe - Posted - 04/09/2026:  11:23:32

I reckon it’s all down to the microphone he used.

Couldn’t resist that one:-)

ChunoTheDog - Posted - 04/09/2026:  11:44:32

When Ralph Stanley played a Gold Star flathead on his live in Japan album it sounded just like his archtop Style 5 or F. Neat Stanleytone.

But to call an original 5 string pre-war Granada of such historic provenance "just a Banjo" is a little much...

TimFoster - Posted - 04/09/2026:  11:48:50

And let's not forget the soft saturation and gentle compression of the old analog tape formulations... helping to even out those... wildly uncontrolled picking dynamics.





 

Jokes, folks ;-)

Culloden - Posted - 04/09/2026:  15:13:21

"Don't overthink it."
-David Cass Sr.

lightgauge - Posted - 04/10/2026:  03:59:18

If you have played it, share your experience and thoughts. If not, you are just speculating. Sonny said it was special and made him a better player. I tend to listen when he made comments.

1935tb-11 - Posted - 04/10/2026:  05:07:42

well i did get the opportunity to play 9584-2 and its is definitely a serious banjo. i still sounded like me playing a great banjo... but it was one of the few that i have had in my hands that just rattled your back bone. it is the most powerful banjo i have ever held without a doubt. now sonny ran bigger strings then i do which is part of it i would say but there is something about that banjo that is just different.
the first time i really noticed it was years ago ,, the osborne bros were doing a show in jekyll island on a (single mic) and when bobby was sing a lead part and sonny would do back up licks and he could walk around on stage anywhere he wanted and the banjo would still cut through no matter where he was on stage.
plus sonny had big strong hands which also makes lots of power.
so its a combo ,,but in the world of banjos,,,, that is a special banjo .

Ira Gitlin - Posted - 04/10/2026:  06:19:46

quote:

---

Originally posted by ChunoTheDog

When Ralph Stanley played a Gold Star flathead on his live in Japan album it sounded just like his archtop Style 5 or F. Neat Stanleytone.



But to call an original 5 string pre-war Granada of such historic provenance "just a Banjo" is a little much...

---

Tony Trischka told about how he heard Sonny playing a Stelling and mistook it for the Granada.

Cap - Posted - 04/10/2026:  06:40:08

Its the Musician not the Instrument.

RB3 - Posted - 04/10/2026:  09:25:52

I think Cap makes a good point. But it also makes you wonder about the judgment of these virtuoso banjo players. They all seem to have an irrational predilection for these rare old Gibson banjos. Sonny Osborne could have gotten himself a cheap bow tie arch top from the Sixties, or better still, a Deering Goodtime, that would have sounded just as good as his Granada, and then he could have put a six-figure price tag on the Granada and made a hefty profit by selling it to some amateur sucker with deep pockets. Instead, he continued to play the Granada. Why would he do that? You hate to disparage the great players we all venerate, but there must be something about becoming a virtuoso musician that just makes them stupid.

Owen - Posted - 04/10/2026:  09:45:42

Geez Wayne, from what I read on BHO I sometimes "wonder about" non-virtuoso banjo players too. [Present company excepted.]   Maybe "banjo" is the common factor?

Which reminds me of the old saying: "Methinks the whole world is crazy except me and thee; and sometimes I wonder about thee."

Ira Gitlin - Posted - 04/10/2026:  10:15:30

quote:

---

Originally posted by RB3

I think Cap makes a good point. But it also makes you wonder about the judgment of these virtuoso banjo players. They all seem to have an irrational predilection for these rare old Gibson banjos. Sonny Osborne could have gotten himself a cheap bow tie arch top from the Sixties, or better still, a Deering Goodtime, that would have sounded just as good as his Granada, and then he could have put a six-figure price tag on the Granada and made a hefty profit by selling it to some amateur sucker with deep pockets. Instead, he continued to play the Granada. Why would he do that? You hate to disparage the great players we all venerate, but there must be something about becoming a virtuoso musician that just makes them stupid.

---

Sometimes the difference is not entirely in the sound, but in the feel that enables you to play more easily, or to get that sound more easily.

