Porschefan - Posted - 03/26/2013:  20:48:57

Well, I kinda' knew this might happen.    A few days ago I posted a question about whether to go for a Deering Goodtime Special on my local CL for $450.00.   That one sold before I could get to it.    Since then I've come down with a bad case of banjo-related OCD and have spent a lot of time here and elsewhere on the web trying to absorb some banjo lore, with an eye towards trying to figure out what I want, what I can afford and what might qualify as a "bargain."   My definition of a bargain, within reason, is something that I could recoup whatever investment I had in it (or come close).     I've been focusing on lower-priced beginner's models and had upped my original $500-600 budget to around $1K when I saw an RK-82 for sale locally for $900.00.

This particular post might be one of those that is really too broad-ranging and full of newbiness to elicit any real specific/concret advice, but I'll gtive it a whirl and see what comes of it.

Tonight I spent some time on the Deering website and came across to video clips of a little higher priced instruments than I'd been looking at previously.    I was kind of blown away at just how much better than entry-level models  these two models sounded.    Here's a link to the Sierra at the Deering site:

deeringbanjos.com/sierra-166

And the Eagle II:

deeringbanjos.com/eagle-ii-216

I've listened to both of these videos/sales pitches a couple of times and intend to do so again to see if anything shakes out to my newbie ears.

My questions: first and foremost, do these kinds of videos, in general fairly represent the instruments being demonstrated?  No carefully set up recording wizardry to make them sound better than a typical instrument?

Secondly, I can't quite articulate what I'm hearing as the differences between the two.    At first hearing I was just blown away by the mahogany Sierra.  It just seemed to be about 1000X "richer" for lack of a better term than most of the banjos I listened to.  I was completely impressed--seems to have LOTS of overtones, great sustain, but retains a kind of mellow quality just the same.

Then I listened to the Eagle II and it seemed to lack some of the richness, but still had a beautiful full tone with tons of sustain.   And when the player (Jens Kruger, I think) snapped off a little bluegrass riff towards the end of the video I just sat up straight in my chair in reaction to the sound which really evoked some serious bluegrass waves.

One final question/observation with regard to the Sierra.    After hearing the above demo, I Googled for Sierra's and found one here:

bernunzio.com/product/deering-...ra-16613/

My first reaction was "WOW" -- a Sierra for only $1,500  (creeping budget syndrome!!).    But when I listened to the embedded clip there it didn't sound NEARLY as fantastic as the one on the Deering site.   So I'm wondering, is this because it's a 2002, as opposed to a brand-new model?   Or just a poorer recording and poorer player?

With that I'll stop my addled rambling and see what comes back.     If nothing, I understand.   It's hard to talk to the dazed and confused.     But TIA in any case.

mcate - Posted - 03/26/2013:  22:54:55

As a newbie also, but not tp guitar or trumpet, I can absolutely tell you the better the

quality of the instrument the easier to play, the better the sound, the higher the satisfaction

you'll be with your own progress, and likely the more motivated to practice you'll be also. I spent

about a year here reading posts and advice, I was also very impressed with  the  Sierra after hearing many

clips and reviews, etc.. I bought a 2006 mahogany Sierra as my first and only banjo and love it. I can't see needing another instrument

ever, unless I want to add a maple or fancier model, ( not likely) banjo to what I have. Get a Sierra, you will have

a fantastic banjo, likely get out what you put into it if you sell, and yes, they sound as good as the Deering site video.

pjfolino - Posted - 03/26/2013:  23:45:30

"...the better the quality of the instrument the easier to play, the better the sound, the higher the satisfaction you'll be with your own progress, and likely the more motivated to practice you'll be also".

+1 on that!

