Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/19/2011:  11:30:24

For your consideration this week is a tune called "Mike in the Wilderness". 

The source of this tune is the fiddling of John Morgan Salyer of Kentucky.  

I first found the tune in Jeff Todd Titon's book "Old Time Kentucky Fiddle Tunes", which includes both a transcription and a recording of Mr. Salyer playing the tune.

There is a solid write-up about the tune, which also includes a sound file, transcription and a bit of history, on this blog post: jodykruskal.com/tune_of_the_mo...2009.html

The tune is somewhat obscure, which I think is a real shame.  I chose it for a TOTW because I think there is a lot of discussion material here (from memetics to keys to the history of the familiar name 'Mike'), but also to help it along its way to the chestnut status it deserves.

Here are the few modern takes I've been able to track down:

A really lovely fiddle/guitar duet version by Tashina Clarridge and Jefferson Hamer of Washington: youtube.com/watch?v=l93aqZOSIB...e=related

A fine solo fiddle version by Brian (hope someone here knows more about this guy, or maybe he's even a member if we're lucky):  youtube.com/watch?v=SzYG863IKjo

A who's-who of old time music jamming filmed by Rafe Stefani featuring a number of heavy hitters playing the song: youtube.com/watch?v=KIavJ3dk82c

Despite several years of playing it on occasion I've never quite managed to work up a solo banjo arrangement that does the tune justice.  But I've attached one that isn't terrible at least:

Edited by - Mark Johnson on 08/19/2011 11:31:40

Mike in the Wilderness

stevel - Posted - 08/19/2011:  11:55:26

nice little tune mark.... new to me. i haven't dove into my salyer downloads yet... but maybe nows the time!

Vapor - Posted - 08/19/2011:  11:58:18

Very catchy tune, Like it. Thanks

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/19/2011:  12:04:00

I almost forgot!  Ike and I recorded this one many moons ago, a peaceful little version of it where I'm tuned to aAEAC# and he's backing me up on guitar:

Mike in the Wilderness

{Hurm, it seems I have no idea how to imbed or link something from someone else's music list.  The link above just takes you to Ike's music page.  I'm hoping that most of you will think to click on the one that says "Mike in the Wilderness" when you're there.  Ok, then click on the rest of them.  Ike is a great player, and hopefully your listens will be followed by glowing praise so he'll come to grips with how good he is finally.}

Edited by - Mark Johnson on 08/19/2011 12:07:37

Don Borchelt - Posted - 08/19/2011:  12:04:56

Wow, late last night I was sitting...  uh, somewhere... looking at my copy of Titon's book, and somehow settled on this tune.  I had heard this tune about six months ago at a jam, and remembered thinking it was a good tune. I was humming out the notes in my mind, imaging in my mind how Salyer jumped two octaves on the fiddle neck, and thinking, I have to learn this.  Geez, you read my mind!  Okay, I'm going to get working on it. 

Salyer's recording is also available on the Digital Library of Appalachia:

John M. Salyer fiddling Mike in the Wilderness

Edited by - Don Borchelt on 08/19/2011 12:06:06

R Buck - Posted - 08/19/2011:  12:15:34

Good choice Mark, so many tunes, so little time, and this is one of those great mixolydian gems from KY.

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/19/2011:  12:50:46

So I got all jazzed up after remembering the version/tuning I did with Ike and gave it one more quick crack.  I'm MUCH more pleased with this recording than the one I posted above (but I'll leave them both for the time being).

Glad I could pull off some serendipity for you, Don.  I'd like you to consider it mandatory homework now.  Seriously, I'd really love for this thread to turn in to one of the "ok, here's my take on it" type threads, get this tune spreading like wildfire.  You always do such lovely things with these old tunes, I'm eager to hear what you cook up.

[Seriously resisting the temptation to get all theory crazy in Mr. Buckingham's wake here.  I find it fascinating that Mr. Salyer uses both a major 7 and a flat 7 and in one measure, without it sounding off at all. ]

Mike in the Wilderness II

oldwoodchuckb - Posted - 08/19/2011:  14:18:49

I've been promoting this tune to our fiddlers (including one everyone calls "Mike") but nobody ever learns it. It is a great tune and I wish I had someone to play it with.

gailg64 - Posted - 08/19/2011:  14:39:48

Great tune, one that was very popular 10 or 12 years ago and for some reason dropped almost out of people's repertoire's. Here's a link to an mp3 of Salyer playing it with guitar backup on the Dig. Lib of App. website:

​aca-dla.org/cdm4/item_v...amp;REC=10

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mark Johnson

For your consideration this week is a tune called "Mike in the Wilderness". 

The source of this tune is the fiddling of John Morgan Salyer of Kentucky.  

