revellfa - Posted - 08/31/2016:  11:08:57

Does a hide head pull on the flange anymore than a modern Mylar head at the same tension?  I really want to put a hide head on dads prewar but it already has a warped flange and I don't want to break a prewar Opf.  Any idea which is harder on a flange--Mylar or hide?

steve davis - Posted - 08/31/2016:  11:12:26

It's the tension rather than the material.
Either head can be tightened enough to do harm to the flange.

Helix - Posted - 08/31/2016:  11:12:56

Quickly, others will know, I suggest a new flange and just park the old one in a towel and put away. Then John of the Balch people has it figured out, I really dig the sound of them, and keep a drum key.

steve davis - Posted - 08/31/2016:  11:14:56

Don't tighten beyond G#.

thumbdropper - Posted - 08/31/2016:  17:53:59

quote:

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Originally posted by steve davis

 

Don't tighten beyond G#.

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Couldn't the tension that produces G# on a mylar head be different from that which produces G# on a hide?  Couldn't the G# tension be different for any two hides?  There's a lot of variability among animals, even within one species.

thumbdropper - Posted - 08/31/2016:  17:58:44

quote:

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Originally posted by Helix

 

Quickly, others will know, I suggest a new flange and just park the old one in a towel and put away. Then John of the Balch people has it figured out, I really dig the sound of them, and keep a drum key.

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Excellent suggestion; preserve the original part in case later you want to put the original combination in a museum, or have to sell it to someone who cares about such things.

revellfa - Posted - 08/31/2016:  18:04:48

quote:

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Originally posted by thumbdropper

 

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve davis

 

Don't tighten beyond G#.

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Couldn't the tension that produces G# on a mylar head be different from that which produces G# on a hide?  Couldn't the G# tension be different for any two hides?  There's a lot of variability among animals, even within one species.

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That's what I'm wondering.

steve davis - Posted - 09/01/2016:  07:01:28

A note is an indicator of tension,Paul.
Have you found head notes to have different tensions among hide heads?

bartmcneil - Posted - 09/01/2016:  07:50:59

The tension on a hide head will be all over the map because of humidity changes. If you want stability over time use the Mylar head. However your banjo was built to handle the changing tension of a hide head. Perhaps your warped flange is due to it being dropped at one time. If so it can most likely be straightened out. I suspect you are making a mountain out of a mole hill. It can be straightened out. just as brass instruments can be straightened out after being dropped and dinged..

Edited by - bartmcneil on 09/01/2016 08:01:15

Banjophobic - Posted - 09/01/2016:  08:01:14

Actually the flange material makes a difference, as does the age. Zamac (pot metal zinc) is not as strong as brass. OPF a zinc and as it ages it becomes more prone to breakage. Brass material is much stronger in general. Two piece flanges had brass and the design itself was stronger because of that, and the design itself. I would avoid using excess pressure on any warped flange, particularly zinc ones.

As to tension, tension is just tension and it doesn't matter what the material is in that regard. You decide the amount of tension . G sharp is G sharp and A is A,etc, regardless of the material used. You can break a flange with either Mylar or hide. If the flange is severely warped I would take the earlier advice and just park it and use a modern replacement. 

revellfa - Posted - 09/01/2016:  10:31:05

quote:

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Originally posted by bartmcneil

 

The tension on a hide head will be all over the map because of humidity changes. If you want stability over time use the Mylar head. However your banjo was built to handle the changing tension of a hide head. Perhaps your warped flange is due to it being dropped at one time. If so it can most likely be straightened out. I suspect you are making a mountain out of a mole hill. It can be straightened out. just as brass instruments can be straightened out after being dropped and dinged..

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Hi there.  I am making a bit of a mountian out of a mole hill I think.  It's just that it's a pre-war OPF and it belonged to my dad so I don't want anything bad to happen to it.  How would I go about straightening it out?

steve davis - Posted - 09/01/2016:  10:43:37

I straightened a '29 opf by mounting it upside down on a spare rim and maintaining a tension of a tight quarter under a 10" straightedge over a period of around 8 months.
I would check my progress weekly measured from the top of my pool table.It returned to flat.
They are weaker after once curling,but a consistent tension can be maintained that won't recurl.

I would watch very carefully a flange that had once curled at a head tension north of G.

bartmcneil - Posted - 09/01/2016:  14:47:32

I am not sure you could straighten it out unless you are a machinist and have the equipment. But surely it can be done. Check with someone who repairs instruments and they should know who does that sort of thing. I am guessing it would be rather expensive but it is worth checking out to get an estimate.

J.Albert - Posted - 09/01/2016:  15:09:56

I agree with the others above who suggested replacing the warped flange with a modern one, and set the original aside for safekeeping...

mutantmoose - Posted - 09/01/2016:  15:42:11

When I replaced a warped OPF, the pot needed some work to true it up to support the new, straight flange. 

Perhaps you should do some very careful measurements of your pot to see how out of round it is. I suspect the flange warps when the pot warps, although I could be totally wrong about that, and would welcome correction. 

Gerrit - Posted - 09/02/2016:  02:02:04

quote:

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Originally posted by thumbdropper

 

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve davis

 

Don't tighten beyond G#.

---

Couldn't the tension that produces G# on a mylar head be different from that which produces G# on a hide?  Couldn't the G# tension be different for any two hides?  There's a lot of variability among animals, even within one species.

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Compare the head to a string: to reach a certain pitch, say G#, the thicker the string, the more tension is needed.