You can't go wrong with either the Sierra or Eagle 2. I have the Eagle and it sounds just as good as on the web...well maybe not as good as Jens ;-)

kirbonite - Posted - 03/27/2013:  04:17:08

I think the Sierra a better choice if you're just going to play bluegrass but if you have notions about Clawhammer then Eagle 2.   Eagle 2 also has a lighter flange which makes it weigh a bit less.   good luck,

K

pickn5 - Posted - 03/27/2013:  06:29:34

I just bought a used 07 Sierra. I won't have to buy another banjo. This one is beautiful looking and sounding.

grm405 - Posted - 03/27/2013:  08:01:44

There have been two major changes in the Sierra.  First in 2002 or thereabouts, when Deering abandoned their practice of pressing on the tone rings.  Many before that benefited from removing the ring and shaving the rim to loosen up the fit.  The second change occurred in 2005 or 6 when they changed to tone ring to the current design.  The older models often sell for around $1000 in the classifieds (ignoring the hopeless optimists who ask, but seldom get much higher prices).  The newer models seem to sell for $1200-1400 used.

I played a 2006 Sierra years ago; it was a very nice sounding banjo.  However, you are now into the price range where there is a lot more to choose from than Deering.

I would NEVER judge a banjo by a recording as much of the sound is the recording environment.  Listen to a series of recordings/videos from the same site (Like Zepp or Banjo Hut).  You will find a huge range in the sound that is the environment and not the banjo.  Like playing in a room filled with banjos hanging on the wall gives a really live, brilliant (too) sound, but in a room with lots of curtains gives the same banjo a dead sound.

You almost have to go on faith, as when you do listen to a banjo, most of the sound is in the setup and the pickers skill, and these vary a lot.  Buy a banjo known to be good and have it setup (certain banjos have a good reputation, others do not).  Then learn to keep that setup correct yourself.

Gerry

banjo bill-e - Posted - 03/27/2013:  08:56:37

Jens Kruger makes every banjo sound wonderful. So, that may well show their full potential, but you can't buy that tone!

jswkingsfield - Posted - 03/27/2013:  08:59:48

I went through the same drill a couple of years ago!  Upgraded from a starter Fender.  The bottlecap Fender's limitations grated after 8 months (although at least the neck was pretty good), so I endorse the idea that a better quality instrument is the way to go.

Ditto on what Gerry said above, on how the Sierra has changed over the past few years.  I've played both the current Sierra and the Eagle II.  I had the Eagle II for a year, posted a review, the opinions in which still hold for me.  I've recently played both the Sierra and Eagle II on and off over the past year, when visiting the local store.  I think they're pretty consistent in sound characteristics, from instrument to instrument.

Jens Kruger is amazing, he probably could plunk a yardstick into a pumpkin, put banjo strings on it, and still sound great.

The mahogany Sierra, like mahogany banjos generally, has a darker, richer tone, the maple Sierra is noticeably brighter.  The Eagle II is made to be very bright -- I bought it because it's bright and clear.  Both models have slim, low-profile necks, which I find very playable, good to learn on a nice neck rather than struggle with a chunky, ill-made one.

That said, for bluegrass, personal opinion is the Sierra is the bluegrassier-sounding of the two models.  The Eagle II weighs a pound less and can be converted to openback, has an arguably better sound for other styles of music.

RKs are a nice line.  I've only tried an RK-20, found the neck a little chunkier, but that's a personal preference.

Lightly played used instruments of either model is not a bad way to go as a starter.  If you decide to go a different direction later on, the resale value wouldn't be bad if that's a consideration in your thinking.

Good luck choosing!

Old Hickory - Posted - 03/27/2013:  10:36:51

The other changes in the Sierra in recent years were cosmetic. The original Sierras had dot inlays. Inlays don't affect sound, of course. But as a plain looking banjo with a matte finish it didn't look worth the asking or selling price. I think there was a brief period during which the inlays were upgraded with floral shapes in wood surrounding the dots. Then within the past 2 or 3 years Deering totally upgraded the inlays to an original 19th-century-inspired ornate design. Deering did that with was no increase in MSRP, so that was a really neat upgrade.

Now the MSRP on the Sierra is up to $2749 and the street price, with case, is $2200.  But at least it looks worthy of the price.  The Sierra now effectively competes both in performance and aesthetics with the other U.S.-made banjos that go for $2000-$2300 -- the Bishline Cimarron and Kel Kroydon KK250, KK3 and KK Standard.

From watching ads, I've seen that the 2006 tone ring change and the more recent inlay redesign have drastically reduced the resale value of earlier Sierras.  There is no reason to pay any more than $1200 for one of those.  $800 to $1000 is more reasonable.  As Gerry said, people asking $1400 or more are dreaming.