BobbyE - Posted - 04/10/2026:  12:12:09

If this isn't correct someone please do correct it, but I seem to remember that Mr. Osborne bought the Granada from Tom McKinney. He was at his home for a meal and Mr. McKinney showed him the banjo and he played it for a bit and handed it back not that impressed. Later at some point he picked the banjo up again, changed his mind, and the rest, as they say, is history. No matter how good he was, and he was one of the greats, no doubt, there must have been something in this banjo that would make him set the Rockytop 3 down, which Aaron McDaris now owns and plays, and start using the Granada exclusively, other than the foray with the Stelling for a while.

Bobby

Jim E. - Posted - 04/10/2026:  12:54:13

I remember Sonny relating the story on acquiring the Granada from Tom McKinney. I also remember Sonny saying that he played the Stelling (which he liked) mostly because he didn't want to subject the Granada to the risks of travel. As others have said on this thread, the sound of any banjo is in no small measure a consequence of the player's hands and his/her musical skill. I agree.

Owen - Posted - 04/10/2026:  13:03:49

Risks of travel, you say??

I've never been to one, but I hear tell of places [back in the day??] that had a chicken wire "curtain" between the audience and the performers.   IIRC, Ronnie Hawkins spoke of having performed in such places.... maybe in Arkansas??

reubenstump - Posted - 04/10/2026:  13:20:48

In college I took some classes with a guy who was just plain smarter than me, by a long shot.

He went on to get a PhD in particle physics from Princeton, and then worked at Fermilab for several years before he got bored and moved on to something else.

He could think and see and understand things that I couldn't.

Edited by - reubenstump on 04/10/2026 13:29:26

Oldfives - Posted - 04/10/2026:  14:04:15

If Great players like Sonny, Earl, JD, Curtis McPeake, Charlie Cushman, Jim Mills etc, etc sounded as good on any banjo - why did they all want and primarily play the old pre war Mastertones they owned... Case Closed.

chuckv97 - Posted - 04/10/2026:  14:41:09

Speaking of Sonny here’s a good interview with him from 2008

vimeo.com/236637443?fbclid=IwZ...8KJwiiYfw

RB3 - Posted - 04/10/2026:  15:14:20

Thanks for posting that interview Chuck. It's terrific! He was always candid; if you asked him a question, you got a straight answer.

chuckv97 - Posted - 04/10/2026:  17:52:52

I saw the Osbornes at the folk club in Vancouver in the early spring of 1978, but I wasn’t banjo savvy back then and don’t know if he had the Granada yet. Sonny mentioned on his Chiefs thread years ago that it was the first time they had gone out for Chinese food.

Wayne,, just for fun, do you think Kentucky produced more top-level banjo players than North Carolina or Virginia?

Edited by - chuckv97 on 04/10/2026 17:55:21

Ira Gitlin - Posted - 04/11/2026:  06:18:52

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jim E.

I remember Sonny relating the story on acquiring the Granada from Tom McKinney. I also remember Sonny saying that he played the Stelling (which he liked) mostly because he didn't want to subject the Granada to the risks of travel. As others have said on this thread, the sound of any banjo is in no small measure a consequence of the player's hands and his/her musical skill. I agree.

---

Yes. The Tony Trischka story I reported above happened when they were both on tour in Sweden (?). Tony heard this big sound from the adjacent dressing room, was surprised that Sonny would fly with the Granada, and peeked in to discover that he was playing his Stelling.

RB3 - Posted - 04/11/2026:  06:41:31

Chuck,

I was born in Ohio and lived there for 45 years, so I'm not necessarily a fanboy for Kentucky.

I think I would give the edge to North Carolina.

Realbluegrassfan - Posted - 04/11/2026:  07:13:30

Not that my opinion matters, but I agree with Bobby (lightgauge) in that only those that have played Sonny's banjo, as well as other pre-war Gibson banjos, can asssess the difference between the banjos. Then again, different players have different preferences in their sound. I also agree with "reubenstump" in that not all professional players have the same ability to create the same sound with the same banjo (I think there is an agreement there) no matter their experience.

