rdump - Posted - 05/18/2015:  19:29:44

I just had a rather unfortunate experience with the "Purple Platform".  I'd not used it before.  Based on today's experience, I now know it's not usable or safe, so I'll be skipping it for any other BHO-related things until they fix the structural problems and allow download of purchased content instead of forcing a tracking+ app.

In a previous post, our esteemed site leader stated:

"We actually sell videos two different ways on the site. One way is through the Purple Platform, where you can buy digital versions of DVDs from popular publishers like Homespun, Acutab, The Murphy Method, etc. You can access that here. As far as I know this platform is nice and secure and working properly--I've never had any security issues with it."

The security and support issues I had with it were as follows:

1) The Purple Platform advertises content for download.  However, what they actually provide are apps and streaming cloudy services, not the video downloads you might think you're purchasing based on the presentation and explicit advertising.  It may be possible to capture the video as it streams past, or to convince one of their apps to let you save aside a copy, but I couldn't get there because...

2) The Purple Platform doesn't have linux apps.  That rules out using my main system for the videos.

3) The Purple Platform Mac OS X option is a questionable unsigned app.  Yes, I've been a developer, sysadmin, and security engineer for 30+ years, so I do know how to run Mac OS X apps anyway in that situation.  However, because of what the Mac is used for at work, I don't grant my account admin privs, nor would I crack it and use such privs to install a possible carrier of other things.  (Also, I can't justify the time to disassemble and analyze the app; better to spend it practicing the banjo. ;) )

4) The Purple Platform iOS options, while vetted by Apple's iOS behavior and code analysis process, only run on the latest iPhones and iPod Touch models.  Since I'm a banjo player, my iPod Touch is far too ancient for that option.

In the Purple Platform's favor, they're in the process of refunding my purchase.  I pointed out that they had after the fact, and unilaterally, switched what they were providing.  Instead of the advertised downloadable Murphy Method video, they were really selling apps that I couldn't run.  They said they'd get right on the refund.

Buy the DVDs instead if it's an option.  Else... dang, I was considering Dan Levenson video lessons, but if those are stuck in the "Purple Platform" too, that's simply not going to work.

Edited by - rdump on 05/19/2015 08:19:39

schlange - Posted - 05/19/2015:  08:39:42

Sorry you weren't happy with your experience, Richard. The folks at Purple seem to be good about refunding folks when they aren't satisfied, so that's good.

There simply isn't a better platform that I've found for delivering this content. Some of your issues above are concerns, yes, but I would say they only effect a small portion of the population.

The Purple Platform DOES allow for downloads... you install the software, download your videos, then you can watch them offline whenever you'd like. Because of your Max OS X situation you weren't able to experience that, but most people on a Mac won't be in your situation--they'll have admin privs.

Of course, the option of buying the actual DVDs is always there. Me, I don't think I'll ever buy another lesson DVD. I like the immediacy and accessibility of having the videos available on any screen I want, as soon as I purchase them. And digital downloads don't get scratched. :-)

rdump - Posted - 05/19/2015:  13:19:54

Actually, there are more Mac users without admin privs around than is typically supposed by developers. For just some examples we have schools, households with shared computers, and many enterprise networks where admin/sudo rights have to be controlled.

Single home users, for sure, often have the Apple defaults of the first user automatically getting admin rights. And I'm dealing with more of the fallout from that after lunch with some of my poor visiting users.

So I'm perplexed, in a tongue in cheek way, at the "better platform for delivering this content" comment. What's the need for or purpose of a "platform" at all (whether or not delivered as an after-purchase surprise)? What's wrong with the web browser and video playback software the purchaser already has as part of their OS? What's wrong with a referral to VLC if the purchaser doesn't already have a good playback option?

Perhaps they feel they must have their app running natively on the purchaser's machine because they can't otherwise restrict the purchaser's playback options? Perhaps they need the platform running natively on the purchaser's computer to collect other data from it (contacts, calendar, ...)? Perhaps they need it to monetize further with advertising displays?

Having written ecommerce software for downloadable content repeatedly since 1995, I know from experience there's no serious need for a mediating "platform" other than to serve those kinds of ulterior motives. Further, when the platform comes along only as an after-purchase surprise, ulterior motives for such deception have to be considered more likely.

From your very carefully worded description, I now know the app is mostly intended to restrict playback options. The goal would be to prevent me transcoding it for my iPod so I can use it in the practice room, thereby trying to force me to move my instruments down in front of the computer desk. That's pretty much unacceptable for content that I have -purchased- to fairly use as I need.

Hmm, I was kind of blunt there, wasn't I. Dismissal of real issues caused me to take the gloves off and say more of what I really feared was going on. ;)

Now I'm going to go back to work after my lunch here, and deal with the 5th machine in 2 days where my visiting users downloaded an 'app' to get at content they wanted to watch. Apps are the second most common way the botnets grow (malicious ads inserted into otherwise legit web ad networks are the most common). The problem is very real.