For those who don't mind simple dot inlays, a used Sierra at $1000 or less can be one of the best banjo values out there.

Porschefan - Posted - 03/27/2013:  13:25:56

Hi Jerry,

So the 2002 Sierra here (bernunzio.com/product/deering-...ra-16613/), would be overpriced and not worth trying to track down the tone ring status.   Which begs the question of whether the newer "06 -20 hole" tone ring is dramatically better than the previous one which the ad describes as "a sand-cast, virgin bell bronze, genuine Deering tone ring, which might be good info if I come across an older one?

I checked the classified here and found two Sierra's listed.  One was a newer 2011 model that was sold for $1,495, which would have been very tempting.    There is one other listing:  banjohangout.org/classified/34369.    This one is pretty obviously a pre-2006 model--no updated inlays.   Way overpriced, according to your analysis.    The ad references the $2,749 CURRENT list price, which IMHO is a bit misleading.

I'll try not to get too swayed by listening to MP3 clips, especially those from manufacturers and featuring world-class players.    At the risk of revealing the extent of my newb-ness, previous to seeing these clips, I thought Jens Kruger was just some kind of metallurgist/engineer that worked at Deering developing tone rings.

quote:

---

Originally posted by grm405

 

There have been two major changes in the Sierra.  First in 2002 or thereabouts, when Deering abandoned their practice of pressing on the tone rings.  Many before that benefited from removing the ring and shaving the rim to loosen up the fit.  The second change occurred in 2005 or 6 when they changed to tone ring to the current design.  The older models often sell for around $1000 in the classifieds (ignoring the hopeless optimists who ask, but seldom get much higher prices).  The newer models seem to sell for $1200-1400 used.

I played a 2006 Sierra years ago; it was a very nice sounding banjo.  However, you are now into the price range where there is a lot more to choose from than Deering.

I would NEVER judge a banjo by a recording as much of the sound is the recording environment.  Listen to a series of recordings/videos from the same site (Like Zepp or Banjo Hut).  You will find a huge range in the sound that is the environment and not the banjo.  Like playing in a room filled with banjos hanging on the wall gives a really live, brilliant (too) sound, but in a room with lots of curtains gives the same banjo a dead sound.

You almost have to go on faith, as when you do listen to a banjo, most of the sound is in the setup and the pickers skill, and these vary a lot.  Buy a banjo known to be good and have it setup (certain banjos have a good reputation, others do not).  Then learn to keep that setup correct yourself.

Gerry

---

Edited by - Porschefan on 03/27/2013 13:27:39

mrbook - Posted - 03/27/2013:  14:27:56

I have an early 80s Deering Deluxe, pretty much the same as the Sierra except for slightly fancier inlays. I own other banjos, and may own more, but I will not need another. The older tone ring sounds just fine to me. The Eagle II also seems like a good banjo for all-around playing. Deerings are good banjos, and you can find some real bargains on used ones.

banjo bill-e - Posted - 03/27/2013:  14:45:46

Stephen, I was unaware of Jens before becoming immersed in the banjo world these last few years. He is one of the top players on the planet, just phenomenal technique. If you search youtube, you will find a LOT of Jens Kruger, both solo and also with his talented brothers. One thing I love is that he finds such joy in playing the banjo, and that comes through in his performances. Deering was very smart in teaming up with him! I really like the Deering line of banjos, as opposed to the Goodtimes, and you will probably be very happy with any of their better models.

Old Hickory - Posted - 03/27/2013:  16:13:27

Stephen:

If you go to the search box at the top right of every Hangout page, select "Classifieds" from the drop-down menu and eneter "Sierra" in text box, you will see all current and past ads that still exist. This lets you see the prices at which some other Sierras were advertised. They may have sold for less than the asking price. You can assume they did not sell for more!

Here's the search result:

banjohangout.org/pages/search....assifieds

A 2001 listed for $1100.  A 2006 for $1150.   A 2010 with new inlay for $1300!!!   A 1995 for $995.

I believe we were discussing one in January that was listed for $850.

