adamrhowe - Posted - 08/05/2022:  06:38:49

This was sparked by a banjo currently on ebay called 'George Houghton & son Melody Junior' with clear 'Melody' on the headstock. This made me think it must be a melody banjo right? or is it just a model name? However, most sources (including the seller) refer to it as a Ukulele banjo.

So what exactly is the difference between the melody banjo (the stepping stone between mandolin banjo and tenor banjo) and the ukulele banjo (apart from different tuning)? Which one came first?

The Old Timer - Posted - 08/05/2022:  07:03:19

I believe a melody banjo usually has a larger, near full size (11") head and is made for steel strings, compared to a banjo uke. It would be heavier and have a longer scale. The "melody banjo" quickly evolved into the tenor banjo.

Mostly, generally bigger than a banjo uke.

tdennis - Posted - 08/05/2022:  07:58:30

The above is correct, however, " Melody" was a brand name seen on George Houghton banjo ukuleles.

Edited by - tdennis on 08/05/2022 07:59:24

Tom Napper - Posted - 08/05/2022:  08:00:31

I believe that in the case of George Houghton and Sons, the name Melody was adopted as a brand- hence Melody Jo, Melody Major, Melody Junior etc used for various instruments of their manufacture, and not connected to the Melody Banjo as described by The Old Timer

vintagetenor - Posted - 08/05/2022:  08:05:33

Melody banjo is the term we mostly use today to describe a 4-string mandolin banjo.

Paramount called these melody banjos as their intended use was to play the melody in ensembles. Vega used the term 4-string mandolin banjo for their version of the same instrument.

beezaboy - Posted - 08/05/2022:  08:10:08

I concur with The Old Timer's response. A Melody Banjo is a Banjo Mandolin strung with just 4 strings. The head size for a Melody Banjo is going to be consistent with the head size of a Mandolin Banjo (10" - 11"). The Tenor Banjo pre-dated the Melody Banjo by several years and the Melody Banjo played no role in the evolution of the Tenor Banjo.
Depending on point-of-view most people think the Tenor Banjo was developed by J.B. Schall in 1907 and at that time it was named "Banjorine". Chas McNeil reported that he purchased a Vega Tenor Banjo in 1909.
The Four-String Banjo Mandolin (a/k/a Melody Banjo) did not make an appearance until 1914 (Bruno & Sons offering). I have some notes (not peer reviewed) that the Bruno 4-string Banjo Mandolin had a 10 1/2" rim and a 19 3/4" scale. It was a hybrid instrument developed to overcome some deficiencies with the Banjo Mandolin in the dance orchestras of that era.
The Banjo Ukulele was "invented" in 1916 by Jos. Bolander (some people claim Keech was the inventor). and had a small 7" - 8" head.

adamrhowe - Posted - 08/05/2022:  08:13:29

Thank you all :)

beezaboy - Posted - 08/05/2022:  09:05:17

Oops! The scale length I noted above for Bruno Melody Banjo from notes is wrong. Should be more like 12 3/4". 19 3/4" scale is more like Banjorine territory.

The Old Timer - Posted - 08/06/2022:  06:21:12

Thanks Beezaboy.

wuzapicker - Posted - 08/06/2022:  19:50:20

Just to say, the avitar on my posts is a 1921 Paramount Melody banjo. At this point I'm not sure the scale length. I think it was around 15 inches, but the tuning was the same as a violin. Those are incredibly rare. I am told, Wm. L. Lange made many more 5-String Paramount banjos than they did Melody Banjos. If you can find an old photo of Harry Reeser's band, "Ipanna Trubadors" or "Cliquot Club Eskimos" (same band, different sponsors) you will see two or three players with Paramount Melody banjos.

Lange also offered a Bb Melody Banjo with a 17" scale that tuned D, G, C, F. I have a 19" scale 17 fret Paramount Style A tenor which I have used with that tuning. It takes some getting used to.

In the 1920's Cliquot Club was a soda pop brand. Ipanna was a tooth powder brand. I remember Ipanna toothpaste from the 1950's.

Of course my posts on BH have become about as rare as Lang's original Paramount 5-Strings. :-)

Michael

writerrad - Posted - 08/06/2022:  20:09:39

First regards to one of my heros John Hoft/Beezaboy. He is usually right so why do I need to type.

The late Great Mike Holmes told me that these banjos were so similar that banjos built as melody banjos or uke banjos were often sold as one or the other depending on which was more fashionable. I think the only difference would be tuning. However, if it says "Melody" that should indicate it. Do not think it makes much of a difference which one you want to call it.

adamrhowe - Posted - 08/07/2022:  09:36:58

Great! Thanks everyone for the information. Very interesting! I'm trying to find a proper melody banjo but seems they are quite rare.

TLG - Posted - 08/07/2022:  12:36:24

I worked on a very nice Fairbanks/VEGA a few years ago, about a 10" head but can't remember what scale neck, it was what I would call a "Melody" banjo. I think the owner said he got it from Bernunzio.
Tom

tdennis - Posted - 08/07/2022:  13:01:25

It may not be a "proper" melody banjo, but there are many readily available & very affordable banjo mandolins on the market that could be strung w/ 4 strings. (BTW, banjo ukes & melody banjos are not interchangeable & have a very different voice & feel).