I first found the tune in Jeff Todd Titon's book "Old Time Kentucky Fiddle Tunes", which includes both a transcription and a recording of Mr. Salyer playing the tune.

There is a solid write-up about the tune, which also includes a sound file, transcription and a bit of history, on this blog post: jodykruskal.com/tune_of_the_mo...2009.html

The tune is somewhat obscure, which I think is a real shame.  I chose it for a TOTW because I think there is a lot of discussion material here (from memetics to keys to the history of the familiar name 'Mike'), but also to help it along its way to the chestnut status it deserves.

Here are the few modern takes I've been able to track down:

A really lovely fiddle/guitar duet version by Tashina Clarridge and Jefferson Hamer of Washington: youtube.com/watch?v=l93aqZOSIB...e=related

A fine solo fiddle version by Brian (hope someone here knows more about this guy, or maybe he's even a member if we're lucky):  youtube.com/watch?v=SzYG863IKjo

A who's-who of old time music jamming filmed by Rafe Stefani featuring a number of heavy hitters playing the song: youtube.com/watch?v=KIavJ3dk82c

Despite several years of playing it on occasion I've never quite managed to work up a solo banjo arrangement that does the tune justice.  But I've attached one that isn't terrible at least:

 

 

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sugarinthegourd - Posted - 08/19/2011:  15:48:08

It shows up a lot at jams in the Philly area.

ELWOOD - Posted - 08/19/2011:  17:04:44

The Utube Tashina Clarridge and Jefferson Hamer was my kind "o " Mike in The Wilderness"

BanjoBach - Posted - 08/19/2011:  18:45:05

Hey Mark,

I have never heard this tune before, but find it very interesting. You have played a wonderful banjo solo of it. Well done!!!

RG - Posted - 08/19/2011:  23:06:31

Great choice Mark, can't go wrong with a John Salyer tune!

Castania - Posted - 08/20/2011:  02:49:52

I haven't heard this tune, but I've heard a couple of others credited to Salyer, and they always grab my attention.  This one does not disappoint; I've put it on the "must learn" list.  Thanks, Mark, for this selection and the recordings -- both are excellent.

Ken

blanham - Posted - 08/20/2011:  04:43:02

quote:

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Originally posted by ELWOOD

The Utube Tashina Clarridge and Jefferson Hamer was my kind "o " Mike in The Wilderness"

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I really like her fiddle playing, but I just wish that guitar player would go away (or at least relax a little!)

wormpicker - Posted - 08/20/2011:  10:18:38

MITW is a great TOTW!  One of my favorite tunes.  I first heard Dan Levenson play it at one of our Tucson Old Time Music Circle gatherings, rediscovered Salyer's original recording later, and then learned how to play it on fiddle from David Bragger.  It's slowly becoming one of our standard jam tunes in Tucson.  On my Fiddle Hangout page, I've posted a recording of a fun jam session we had earlier this year at the Ajo Fiddle Competition.  It features the outstanding and always inspirational fiddling of our own Clawdan (who was then wearing his Fiddledan hat).  A bunch of other BHO and FHO regulars in the mix as well.  You can hear me protesting the tempo at both the beginning and end.

Paul

Edited by - wormpicker on 08/20/2011 10:20:01

wormpicker - Posted - 08/20/2011:  10:25:44

John Hoffman & Mac Benford recorded an excellent version of Mike in the Wilderness on their It's About Time CD.  You can sample it at CD Baby.  It's a great album, worth having.

Paul

bhniko - Posted - 08/20/2011:  10:28:45

Mark,
What banjo were you playing in both of your post?
The banjo in the second post sounded different as the first seemed to have a wonderful deep tone.

Marc Nerenberg - Posted - 08/20/2011:  18:16:32

Well Mark, it's not terrible - at least!

Very cool the way you sound so different from yourself in each of the 3 versions you have posted here. I like 'em all!

Another great TOTW!

Edited by - Marc Nerenberg on 08/20/2011 18:17:05

ELWOOD - Posted - 08/20/2011:  18:50:19

I Assume that the "not Terrible" wink smile, lol is not another , I am the judge, comment from north of the Canadian border. Oh I am sure not!

JanetB - Posted - 08/20/2011:  18:52:11

The way clawhammer should sound.  Your quality of playing is consistently excellent and a pleasure to hear.

Paul Roberts - Posted - 08/20/2011:  19:39:40

Mark, this is great. I linked to it from Sound Off so everyone could get a chance to hear you.

PauL

banjoholic - Posted - 08/20/2011:  20:21:49

This is a great tune, Mark.  Love your arrangement of it (the uke sounds really great for backup, too - what a nice combo).

How'd you end up in aAEAC#?  Anything else you play there?