No offense to the seller, but yes - the second Deering you pointed to is way over-priced and the ad is misleading when it says "New $2749" because the ad is for dot inlays and "new" gets you fancy.

There are two new ones on eBay, one for $1900 and $2000 or best offer, free shipping on both. One seller has 100% positive feedback.

Have fun shopping.

Porschefan - Posted - 03/27/2013:  16:47:45

quote:

---

Originally posted by Old Hickory

 

Stephen:

If you go to the search box at the top right of every Hangout page, select "Classifieds" from the drop-down menu and eneter "Sierra" in text box, you will see all current and past ads that still exist. This lets you see the prices at which some other Sierras were advertised. They may have sold for less than the asking price. You can assume they did not sell for more!

Here's the search result:

banjohangout.org/pages/search....assifieds

A 2001 listed for $1100.  A 2006 for $1150.   A 2010 with new inlay for $1300!!!   A 1995 for $995.

I believe we were discussing one in January that was listed for $850.

No offense to the seller, but yes - the second Deering you pointed to is way over-priced and the ad is misleading when it says "New $2749" because the ad is for dot inlays and "new" gets you fancy.

There are two new ones on eBay, one for $1900 and $2000 or best offer, free shipping on both. One seller has 100% positive feedback.

Have fun shopping.

---

Ken,

Thanks for the tip--that's a very handy feature.   I'm finding that this website is extraordinarily rich compared to the usual "forums" out there.    A lot to explore.

The Sierra search gives me great hope that there is a fairly new instrument out there in the $1-1.5K range!    One of the listings was for a Sierra with the Hartford tone ring that sold for $800.   That might have been interesting.

I'm having a lot of fun just looking and trying to learn.

Best,

STP

Porschefan - Posted - 03/27/2013:  17:01:51

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjo bill-e

 

Stephen, I was unaware of Jens before becoming immersed in the banjo world these last few years. He is one of the top players on the planet, just phenomenal technique. If you search youtube, you will find a LOT of Jens Kruger, both solo and also with his talented brothers. One thing I love is that he finds such joy in playing the banjo, and that comes through in his performances. Deering was very smart in teaming up with him! I really like the Deering line of banjos, as opposed to the Goodtimes, and you will probably be very happy with any of their better models.

---

Hi Bill,

I've spent some time checking out some Youtube videos of his playing since discovering him on the Deering website ads.   He is really amazing, for sure.   He's one of those guys who have reached the point where music just flows out of him--technique has been mastered to the point where it's almost irrelevant.    And he sure seems to be having a good time too.   This Youtube video seems to demonstrate both.    It reminds me of a great, but not widely-known (?), guitar player named Jack Williams who closes his live shows with a kind of free form medley that goes from soup to nuts and back again.    Great fun!    And if that's too much fun ;-)--there's his rendering of Bach's cello suite!

Best,

STP

Porschefan - Posted - 03/27/2013:  17:07:05

quote:

---

Originally posted by kirbonite

 

I think the Sierra a better choice if you're just going to play bluegrass but if you have notions about Clawhammer then Eagle 2.   Eagle 2 also has a lighter flange which makes it weigh a bit less.   good luck,

K

---

Hi Kirby,

Since I'm a bargain hunter (read cheapskate!), it's probably going to be a lot easier to find a nice used Sierra, since the Eagle II seems to be a very recent model.

Best,

STP

Edit:  After running a search on the classifieds (thanks Kirby!) I see that while the supply is less than the Sierra, there have been a fair amount available.   I'm pretty sure that one of these days something will pop up that will be THE ONE.....or at least the FIRST one.

Edited by - Porschefan on 03/27/2013 17:15:33

Porschefan - Posted - 03/29/2013:  14:15:04

Here's an email I got from the customer service department @ Deering about the Sierra:

Hi Stephen,

1. Deering tone rings have never been pressed fit but were originally on a hard rock maple rim. With the advent of the new violin maple rim, a slightly softer species, the entire pot assembly, including the tone ring, has the ability to vibrate more freely. Our tone rings still do not just "slip" off the rims, they are snug.

