lucass - Posted - 11/08/2021:  14:01:29

Hi BHO,

I have a chance to get my hands on a Bart Reiter Whyte Laydie Deluxe, serial number in the 300’s. Beautiful inlay work, bracket band, Birdseye maple neck. It’s stunning. What do y’all think the value is on this one?

jbalch - Posted - 11/08/2021:  14:51:05

Do you have photos? That is such an early banjo. I'd love to see what it looks like. Back then, Bart did more customization and sometimes used deluxe wood.



It is hard to say what a banjo like that should bring. They sell so infrequently now.



My Whyte Laydie Deluxe is a later example. It has a few custom features that definitely add value. Before I got it, I think it sold at George Gruhns for around $3200 . That might have been 6 or 7 years ago.

lucass - Posted - 11/08/2021:  15:10:44

No photos, just played it in a store where I’m staying on vacation. It’s definitely ebony fretboard, full inlay like yours john that I’ve seen pictures of online. Bracket band and Birdseye maple. I’m curious what it would fetch on the forum and if it’s worth taking home for awhile. I always like to have an out on pricy instruments in case money gets tight down the road :)

rcc56 - Posted - 11/08/2021:  15:33:11

It looks like the more recent, plainer models are selling for $1200 and up. Whyte Laydie's with nice inlays but plain woods and no bracket band have sold for listed prices of $1500 to $1800 sometime in the not too distant past.  My references are the sold listings on reverb, gbase.com, and banjobuyer.com.



Birdseye maple and a bracket band should bring more, assuming the instrument has been well taken care of. How much more? I don't know.

Edited by - rcc56 on 11/08/2021 15:35:09

Gitfiddle Emporium - Posted - 11/08/2021:  16:38:22

I have been seeing the bracket band Reiter WLs hovering around $2000, not sure how many have sold. However, I think his fancy inlaid banjos command higher prices and sell quickly when they appear. I can't imagine this wouldn't be a solid investment if the price is good. I especially like Reiters that have better than average wood.

jbalch - Posted - 11/08/2021:  16:57:23

quote:

---

Originally posted by lucass

No photos, just played it in a store where I’m staying on vacation. It’s definitely ebony fretboard, full inlay like yours john that I’ve seen pictures of online. Bracket band and Birdseye maple. I’m curious what it would fetch on the forum and if it’s worth taking home for awhile. I always like to have an out on pricy instruments in case money gets tight down the road :)

---

The one photographed on my BHO homepage is a "standard" 1995 WL Deluxe.  The one I mentioned above has all the features of that banjo plus a rare bound peghead and a cool overlay on the dowel stick. It is on the left in the photo below.

There is a bracket-band Whyte Laydie at elderly now for $2500.  But it doesn't have the engraved #9 style inlay like the deluxe.

The WL Deluxe was Bart's top-of-the-line regular model.  

Edited by - jbalch on 11/08/2021 17:01:55

 

Bill Rogers - Posted - 11/08/2021:  17:26:20

Depends on why you want it. Because of its beauty or because you see it also as a great player you will use. In the latter case maybe $2,750+. I’d grab jt for under $2,500.

mikehalloran - Posted - 11/08/2021:  18:23:13

quote:

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Originally posted by Bill Rogers

Depends on why you want it. Because of its beauty or because you see it also as a great player you will use. In the latter case maybe $2,750+. I’d grab jt for under $2,500.

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What Bill says.

Bart's fancy banjos have superb inlays and superior workmanship. I would consider anything under #3k a bargain.

ceemonster - Posted - 11/08/2021:  20:20:19

If the condition is pristine it's probably worth $3000--$3500. Again, that would be if pristine.



To put it in perspective, North American Guitar currently has a later-model Reiter Tubaphone with a maple neck and the simple "Galax" or "Round Peak" style star on the headstock, star on the 5th fret inlay, at $2500. It's listed as used, but apparently in like-new condition. They had two identical examples for a long time, one must have moved. Would love to know the story behind their acquisition of those twin Tubaphones:



thenorthamericanguitar.com/pro...-owned-1#

Edited by - ceemonster on 11/08/2021 20:21:34

Bill Rogers - Posted - 11/09/2021:  00:45:19

Bart quit making tubbies at least several years before he retired. He made banjos with electric-style scalloped rings, typically called “Galax” or “Regent,” but rarely “White Lady,” pretty close to when he quit. So Reiter banjos with electric-style rings are much more common than the tubbies. Of course his true copies of either Vega banjo, the ones with bracket bands, were early and scarce.