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/20/2011:  21:34:52

Thanks for all the really kind words both about my choice for the tune and my playing. Very kind folks here.



I'm playing a Lee tubaphone on both recordings. The radically different tunings account for some of the tone difference. Mic placement likely played a big roll too... I'm a bit "quick and dirty" in my recording approach, with no effort towards keeping mic placement ideal or consistent.



As I recall, i found the aAEAC# tuning when first learning the tune by ear from the Salyer recording. It would have been gGDGB then, but I snuck it up to Ato keep the strings from being floppy. Anyway, I got the low drone first and then twisted knobs until it the strings sounded good.



I later realized it is essentially open C tuning down 1.5 steps. That realization made the tuning easy to navigate, now I can play many A tunes there. Red Haired Boy is a particular favorite as the low drone sounds great humming along with the melody.



I'm happy to hear reports that the tune isn't as obscure as I'd initially thought. I'm pleased to have learned of the other versions out there... Thanks, Wormpicker! Still hoping a few more of you brave a recording.



-Mark

Edited by - Mark Johnson on 08/20/2011 21:37:30

banjoholic - Posted - 08/21/2011:  05:29:51

Cool, Mark.  I'll have to give it a try.  There are several A tunes that are commonly played in AEAC# tuning on fiddle (drunken hiccups probably the most well known).  Interestingly, it gives a very different atmosphere on the fiddle than you get with open C on the banjo.  

Is this what you're playing for chords (2/4 time - each division a measure):

A | G | A | D E |  (X2)

A | D | E | A | D E |  (X2)

A E | A E | A E | D E | (X2)

jbalch - Posted - 08/21/2011:  06:27:15

Excellent!  Very well done.

banjoholic - Posted - 08/21/2011:  06:28:49

whoops - measure 2 should be:

A | D E | A | D E |  (X2)

tomberghan - Posted - 08/21/2011:  07:41:10

It's fantastic.
Unmistakably Mark!
Try as I might I can't quite get that little "Kansas Mark Johnson Hop," that little spring he has has in everything he plays!

I make a motion this tune henceforth be renamed "Mark in the Wilderness!"

erikforgod - Posted - 08/21/2011:  08:07:15

This song is awesome...somebody please email me or point me to a tab of this song....!!! This song has a "lilt" to it that I love with this style of banjo playing..OldWoodChuck do you have a tab for this?

Actually this book is a must as well...

Edited by - erikforgod on 08/21/2011 08:11:43

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/21/2011:  08:09:26

quote:

---

Originally posted by banjoholic 

Is this what you're playing for chords (2/4 time - each division a measure):

A | G | A | D E |  (X2)

A | D | E | A | D E |  (X2)

A E | A E | A E | D E | (X2)

---

I took slightly different approaches to the chords in each version, but very generally followed what you've got there.  The few caveats:

-"Version one" is in G.  The relative progression is still correct, just down a step.

- In the uke-backed version I just threw in an A7 rather than the G in the 1st part.  

-In the uke version I finger pick an A chord over the entire 2nd part.  I agree with the progression you have written in your 2nd post, but just thought it worth noting that I didn't actually play the changes in that version.

To get kind of wonky: I'm not sure there is a set, single key or mode for this tune.  It quite clearly has  maj7 and dom7 notes in it (so, in the native key of G the notes G, F# and F are all used.)  In some of the passages that suggest a D chord the F# hits suggesting a major V chord and thus not Mixolydian.  

[Thanks John and Tom! ]

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/21/2011:  08:15:39

quote:

---

Originally posted by erikforgod

This song is awesome...somebody please email me or point me to a tab of this song....!!! This song has a "lilt" to it that I love with this style of banjo playing..OldWoodChuck do you have a tab for this?

 

Actually this book is a must as well...

---

Thanks, Eric.  I can cook up some tabledit files very easily.  Shoot me a PM with your email and I'll send them on...

Mark

banjoholic - Posted - 08/21/2011:  08:29:42

quote:

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Originally posted by Mark Johnson

 

To get kind of wonky: I'm not sure there is a set, single key or mode for this tune.  It quite clearly has  maj7 and dom7 notes in it (so, in the native key of G the notes G, F# and F are all used.)  In some of the passages that suggest a D chord the F# hits suggesting a major V chord and thus not Mixolydian.  

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I agree.  There's definitely some ambiguity to the harmony on this one, as evidenced by the F# and F that both work.  The chords that are chosen, depending on how fully voiced they are, can definitely force the tonality in one direction or another (I'm quite sure this is tune would be a purist's exhibit for how the guitar ruined old-time :).  