2. Yes, in 2006 we changed from the original alloy to a different balance between the metals; a new alloy content that more closely matches the Kruger tone ring and gives the banjo a better sound. The serial number on the banjo itself is what you need to know as there is no serial number on the tone ring.

3. In 2010 we upgraded the Sierra to the now more elaborate inlay pattern that you see on our banjo.

4. We like hearing from folks so it is not a bother to ask us about translating your serial number. In general: the first two digits are the month, the last two digits before the "dash" is the year. For example: 01234799-B321 would be a January of 1999 banjo; doesn't tell you which model it is just the date of completion.

The last four: B321 or all numbers in the older models is found on a special sheet we have here at the factory. If you only have that, you will have to call the toll free, 800-845-7791 to get help there.

STP

Porschefan - Posted - 03/29/2013:  16:30:01

Can someone tell me the name of this tune that Jens K. plays to open the Deering demo video for the Sierra?

grm405 - Posted - 03/29/2013:  16:58:57

"1. Deering tone rings have never been pressed fit" 

Really?  Then Janet Deering is mis-informed in this thread:

banjohangout.org/topic/160151/28

where she states:   

"We quit press fitting tone rings in the mid ninties. We made a snug fit that could be put on by hand starting around 1995 or thereabouts."

Perhaps is it just that in 2002 (also from Janet Deering I believe, in another earlier much thread) they loosened up the tone ring fit?  Not from a pressed-fit but from a "so tight you can't get it off without a sledge hammer" to a normal fit.   This was a much-discussed topic in the distant past.

Gerry

Porschefan - Posted - 03/29/2013:  17:37:08

quote:

---

Originally posted by grm405

 

"1. Deering tone rings have never been pressed fit" 

Really?  Then Janet Deering is mis-informed in this thread:

banjohangout.org/topic/160151/28

where she states:   

"We quit press fitting tone rings in the mid ninties. We made a snug fit that could be put on by hand starting around 1995 or thereabouts."

Perhaps is it just that in 2002 (also from Janet Deering I believe, in another earlier much thread) they loosened up the tone ring fit?  Not from a pressed-fit but from a "so tight you can't get it off without a sledge hammer" to a normal fit.   This was a much-discussed topic in the distant past.

Gerry

---

Hi Gerry,

Thanks for the reference.   Now I have one more very useful data point for finding a Sierra.    I've had a couple of exchanges with Carolina and she's probably not been around long enough to know for sure?   She's very personable and helpful, but in this case, apparently wrong.   I'm going to read through that entire thread later, but I wanted to get back to you this.

So here's what I've gathered about the chronology of Sierra development so far.    Feel free to chime in if I'm incorrect.

Mid-90's stopped "press-fitting" tone rings.

At some point switched from a hard-maple to a softer "violin maple" rim.    Don't have a date for that yet.

2006 changed from the original (??) tone ring to the 06-20 "bell bronze" type.

Somewhere between 2006-2010 they added some inlay decoration around the plain dots.   Looks like maybe it was some kind of wood inlay.   I saw a picture of these on an add for what I recall was a 2007 model?   I'll attach it if I can find it.

2010 added the (very nice IMHO) MOP inlays.

I realize I may be getting a little obsessive about a mid-range instrument, but I'm having fun learning.

Porschefan - Posted - 03/29/2013:  18:02:59

quote:

---

Originally posted by grm405

 

"1. Deering tone rings have never been pressed fit" 

Really?  Then Janet Deering is mis-informed in this thread:

banjohangout.org/topic/160151/28

where she states:   

"We quit press fitting tone rings in the mid ninties. We made a snug fit that could be put on by hand starting around 1995 or thereabouts."

Perhaps is it just that in 2002 (also from Janet Deering I believe, in another earlier much thread) they loosened up the tone ring fit?  Not from a pressed-fit but from a "so tight you can't get it off without a sledge hammer" to a normal fit.   This was a much-discussed topic in the distant past.

Gerry

---

Gerry,

An afterthought....how did you locate that quote from Janet?   Is there a search function here than can narrow in on something like that?

Also I'll add to my chronology that in 2002 the loosened up the tone ring fitting.