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 08/07/2022:  13:10:27

I totally agree with tdennis, and I'd say that just because a banjo says "Melody" on it, does not mean it's a melody banjo.

beezaboy - Posted - 08/07/2022:  16:18:41

Melody Banjos are scarce but can be found occasionally if you keep an eye out for one. Attached is some Vega stuff FYI.

1920 Vega Catalog

Vega Style K 2

Vega S/N 33029

 

beezaboy - Posted - 08/07/2022:  16:23:32

Here is a Washburn "Melody Banjo" which the owner furnished the scale. The scale on this one is 13 7/8"

Washburn "Melody Banjo" - Scale 13 7/8"

 

writerrad - Posted - 08/07/2022:  17:44:33

quote:

---

Originally posted by adamrhowe

Great! Thanks everyone for the information. Very interesting! I'm trying to find a proper melody banjo but seems they are quite rare.

---

I got the view that perhaps in the UK in the time this was happening the banjolin, though actually an American invention,. tended to have more popularity than the melody banjo, but perhaps that impression comes to me from the Ciros Club group who were all Americans who came over to snatch jobs left by British musicians sent into the Great War. 

The term melody banjo was just one company's term for a 4-string derivative of the mando banjo.  There were several other  banjos that were identical that had the different names that came out in both the UK and the USA from the late 1890s on. 

This was all in addition to mandolin and mandola banjoists (the tenor is the 4 string adaption of the 8 string mandola banjo) who simply put 4 strings on their banjos instead of 8 strings.   Al Capone himself was a mandola player who also played the mandola banjo and the tenor.

There were a whole series of mandolin and mandola derived banjos that rose and fell between the 1880s and say around 1920, with the tenor being the sole survivor.

Cottonmouth - Posted - 11/16/2022:  11:45:34

quote:

---

Originally posted by beezaboy

Melody Banjos are scarce but can be found occasionally if you keep an eye out for one. Attached is some Vega stuff FYI.

---

This is my conversion Melody Banjo. The rim is a 1922 Fairbanks-Vega Style S (10-1/8" Tu-ba-phone) mated with a 1924 neck from a Vega Little Wonder Melody Banjo. It has been improved with a John Balch goatskin head, an original Kershner tailpiece and a teak bridge.

By the way, the Little Wonder was located for me by Mr. John Hoft.

 

adamrhowe - Posted - 11/16/2022:  12:07:47

quote:

---

Originally posted by Cottonmouth

quote:

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Originally posted by beezaboy

Melody Banjos are scarce but can be found occasionally if you keep an eye out for one. Attached is some Vega stuff FYI.

---

This is my conversion Melody Banjo. The rim is a 1922 Fairbanks-Vega Style S (10-1/8" Tu-ba-phone) mated with a 1924 neck from a Vega Little Wonder Melody Banjo. It has been improved with a John Balch goatskin head, an original Kershner tailpiece and a teak bridge.

By the way, the Little Wonder was located for me by Mr. John Hoft.

---

great! thanks for sharing :)

vintagetenor - Posted - 11/16/2022:  12:24:25

I once owned a Little Wonder 4-string mandolin banjo and would like to own one again.

Mark Ralston - Posted - 11/17/2022:  04:05:02

Hey vintagetenor (Mike) - here's a link to some as-found pictures of an unlabeled melody banjo that was constructed with a "Little Wonder"-style tone ring. Also some "restored" pics.... was yours similar to this one ? I sold this one last spring.

facebook.com/media/set/?vanity...665963574

a sound clip of that no-name melody banjo..... youtube.com/watch?v=hjBHF6h8VZE

.... and a Clifftop memory - Curly Miller & Carole Ann Rose came into my booth one year at Clifftop and played the heck out of a couple of banjo mandolins. They said that they liked to string banjo-mandos with 4 strings (GDAE). I've started doing that using nylon strings...... have also strung a couple of larger-pot ukes GDAE..... fun to play.

 

vintagetenor - Posted - 11/17/2022:  04:47:40

Thanks, Mark. I enjoyed the video. The one I had was a Little Wonder. It was in near pristine condition except for a repaired heel crack.

Knows Picker - Posted - 11/17/2022:  06:58:12

It is funny to me that a "melody" banjo is considered quite rare and you will pay a premium for it.

Whereas a "mandolin banjo" will likely get you banned from polite society.

deke46 - Posted - 11/18/2022:  21:56:09

In his 1930 cattledog, A.O.Windsor has "Banjolins" in 4 or 8 string version. I recently sold my Windsor 4 string banjolin or melody banjo having been playing my J.G Abbott melody banjo and more recently a Vega conversion, started as a very clean Tu-Ba- Phone banjo-mandolin with a 10 15/16" head, engraved flanges and a late model resonator ( not pie-section ). As you can imagine the tone is very clean and bright, plenty of volume without the muddiness which gave b/mandolins such a bad rep.
I have original examples of the Vega Little Wonder (10 1/8"), Orpheum (10" ) and Abbott ( 11" ) melody banjos and all are great fun to play.
I have also converted several Little Wonder and Style K b/m`s to present with the recognizable Vega peghead shape, some of which have found their way back home to the States.
Deke.