ChiefBrody - Posted - 10/02/2014:  08:26:05

Hi all. I'm a novice with only a couple of months practice behind me but have made the switch to nylon strings and thought I'd share my experience so far. . I find that every time I hear something on here that really grabs me, the strings are either nylon or nylgut. After reading Old Woodchuck speaking highly of Chris Sands strings, I bought a set. I love the sound on my modest open back. I've not long graduated from the basic frailing stroke so I'm not yet getting the best out of the strings but I do really like the sound when I play the few tunes I know.

I was worried about the strings breaking and have indeed had 2 breakages both times on the 5th string. I have tied the strings in bowline knots and the 2 breakages seem to have happened in between the tailpiece and the bridge. Not sure why. I would have thought the break would have happened at the tail piece if anywhere. Luckily, I had plenty of string left.  I still have to slightly widen the nuts slots. The strings don't pop out but it is very tight up there. The 5th string pip also need to be widened. The 5th string doesn't come close to fitting in the slot and is currently perched on a bridge pin capo. I ordered a new bridge specifically for these strings from Clifford Essex to replace the bog standard $5 bridge. Despite being advertised for use with nylon and gut strings, I still feel the slots need slightly widened. Finally, I am running into difficulties with 1st string pull-offs. The 1st string/second fret pull-off seems to pop up a lot in some of the tunes I play and I'm struggling with it while using nylon strings. With steel strings, I'd just hit the fretted note and lightly pull down off the string. If I do that with these, the string seems to twang off the fret board. I know it will come with practice. If I 'hammer off' rather than pull-off, the sound of that second note lacks a lot of distinction. Something I will work on. Apart from that, I'm really enjoying the sounds of these strings.

jonredmond - Posted - 10/02/2014:  16:28:12

I had the same problem with the first string pulling off the fret board on my Goodtime. So, I loosened the nut (after using a razor blade to cut the finish at the joint)  and tapped it with a hammer to shift it up and give the first string a little more room. I then filed the extra off the top end of the nut. I suppose you could have a new nut cut but this seems to work fine. My fretboard has plenty of room so that the 4th string still frets fine.

banjered - Posted - 10/02/2014:  17:30:12

Just use a piece of folded sandpaper to customize those slots. I like best the Fielding tailpiece  from Elderly.com for nylon strings. No burrs anywhere touching those strings! Use the search engine on the upper left of this page for more nylon tips. Banjered

wyomingirl - Posted - 10/02/2014:  23:53:04

I've found that if I have my 5th banjo string tuned up to A (like in open A tuning or, double D) they tend to break. I've messed around with a lot of different diameter fishing lines, all sorts of brands of nylon strings and nothing lasts too long w/o breaking (in all manner of random places, so it's not a burr, or sharp spot--just a tension/strength issue). Out of necessity, I've kept mixed strings on some banjos, running a steal string on the 1st (and sometimes also the 5th) strings, and I love the way it sounds a plays. Give it a try sometime. Also I keep a little needle file on hand for modifying bridge&nut&pip slots. I keep a collection of about a dozen bridges on hand (part set for nylon, part for steel); bridges are a super easy, fun way to change the way your banjo sounds. Enjoy!

ChiefBrody - Posted - 10/03/2014:  03:40:22

Thanks for the suggestions folks. I like your idea Jon but I'm not sure how confident I'd feel doing that. I may well give it a go though. I worked on altering my technique a little last night and seemed to improve a little.

Sharon, my 5th string also broke after playing it in A for a while. Your idea of mixed strings appeals and is something I may look into. I'm back using a bridge pin capo and it's not too bad. I'm hesitant to install spikes as that will lower the 5th string and makes it harder for me. As for needle files, mine arrived yesterday and I was able to 'slightly' increase the nut slot width for the bottom 4 strings and the pip width for the 5th string. Seemed to go ok but I feel the first string is still not sounding quite right.

Hi banjered, I've looked at that tailpiece you mention and will likely get it someday but the two breaks I've had weren't at the tailpiece. No breaks since then so maybe it was the constant re-tuning of that 5th string that did it.

I'm surprised how quickly the strings settled into their tuning after some of the comments I've read here. Didn't take long at all.

jonredmond - Posted - 10/03/2014:  06:28:23

I have also read that trying to bring the strings up to tension too quickly may make them weaker. Some people take several days to slowly bring them up.