As a (long-ago) former luthier, I'm kind of interested in how the mechanics/physics of how all the parts of the banjo work together.   Lots o fun.

grm405 - Posted - 03/29/2013:  19:21:00

There is a Search Function in the upper right corner of this page.  Put in as many terms as you want.  I used "deering tone ring press" and lots of threads popped up.  Very handy device which I use a lot.

Gerry

Fishrrman - Posted - 03/30/2013:  18:08:11

If I was looking for a Sierra, I'd look for one made 2008 or later (perhaps 2007 if you can verify it). That way you're getting the '06 ring, which is worth hunting down and paying a little extra for.



I've got that ring in a 2006 Golden Wreath and it's got a fine sound, clear all the way up the neck.



Come to think of it, keep your eyes open for either a Golden Wreath or a Golden Era made '07 or later. They can be found for good prices, now and then.



With Deerings, the more recent ones are the nicest (my opinion only).

Edited by - Fishrrman on 03/30/2013 18:08:45

Porschefan - Posted - 03/31/2013:  15:21:19

quote:

---

Originally posted by Fishrrman

 

If I was looking for a Sierra, I'd look for one made 2008 or later (perhaps 2007 if you can verify it). That way you're getting the '06 ring, which is worth hunting down and paying a little extra for.



I've got that ring in a 2006 Golden Wreath and it's got a fine sound, clear all the way up the neck.



Come to think of it, keep your eyes open for either a Golden Wreath or a Golden Era made '07 or later. They can be found for good prices, now and then.



With Deerings, the more recent ones are the nicest (my opinion only).

---

Hi John,

Good points.  There are other banjos (than the Sierra) that I run across that are in my general budget area and if one of these other models came up I'd certainly be interested.    See my post below re information overlad though.

STP

Porschefan - Posted - 03/31/2013:  15:43:52

What appears to be a Goodtime II appeared on the local Craigslist today.   I wondering if I should consider it as a temporary instrument while I continue my search for a Sierra, or something equivalent/better. 

I'm not certain which model or year it is.   The peghead is a different shape than the current models.   It does have a resonator, so I'm thinking it's probably the base-model GT II -- resonator but no tone ring?  And a few years old.   Is that correct?   The first Goodtime that showed up on the ABQ CL was a "Special" and had a tone ring, but I don't think this one does.

I've been searching for a Sierra since I started this thread and haven't come across anything compelling yet.    New ones seem to go for $2,100-2,200.    The local Craigslist rarely has any quality banjo's at all.   This is only the second GT I've seen during this period.  So, I'm thinking that I'm eventually going to have buy something used without being able to see or hear it.    I'm also starting get symptoms of info overload.    While searching for a Sierra I've run across dozens of other possibilities that sound interesting, but I know nothing about, including Gibsons, Stelling and many others, a lot of which I'd never even heard of..  This reached the point where,  after watching Bela Fleck videos, and seeing the wider, radiused fingerboards I even looked into some Nechvilles, which intrigued me, but didn't sound "right" to me--at least on web videos.   No offense to Nechville fans!   Just pointing out that I might be "Drifting to Far from the Shore"....      (Ricky Skaggs version)

I'm  think I need to back off and let some osmosis occur, relax and be ready when a good one comes along.    Seeing this Goodtime available kind of reinforces that.   And if it happens that this was all just a dream....or an end-life crisis ;-) I'm only out a few hundred $$.

Getting more hands/ears-on experience may be tough here in ABQ.    There's a shop called "Banjo Bob's," but he seems to be a little hard to reach and I hate going into shops to do "research."    Anyone who's familiar with ABQ area have any suggestions?

Thanks for listening.   I'm Stephen Porter and I'm a banjo-holic.

STP

grm405 - Posted - 03/31/2013:  17:03:47

I would look at it.  You really can't evaluate a banjo until you have some experience.  To get this you need a banjo.  Sort of a Catch 22.  Big advantage of a Goodtime is they are pretty easy to sell, in this case for little to no loss.  It will probably have a loose head and need strings.  About the only thing to worry about is a warped neck, which is pretty rare on these (but not unheard of), and of course check that it has not been run over by a truck or something.  If it all looks square then it is most likely good.