Banner Blue - Posted - 11/09/2021:  08:16:51

Condition makes a big difference in value and particularly speed of sale. Really clean banjos sell faster for more money.

The price of an unsold banjo is only evidence of a price ceiling.

When Bart Reiter was making banjos they were a commodity. I could go buy a dozen and given a bit of time, a dozen more would be available for sale again. Now that he is retired there is a finite and dwindling supply. This creates a premium to some extent. The extent of that premium is unknown to me.

KCJones - Posted - 11/09/2021:  08:30:06

The difficulty with determining values on these early Bart Reiters is that there is almost no volume, very little data on past sale prices, and when they do pop up they sell very quickly. I've personally seen a range of around $2500-$2750 for the "#2" style with the griffin headstock. $3000-$3250 for the "Deluxe" model with the full neck inlays. Check the Banjo Buyer "make archive" for past confirmed sales and prices, which support this value range.



The non-bracket band versions with an electric tone ring, simple inlays, and hook-shoe construction aren't comparable at all and have no bearing on the value of the early Deluxe and #2 models.



Look for finish checking. Finish checking has been seen on many early Bart Reiter necks, although this is mostly cosmetic and does not appear to (significantly) affect value.



IMO the one currently listed on Elderly is underpriced (for a retail sale) and will sell quickly.

Edited by - KCJones on 11/09/2021 08:31:57

ceemonster - Posted - 11/09/2021:  14:22:21

Gryphon had two No. 2s in 2020 or 2020 to early months of this year maybe 8 or 9 months apart. Neither was listed a week. I think the first was high $1k's-ish, the second low $2k's-ish.

Bill Rogers - Posted - 11/09/2021:  15:28:00

quote:

---

Originally posted by KCJones

...The non-bracket band versions with an electric tone ring, simple inlays, and hook-shoe construction aren't comparable at all and have no bearing on the value of the early Deluxe and #2 ...



 

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True, but with the possible exception of the bracket-band ones, if you want a Reiter for sound and playability, I think the old fancy ones offer no particular advantage over newer ones with the same wood & tone ring. 

rcc56 - Posted - 11/09/2021:  15:59:08

Reiter banjos might become collectible sooner or later.

mikehalloran - Posted - 11/09/2021:  18:01:36

quote:

---

Originally posted by KCJones

The difficulty with determining values on these early Bart Reiters is that there is almost no volume, very little data on past sale prices, and when they do pop up they sell very quickly. I've personally seen a range of around $2500-$2750 for the "#2" style with the griffin headstock. $3000-$3250 for the "Deluxe" model with the full neck inlays. Check the Banjo Buyer "make archive" for past confirmed sales and prices, which support this value range.



…

IMO the one currently listed on Elderly is underpriced (for a retail sale) and will sell quickly.

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Agreed

elderly.com/products/bart-reit...725621439

If one spends too much time around here waiting for everyone to agree on the price (or whatever), it will be gone to someone else.

I know that I would never sell my Vegaphone conversion for anything near that. I understand this is one of a dozen similar necks he built in 1991.

Hmmmm... I need to take some better pictures.

ceemonster - Posted - 11/10/2021:  15:46:36

OK just hypothetically let's say the example under consideration here was in immaculate condition. Wouldn't YOU like to have a beautiful Whyte Laydie No. 9 in blonde Birdseye maple with a modern scale length and the most comfortable neck build known to man? Hell, I know I would. And I don't even like bracket bands.

jbalch - Posted - 11/10/2021:  17:53:18

One question I always ask is: If you wanted to commission a banjo with these features from a current custom builder - what would you expect to pay? If I'm not mistaken, many relatively-simple custom banjos start around $3k. I assume that a banjo with #9 style engraved inlay and a whyte laydie rim with bracket band might cost a bit more.

Another way to look at is is:  In the mid 1990s when I bought my first custom Reiter, I think a WL Deluxe sold for around $2k.  Adjusted for inflation, that would be at least $3700 today.  