1935tb-11 - Posted - 04/11/2026:  09:43:22

i ain't saying its something magical about certain banjos ,, i am just saying you know it when you pick one up ,, pre war or not... it just so happens that 80% of the best sounding banjos that i have played were pre war gibsons.... could be a coincidence i don't know.
but the magic really happens in the right hands fer sure !

southerndrifter - Posted - 04/11/2026:  14:48:54

Having played it, I can add that Sonny's banjo 9584-2 has something most other banjos don't have......the "it" factor! I like the story of Sonny going to see the banjo for the first time and, after playing it, wasn't particularly impressed. But while sitting down to eat dinner with the seller (Tom McKinney), the banjo got in to Sonny's head. So, after dinner, Sonny went back and played the banjo some more. After that, he couldn't put it down, or leave without it! And Sonny told me personally that 9584-2 allowed him the ability to do things that he was never able to do with any other banjo. He said 9584-2 would chime in places that no other banjo would do. So, I am in agreement that the player makes most of the difference, but in the case of Sonny's banjo (9584-2), the instrument makes a difference too! I still regard it as the best sounding banjo I have ever played, and I have played a bunch of banjos!

1935tb-11 - Posted - 04/12/2026:  10:32:07

quote:

---

Originally posted by southerndrifter

Having played it, I can add that Sonny's banjo 9584-2 has something most other banjos don't have......the "it" factor! I like the story of Sonny going to see the banjo for the first time and, after playing it, wasn't particularly impressed. But while sitting down to eat dinner with the seller (Tom McKinney), the banjo got in to Sonny's head. So, after dinner, Sonny went back and played the banjo some more. After that, he couldn't put it down, or leave without it! And Sonny told me personally that 9584-2 allowed him the ability to do things that he was never able to do with any other banjo. He said 9584-2 would chime in places that no other banjo would do. So, I am in agreement that the player makes most of the difference, but in the case of Sonny's banjo (9584-2), the instrument makes a difference too! I still regard it as the best sounding banjo I have ever played, and I have played a bunch of banjos!

---

first time i  played sonnys banjo was at a festival somewhere,, i think jekyl island... but anyway they have a huge room across the foyer from the music hall and it is for banquets and meetings and stuff... they had tables set up for the performers  to sell their goods at... and i walked to sonny and said  ok how much weight you lost ?    we use to give each other fits abour losing weight... but he had the granada in the floor beside him... i looked around and nodded .. he  said well ok if you have too,,, just don't drop the #@%& thing.

    i took it out of the case and sat down in a chair ,a started to  pick it was just mind blowing ,,,  and sonny said hey watch this.... raymond fairchild has a table 2 slots down from him and  he hollared "hey raymond come look at this"   he comes walking up and listens for a minute and says ...hmmmm purty good banjo picker...  sonny said  to  him  "RAYMOND  HE'S PICKING IT UPSIDE DOWN"  .. raymond stepped back and cocked his head and said dang if he ain't....  me and sonny and bobby got the biggest kick out of that...  

    but that is my story of the first time i picked #2 of the famous lot... it sounded bunches better then #1 ever did  when i had the chances to  play it.

Dale Diehl - Posted - 04/17/2026:  14:54:08

Some years ago I got to hear the Osborns and like a fly on the wall I was able to hear two conversations. One between Sonny and an unnamed pro, and another between the afore mentioned pro and another unnamed pro who also built banjos.
In the first conversation they talked banjos and the music business. It was very interesting.

Later the second conversation was comical. The first pro told the other how disgusting Sonny's banjo was. It looked like he had eaten many meals over it. He relayed the fact that the strings were in terrible condition as was the rest of the instrument and that Sonny said he only changed a string when it broke and not the whole set. Saying it was shocking to see this truly iconic instrument from such a revered player in this condition. Non the less it sounded great.

stevo58 - Posted - 04/18/2026:  11:31:36

You know, years ago Jeff Beck was at some sort of show - probably NAMM. Apparently (this is all third hand) he was in a closed room with a Fender rep playing. All the guitar freaks were crouched outside of the door listening and guessing what gear he was using. When he left, they went in and discovered he had been playing an Asian Squier Strat through a Pignose. $400 worth of gear. This story may be apocryphal, or I may remember it incorrectly. I’m getting old, too.



I’m guessing that the truly great will sound like themselves regardless. For mere mortals, the instrument may have greater influence.



I don’t see any harm in obsessing about gear. It’s part of the hobby. Not many of us will reach that level. I know I never will.

On the other hand, in the early 80s I was playing a LOT of electric guitar. A Telecaster through a SF Vibrolux. I sat in with a band one night and used the guitarist's rig - an SG with a "small" Marshall stack. Out of politeness, I didn't touch any knobs. Afterwards he wouldn't leave me alone, asking me how I made his rig sound like a Tele through a Fender amp. That's about as close as I will ever come. 

Edited by - stevo58 on 04/18/2026 11:36:40