Gerry

Porschefan - Posted - 04/01/2013:  13:20:40

quote:

---

Originally posted by grm405

 

I would look at it.  You really can't evaluate a banjo until you have some experience.  To get this you need a banjo.  Sort of a Catch 22.  Big advantage of a Goodtime is they are pretty easy to sell, in this case for little to no loss.  It will probably have a loose head and need strings.  About the only thing to worry about is a warped neck, which is pretty rare on these (but not unheard of), and of course check that it has not been run over by a truck or something.  If it all looks square then it is most likely good.

Gerry

---

Hi Gerry,

Was going to see it today but seller had second thoughts and pulled it off the market.    Maybe decided to give it one more try or maybe got a better offer.

It's a Catch-22 indeed, but I'm sure it will work out fine.

Best,

STP

Porschefan - Posted - 04/01/2013:  16:24:24

quote:

---

Originally posted by grm405

 

"1. Deering tone rings have never been pressed fit" 

Really?  Then Janet Deering is mis-informed in this thread:

banjohangout.org/topic/160151/28

where she states:   

"We quit press fitting tone rings in the mid ninties. We made a snug fit that could be put on by hand starting around 1995 or thereabouts."

Perhaps is it just that in 2002 (also from Janet Deering I believe, in another earlier much thread) they loosened up the tone ring fit?  Not from a pressed-fit but from a "so tight you can't get it off without a sledge hammer" to a normal fit.   This was a much-discussed topic in the distant past.

Gerry

---

Gerry,

Here's the latest from Carolina:

I spoke to Greg Deering and he said in 1978 the banjos began with press fitting the tone rings. As we continued to manufacture, it was found that the banjos sounded better if the tone ring had more room to vibrate and we stopped that in the 1990's...as Janet said. Thank you for the correction. :-)

So the record is set straight.  Thanks!

Porschefan - Posted - 04/01/2013:  17:52:11

Best price I've found for a new Sierra.  $1,799 + $40 shipping.

healingbalm - Posted - 04/03/2013:  09:27:55

Ive got a 98 Deluxe in great condition in the classifieds for $1000!! (cheap plug, lol)

Porschefan - Posted - 04/03/2013:  11:43:54

quote:

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Originally posted by healingbalm

 

Ive got a 98 Deluxe in great condition in the classifieds for $1000!! (cheap plug, lol)

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Plug away!   Thanks for the heads-up.   I'll take a look and see if I can educate myself on the Deluxe model.

Best,

STP

grm405 - Posted - 04/03/2013:  12:18:25

Here you go!  Just appeared in classifieds.  2005 Sierra for $950.

banjohangout.org/classified/35455

Gerry

Porschefan - Posted - 04/03/2013:  16:15:33

quote:

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Originally posted by grm405

 

Here you go!  Just appeared in classifieds.  2005 Sierra for $950.

banjohangout.org/classified/35455

Gerry

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Hi Ken,

Thanks for the heads up.   I'll follow up on this.

Any comments on this vs. the '98 Deluxe being offered for $1K?

STP

Edited by - Porschefan on 04/03/2013 16:17:41

grm405 - Posted - 04/03/2013:  17:06:11

I would buy the Sierra myself.  Newer and looks cleaner.  Sell that Fults, put the original tailpiece back on and recover about $100 of your investment.

Gerry

Porschefan - Posted - 04/03/2013:  17:10:12

quote:

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Originally posted by grm405

 

I would buy the Sierra myself.  Newer and looks cleaner.  Sell that Fults, put the original tailpiece back on and recover about $100 of your investment.

Gerry

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Thanks for the thoughts.    Is that tailpiece worth that much?   What's the advantage of it (if any)?  I'm very close to pulling the trigger on the Sierra.

jswkingsfield - Posted - 04/03/2013:  17:49:36

Resale value on a Fults Cumberland is $80-$100 range.  If you buy the Sierra, try both tailpieces -- I personally like the Fults tailpieces better than the Deering tailpiece (when I had my Eagle II, I put a Kershner on it, and it was a lot better).  The Fults is much easier to adjust the angle, and it's super solid.

DeanT - Posted - 04/03/2013:  19:39:14

If you think about it much longer, it's going to be gone.