....  just sayin' 

BeeEnvironment - Posted - 11/10/2021:  17:58:31

One of the best banjos I have ever heard of (but cannot afford, alas), is the Gold Tone OT-800 Long-Neck with a tubaphone tone ring. Its price of ~1500 is not bad at all.

All of these White Laydie images somehow reminded me of it....

Russ A.

rcc56 - Posted - 11/10/2021:  18:44:25

A Bart Reiter Whyte Laydie Deluxe with engraved #7 inlays, lightly flamed maple neck, and plain maple rim sold in the classifieds 2 years ago at a listed price of $3200. banjobuyer.com/banjo/71566 I did not find any other listings for a Deluxe model.



Considering the work involved in creating such an instrument, I would call that a low price.



If such a banjo were to come into my possession for resale, I would ask more. But the lack of similar items on the market makes pricing such an instrument a matter of conjecture.

The bottom line is that the market determines the prices. Instruments that are priced correctly or too low sell. The ones that are priced too high do not.



FWIW, original Fairbanks and Vega Whyte Laydie #7's in decent original condition bring $7000 and up, depending on the year, condition, desirability of the individual instrument's specs, and who is selling it.

Russ, if you can get a little work and save up some money, you can get a pre-war Tubaphone tenor with a modern neck for $1200 - $1500.  If you are handy with tools, you can find an unconverted style M tenor for $800, and make and install a plain neck with a pre-slotted fingerboard for under $250 in materials, including tuners, fret wire, nut, pip, and a can of spray lacquer.

Edited by - rcc56 on 11/10/2021 19:02:35

sugarinthegourd - Posted - 11/17/2021:  19:05:29

So what did you decide to do, lucass?

lucass - Posted - 11/17/2021:  19:28:36

I ended up passing on it sugarinthegourd .

I have a Reiter Regent that is very similar and I felt the two were redundant. However, judging from the responses here, it’s a good price that the store is offering and someone should swoop it up. If you want a bracket banded whyte laydie you won’t find any better. DM me if anyone is interested and I’ll pass on the info.

longneckpat - Posted - 11/24/2021:  15:56:14

Hello from Cork Ireland.

Minty 1998 Reiter Deluxe. I'm the original owner and it's reputedly the last Deluxe built by Bart.

I got all the hardware chrome plated. I upgraded tuners to engraved Waverly's also chrome plated. 28 bracket band. No nicks, no finish checking, engraved inlay on heel plate, and excellent tweed TKL hard case. Any good estimation of current value?

Cheers, Pat

Edited by - longneckpat on 11/24/2021 16:02:20

longneckpat - Posted - 11/24/2021:  16:13:02

Photo links:

banjohangout.org/photo/280833

banjohangout.org/photo/280834

banjohangout.org/photo/280835

Edited by - longneckpat on 11/24/2021 16:14:42

sugarinthegourd - Posted - 11/25/2021:  09:52:09

quote:

---

Originally posted by longneckpat

Hello from Cork Ireland.

Minty 1998 Reiter Deluxe. I'm the original owner and it's reputedly the last Deluxe built by Bart.

I got all the hardware chrome plated. I upgraded tuners to engraved Waverly's also chrome plated. 28 bracket band. No nicks, no finish checking, engraved inlay on heel plate, and excellent tweed TKL hard case. Any good estimation of current value?

Cheers, Pat

---

Hi Pat, it's hard to say. It's a beauty. I don't know if the chrome plating helps or hurts. I'd rather have nickel and I suspect that others who would be interested in this banjo might share that more traditional preference. 

I would guess $2250 if you were in the States. Others may have more knowledge about specifics of your example vs others that have sold recently. And I don't know what the market in Ireland or Europe looks like. There's lower demand, but also fewer banjos, though that ratio may be changing with all the good builders who I see popping up over there. 

 

Not much help, but maybe my reply will prompt others to chime in. And of course you can always list it here, on Mandolincafe, or on Reverb, with the asking price set at what you'd like to get, and see what offers come in. 

rcc56 - Posted - 11/25/2021:  11:06:40

I think that with the style 9 engraved inlays that the market value would be higher than $2250.

It's a rare model, though, and there's nothing recent to compare it to.

There was the Whyte Laydie with #7 that I mentioned earlier that sold  2 years ago at a listed price of $3200 US.  And at least for the moment, the market is in better shape than it was then.

Edited by - rcc56 on 11/25/2021 11:08:41