All the more reason to like this tune.   

erikforgod - Posted - 08/21/2011:  08:31:16

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mark Johnson

quote:

---

Originally posted by erikforgod

This song is awesome...somebody please email me or point me to a tab of this song....!!! This song has a "lilt" to it that I love with this style of banjo playing..OldWoodChuck do you have a tab for this?

 

Actually this book is a must as well...

---

Thanks, Eric.  I can cook up some tabledit files very easily.  Shoot me a PM with your email and I'll send them on...

Mark

---

 Thanks Mark.......my wife is going to try to get me the book soon as well. I am gonna order it, send it to my mom and have her send it down to me here in Argentina...looks like a good read...being that I am 6th generation Kentuckian I have a special interest in this music from this book. I would imagine "Jenny Lynne" is in this book as well...I have heard this song being played on fiddles in western Kentucky as long as I can remember...seems to be a well known ( and liked ) local favorite in western Kentucky.

majikgator - Posted - 08/21/2011:  09:17:56

Mark, better yet you could post your tab at BHO.  Great tune that i had never heard before and i like all the versions and am surprised by the diversity. Mac Benford's little sample i listened to was, well it blew me away. i really like the lilt that you get as well and only wish i could play or arrange any of them half as well.

erikforgod - Posted - 08/21/2011:  09:24:40

quote:

---

Originally posted by majikgator

Mark, better yet you could post your tab at BHO.  Great tune that i had never heard before and i like all the versions and am surprised by the diversity. Mac Benford's little sample i listened to was, well it blew me away. i really like the lilt that you get as well and only wish i could play or arrange any of them half as well.

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 I second this  :)

MrSrubas - Posted - 08/21/2011:  09:51:09

My Tubaphone sounds pretty good in both of these. Never heard of the tune - not to shabby.

banjered - Posted - 08/21/2011:  09:59:31

Tab in Steven Parker's new book "Clawhammer Stringband Favorites" in the banjo tuning of A. Notation in Koken's new book of fiddle tunes too.

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/21/2011:  13:21:09

Steve Srubas!

MrSrubas - Posted - 08/21/2011:  18:54:18

Mark Johnson!

MrSrubas - Posted - 08/21/2011:  19:09:24

also - John Salyer is awesomesauce. Again, nice tune.

cfs1 - Posted - 08/21/2011:  19:19:23

i agree i loved your second recording, both are great don't get me wrong, but i loved the second. thank you for sharing

banjoholic - Posted - 08/22/2011:  17:24:53

Well, this tune became a bonafide earworm, and I liked it so much I went ahead and added backup versions to the old time jam site.

Here's my take on it with fiddle and banjo in the key of A (see attached mp3).

I'm playing it here on banjo in standard G tuning capo 2, and have attached a pdf of the arrangement in banjo tab.  Thanks again Mark for this great one.

Josh 

Edited by - banjoholic on 08/22/2011 17:28:27

oldtimejam.com - Mike in the Wilderness

Mike in the Wilderness tab

banjoholic - Posted - 08/22/2011:  18:09:32

Forgot a hammer on in the tab - here it is corrected

Mike in the Wilderness tab

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/23/2011:  07:42:40

Thanks, Josh.  Makes me wish I hadn't fallen off the fiddle practice wagon.  

I wish this thread had generated more takes on it, I find it fascinating to hear what other people hear/take from a tune.  

I'll try to post my own standard tuning tab here tonight...  It's neat to see the [very subtly] different takes Josh and I have.

banjoholic - Posted - 08/23/2011:  09:01:24

Yeah, I'm curious to see what your arrangement looks like.  I'll add too that I tend to vary what I play on this tune each time through, but the tab gives the basic structure.

And if anyone else has a version of this one, please post!

LyleK - Posted - 08/23/2011:  10:35:34

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mark Johnson

Makes me wish I hadn't fallen off the fiddle practice wagon.  

---

I never viewed fiddling as an issue of practicing, but more like building up a tolerance for the ugly sounds that one can produce in the first year or so (or maybe 30 years or so).

But back to the matter at hand, great tune, and great takes on it!

majikgator - Posted - 08/23/2011:  11:49:43

Much thanks Josh a backup track as well as a tab. When i opened the pdf it looked like the first string was to be tuned to F though, could be a flash back.

Mark Johnson - Posted - 08/23/2011:  12:33:28

I uploaded a tab that more or less corresponds to the first, standard tuning key of G, version of Mike in the Wilderness that I posted above into the archives.  It can be found HERE.

I do have a tab of the low tuned key of A version too, and will upload it later.

erikforgod - Posted - 08/24/2011:  07:13:45

Mark....thanks for the tabs! I have been wokring on the standard "G" version...I am not the player that you are, as I am a beginner but it is beginning to take shape and it has some great drop thumb practice....thanks!