My bottom line: Until Purple Platform allows download of content as advertised, rather than doing a "Surprise! You gotta run our app!" -after- the purchase, I'll be skipping them. Can't really trust 'em.

schlange - Posted - 05/19/2015:  13:36:15

Maybe they realize that publishers aren't interested in selling raw video downloads that can easily be uploaded to a file sharing service for the world to access? That would be my guess. The Purple Platform offers some level of security for the video creators, which I believe is why so many publishers have chosen to use the platform.

This isn't an "ulterior motive" (as you say it)--if I was trying to develop a successful platform for selling videos formerly only available on DVD, I would probably do something very similar. Otherwise, you won't have any videos to sell, because publishers won't trust your platform. Does that make sense to you? Agree, disagree?

Also: I thought I made it pretty clear on the Banjo Lesson Videos homepage that you can play the videos online, or use their software for offline playing. It says:

How Are Videos Delivered?

Lessons can be viewed instantly on any device using the cloud player, or install the desktop software to download videos for offline viewing. 

I'm not trying to dismiss any real issues, so no need to get angry with me... we're all friends here.

banjothrasher - Posted - 05/19/2015:  23:57:01

I bought a clawhammer course delivered via platform purple last night.  Have bought videos before without issue.

This one came with a book of tab but they've placed a large diagonal watermark on every page with my email address and some code numbers on it.  I had no intention of sharing it but I'm finding the grey coloured watermark quite distracting as the tab is hand written and not always clear and is on top of the watermark.

I can understand their intent but in this case I think its a poor implementation of security precautions.  I'm sure a more discrete watermark would have the same effect.

rdump - Posted - 05/20/2015:  08:13:17

Oh, friends indeed. I'm not angry with you, but there is a real problem with what happened.

I trusted in friendly good will based on the advertising of 'download the video' on the Murphy Method site where I first was introduced to the Purple Platform. But, in retrospect, the honest term for what the Purple Platform did is "bait and switch". Because of the slap in the face nature of that act, including their implicit accusation of my being a thief, it was a hard thing to respond with kindness and respect. But they really didn't mean to be so nasty; they just weren't thinking. (There I go with the trust again. ;) )

You bring up the red herring of lost sales due to filesharing. There's not a lot of data to back up that assertion; it's more folklore and shamanism than science, still. It's hard to get to science when large lobbying organizations are aggressively promoting a message that might be undermined by critical examination, even when reality might not be as bad as they fear.

We do at least have multiple anecdotes of sales increases due to free copies being available. The Dead were big because of a culture of sharing. Doctorow has numbers showing correlation of sales with free copies. For smaller niche things like banjo lessons, though, I don't know what part of that might even apply.

On the personal front, I strongly prefer to buy, rather than rent. If I buy, I own my personal copy, to fairly use as I need. Perhaps more importantly, the artist/producer gets paid, so they can pay their rents ;), and might also have time to do more cool stuff. Heck, I often buy things I don't need, so the artist might be incentivized to create more, because I like the direction they're going.

Much worry could have been avoided if the Purple Platform had disclosed up front that they were offering only rental, not purchase. Specifically, they do only rental where:

1) You have to run their captive player
2) Their captive player restricts the OSes you can use
3) You are at their mercy for software updates to keep up with OS changes (so that if they unilaterally decide to cut your OS or version out of support you have no more content, c.f. the iPod Touch 3rd gen)
4) They can unilaterally take back the content when they decide you're not to have it any more (ironically, Amazon did -exactly- that with, of all things, Orwell's "1984")

In other words, they have to remain in business, and you have to remain in their good graces, for you to continue enjoying the rental. They have your money either way.

If the Purple Platform had stated up front they're doing that, I'd have skipped trying the download and gone straight for the DVD (which I can transcode for the iPod, sweet!). Instead, they tricked me, so I had to plead with them for a refund. And I am thereby motivated to complain and warn others about the tricksy business being done.

I applaud -you- for almost sufficiently disclosing up front that the video lessons through BHO are only rentals at the mercy of the platform. You save much time and angst by doing that. You're not trying to be tricksy; you're attempting to be open and honest up front.

Sadly, I likely won't be partaking in those rentals on general principles. As well, there are the harder facts that the platform chosen isn't safe (they're not even able to agree to Apple's minimal responsibility requirements for a Mac OS X code signing cert), and it doesn't work generally.

But that loss of sales is exactly why the most rental operations don't disclose up front what they are, and instead switch after the payment is made once someone takes the purchase bait, isn't it?

There are more respectful ways to be found than "surprise! DRM! you lose because you run something we don't support!" or "surprise! visible watermarking that breaks readability!" ;) The Purple Platform isn't, presently, that good option.

JimInAlabama - Posted - 05/20/2015:  09:04:53

I'm surprised that a developer/sysadmin/security engineer expert would publicly thrash BHO and a legit video provider such as PlatformPurple, and I will resist the urge to thrash back!!  I'm sure Eric is correct in that it's all about protecting the content from unauthorized distribution.