Maybe the break which looks like it occurred between the bridge and tailpiece may have broke at the bridge. When the broken string is no longer at high tension it shrinks back to its normal length and so the break point appears to have occurred behind the bridge.

Shifting the nut is quite easy and reversible.

Good luck. I love the sound and feel of the nylon strings. I have them on all 4 of my banjos.

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 10/03/2014:  13:32:55

jonredmond,

An interesting idea - however if the string shrinks after breaking that would seem to mean it broke at the tailpiece and then shrank to where it appears to be between the tailpiece and the bridge. A break at the bridge would leave two sections of string (one from the tuners and the other from the tailpiece) neither of which actually reach the bridge since they are un-stretched. And a break at the tuner leaves the wraps but no string poking out of the hole in the capstan.

What tailpiece are you using? I have to admit that I haven't used anything but No-Knots for several years now (although not used as a no-knot due to the strings breaking on the burs inside the slots). In the past I've used Kershners (from Stu-Mac) without problems even though putting nylon strings through the holes and cut-outs looks pretty scarey. Apparently they are well designed and well burred.

I used to have an original No-Knot but it was brass instead of steel, and all the edges were smooth. It never cut a string while in my possession. I sold it with the banjo, when I divested my 19th Century Banjo collection just before moving down here (circa 81)

john bange - Posted - 10/03/2014:  18:24:03

you could try  harp strings...they are tuff as nails and I have not had any breakage.  I buy 25yd spools from Robinsons Harp Shop in Laguna Hills, Ca...lots of different diameters to make your custom sets out of...I'm totally sold on them...settle down almost over night too.

jonredmond - Posted - 10/03/2014:  19:05:21

I'm using just the cheap no knot tailpieces too.
I tie the strings on with knots. I think I ran some sandpaper over the pegs to get rid of any sharp edges.

jonredmond - Posted - 10/03/2014:  19:19:42

Woodchuck,

I assumed that he was looking at what was left of the broken string attached to the tailpiece and saw that it did not reach all the way to the bridge. 

I have only had the red Nylguts break a few times. One of them was when Richie Stearns tried to tune my banjo up to A.

Bad idea.

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 10/04/2014:  01:03:18

Yeah, Richie's a string killer, man. Never let him tune.

I realize now that what the string looks like after breaking will be quite different if you are looking down the neck than if you are looking up the pot. Yet another major confusion for us poor old banjo players. First they pull a short string on us, and now this!

Edited by - oldwoodchuckb on 10/04/2014 01:04:21

BadWolf - Posted - 10/07/2014:  06:35:32

i just switched to the Aquila red nylagut strings and so far i like them quite a bit. had to open up the notch on the bridge for the 2 highest strings (nut was fine as it was) and it took several days for the strings to finally settle down but havent had any problems

wyomingirl - Posted - 10/08/2014:  00:03:59

Harp strings! That's a new one for me to think about and try. Anyone else out there using them? I've had good luck with getting higher tension and good sound of the the Savarez pink/red card classical guitar strings, too. John, which diameter strings have you used for which banjo pitches?

wtalley - Posted - 10/08/2014:  07:04:48

I've been using nylon strings for 30+ years now. and switched to Chris Sands' strings when they came out about 15+ years ago.  Use to be if a string broke on one of my banjos, it was due to old age; but not so any more. 

In the past year or so I've been having trouble with the Sands' strings breaking, particularly the first and fifth - which are basically the same string.  The troublesome part is that the strings do not break at the nut, bridge, or tailpiece - always somewhere in between.  In the past I've never had problems tuning the fifth to "A", but that's been a problem with the newer Sands' strings.  Also, in the past I've always tuned the banjo sharp when putting on new strings to help stretch them, but now the Sands' strings seem to have a problem with that, too.    So what's the reason - is the manufacturer using cheaper material?

Tried the Aquilas, but they were too light for me (I use heavy weight Sands) and the strings seemed to be prone to breakage.  I haven't tried the red ones yet.

A classic banjo friend of mine said he's had good experience with  Savarez Alliance strings, you have to buy individual strings and make your own set.  So that's where I'm headed in the near future.