I bought a lesson set last year from a popular online music retailer who uses Purple as the delivery/playback method and I was ok with the fact they use Purple.  It works great for me on my Mac and iPad.  Before I bought it I read all the terms and disclaimers.  I knew what I was buying and there was nothing shady or deceptive,  I wouldn't hesitate to use it again.  As far as the "untrusted" status of the download, that's not uncommon, some developers choose not to spend the time and money to have apps verified by Apple as "trusted".  It's up to the user to decide whether they want to trust it or not.

Concerning watermarks ... I received the accompanying tabs to my lesson in both TEF and PDF and there are no watermarks.  Do your watermarks indicate Purple?  or the seller/course developer?

rdump - Posted - 05/21/2015:  07:35:10

Sorry you feel that way, Jim. While you suggest "thrashing", I see it as an honest review of a problem situation involving a fundamental dishonesty. I don't think we're that far apart.

In your case, you had disclosure up front about Purple Platform being a rental and DRM shop, and you were fine with renting controlled media. That's good, informed choice, and it works for you.

Contrast that with what happens when the site has a "download version" button next to the "dvd version" button, with no such disclosure. The deception that Purple Platform engaged in at least deserves to be pointed out. They're part of a general problem, but the specifics of how they went about it are instructional. And maybe they can solve the trust problem by being honest up front in the future.

Until Shlange's clarification, I wasn't even sure what the Purple Platform's ulterior motive was for failing to disclose in advance that they're a rental shop. Now I know they fail to disclose because they don't want to lose sales interest. While you were OK with renting, being all about DRM and device restriction is a turnoff for some potential customers.

I again applaud Shlange's statement about the player requirement. That starts to tip the DRM hand, especially for those who run Linux and who see that "not for you!" sign frequently. Those who reach the Purple Platform via BHO's lesson videos would thus get some real info, as you did. BHO should probably still list the (actually ;) ) supported platforms, so those of us who don't run them can see right away that were SOL.

Anyway, maybe with more widespread honest disclosure in place of bait and switch on the download option, there will then be less worry in response to the trickery. Those who cannot run one of the Purple Platform's supported OSes, or run their app, or get around the bugs in their app (take a look at the iOS and android version reviews...), or who just prefer to buy rather than rent, can thereby be better informed in advance.

Me, well, I'm looking forward to my Murphy Method DVDs, purchased because of a BHO special. Here's to honesty, forthrightness, restoring trust, and keeping on getting better.

JimInAlabama - Posted - 05/21/2015:  11:03:08

The product I bought was from Elderly Instruments' website.  When I clicked on the "purchase download" button, it took me to the PlatformPurple page which had links to everything I needed to know before I agreed to purchase ... who/what they are, options to view the product, compatible devices, etc.

Just for the benefit of anyone who may stumble across this thread and be frightened by this thread ......

If you purchase a digital download of a DVD which is delivered via PlatformPurple you will have two options to view the DVD: you can view it via the Cloud if you have an Internet connection, or you can download their player and play it anytime.  It is not a rental store.  It is protected, which means you can't upload it online or make copies.

If you want more than that ...... BUY THE ACTUAL DVD AND HAVE IT SHIPPED TO YOU!!   

rdump - Posted - 05/22/2015:  07:52:55

Good summary, except for the rental statement, and except for missing the parts about the app supportability/bugs, and except for missing the part that in my case and others there was no disclosure that it was a rental in place of a purchase until after I'd already paid. ;)

When you buy something, the purchaser doesn't control how you can use it (play it back, in the case of a video). Nor can the shop take it away from you when they unilaterally decide you don't deserve it any more. The Purple Platform does the first with their app requirement, and by the nature of their app reserves the ability to do the second. This means you don't actually own what you paid for from the Purple Platform; you're only renting it.

The Purple Platform app doesn't run at all on Linux, is unsafe to run on Mac OS, doesn't run on older Apple iOS devices that still do video playback fine, and is the subject of frequent complaints regarding bugs causing playback problems in app store reviews.

In the case of the Purple Platform, they convert what was advertised as a sale of a video into a rental of a video through their app. Be aware of this rental conversion, going in, for those sites that don't disclose the rental nature before payment.

If you're OK with renting (and doing so under unspecified lease terms), enjoy the Purple Platform. Else:

1) Get the DVD and transcode the contents for playback on Linux, older iOS devices, etc.
or
2) Don't hesitate to buy video from other platforms that sell you video instead of an app. They do exist.

Here's a thought experiment: How about a sales platform that sells video in multiple formats, with medium quality video streaming access at a low price tier, and personalized copies of higher quality downloads at a slightly higher price tier. Maybe the personalization would be via "Ex Libris {Honored Purchaser Name Here}" on video title/chapter info bars, or via transcode-surviving steganographic watermarks embedded in the video stream, or both. Yes, I helped write such a system, but I don't know who bought the code when the company was sold. ;)