When thinking of such things, I tend to exclude the entire concept of "Crowe Spacing".

"Crowe" refers to J. D. Crowe (b. 1937) who is part of the Bluegrass world. This is also based on the idea that there exists a "standard spacing" (who's standard?), with which the one single deviation was likely established in the 1960s (though I have been able to find no date when this Crowe spacing concept became common).

I am not that picky about spacing but my go to is what was used by S. S. Stewart as his stock bridge. Fred Van Eps' bridges were the same spacing as that used on the A. D. Grover standard bridge (and some early non tips) is a bit wider.

I have a pretty large variety of originals now that, when I get time, I make myself duplicates of as close as I can.

One other point I would like to add, the "Morley" pattern bridge, as mfg and sold by John Alvey Turner, used extra space between 5th and 4th strings. I do not know when these were first made but the earliest advertisement I have been able to find was from June 1972. The clipped corners, I presume, was done because Joe Morley would often use his little finger on the corner of the bridge as a muting effect.

The bridge on the banjo he is playing in his tutor is not that pattern so it was likely not yet in production as late as 1929.

This something that is worth experimenting with, and there is definitely a case to be made for Crowe spacing. However, when I tried it, it placed the outside strings too close to the edge of the neck. So it seems like neck design and bridge spacing are codependent to an extent.

Below are some reference images of bridges designed for gut along with "modern" bridges for wire.

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

One other point I would like to add, the "Morley" pattern bridge, as mfg and sold by John Alvey Turner, used extra space between 5th and 4th strings. I do not know when these were first made but the earliest advertisement I have been able to find was from June 1972. The clipped corners, I presume, was done because Joe Morley would often use his little finger on the corner of the bridge as a muting effect.

The bridge on the banjo he is playing in his tutor is not that pattern so it was likely not yet in production as late as 1929.

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I'm assuming that you're referring to this JAT ad?

The treble-bass side gradual 'widening' on regular string spacing rules increases string spacing on the bass side. This Morley-style bridge takes that a (wide) step further with the notable extra width between the 4th and 5th. 

Maybe this gave him the room to generate more attack on the bass string? Or else he just had big thumbs!

Yes, that is the one. J

AT advertised their "Bestone" bridge in Keynotes. I'm not so sure that the "Morley" bridge was extant before the 1970s.

I have a few originals, I'll double check, but I believe the strings are all spaced evenly except for 4 and 5.

JAT’s popular ‘Bestone’ bridge could be said to represent a version of ‘standard’. It also has a much wider gap between 4th and 5th strings.

With a basic set of tools and emery paper this style bridge is easily made. Experimenting with different wood is also easily done. I’m curious if there is a tendency for finger-style players to adjust the 'standard' or typical string spacing to their own spec?

The Grover uncapped bridge with its more even string spacing is another version of ‘standard’ and was originally listed by Clifford Essex Ltd as their No.6 standard bridge.

I was able to locate three original Morley bridges, 1 is 1/2" and 2 are 9/16".

All notches are evenly spaced except for between the 4th and 5th. When I was making copies of these I had matched my notching template to the originals.

As to the question, while I tend to like narrower (such as SSS spacing), I am indifferent and my hand seems to self adjust instantly. I will say I don't like the "modern" standard as I find it is too wide for fingerstyle.

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

As to the question, while I tend to like narrower (such as SSS spacing), I am indifferent and my hand seems to self adjust instantly. I will say I don't like the "modern" standard as I find it is too wide for fingerstyle.

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My preferred spacing is probably wider than the Stewart spec, though I'm not sure of his exact recommended measurements. I use my own design bridge that has evolved in stages. To date I've made about 25 of this style bridge, mostly for my own use but also several for friends. The influence was an original old (walnut) bridge that turned up in a vintage banjo case. A solid foot style but with small grooves in the foot, not really qualifying as arches. These grooves have gradually become arches with altered spacing and the overall body very much thinned. My latest version is English maple 13mm height which is fractionally higher than 1/2". I like it a lot. Apple also works well. But I'm just about to make a Morley-style bridge of Canadian hard maple for a direct comparison of the two bridges on the same (Weaver) banjo. I now fancy to try a wider spacing between 4th and 5th too.

As much as possible, I try to match the string spacing to the fingerboard width. I like equal spacing, "standard" 42 mm or slightly narrower like 40 mm. What may be less common is that I've taken to slightly sloping bridges so that they sit a bit lower toward the treble side.

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Originally posted by banjoboyd

As much as possible, I try to match the string spacing to the fingerboard width. I like equal spacing, "standard" 42 mm or slightly narrower like 40 mm. What may be less common is that I've taken to slightly sloping bridges so that they sit a bit lower toward the treble side.

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That is similar spacing to my current set-up. But experimenting with the wider 4th to 5th spacing will shortly require an adjustment/rethink. I do use a Stewmac slot rule that very slightly widens the spacing toward the bass side, but not so that gradation is noticeable to the eye.

Interesting that you modify your bridge height from bass to treble. I had a feeling that this thread might reveal player modifications! I taper my bridges in a different plane;  thinning toward the treble side. A feature that I've included almost from the start of my bridge making. Recently I was reading through Tarrant Bailey Snr's delightful 'From A Bath Chair' articles in the later BMG's and was amused to find a brief reference that he made his own bridges and that they were also tapered to be thinner on the treble side. A salutary lesson, if one was ever needed, that these old players had done it all and 'worn the T-shirt' before we were born!

Edit: I'll see if I can find Tarrant Bailey Snr's reference and post it here.

Here is an idea from 1902

And, yes, the name does seem to be a pun.

Banjo design limitations are something I consider. I am fond of British made banjos. Early Weaver banjos used a narrow tailpiece, but at some point he switched to a wider tailpiece with spacing that matches the spacing on the bridge.

Later (about January of 1922) Clifford Essex started using their "professional" tailpiece. This tailpiece spaces the strings inline with the A. D. Grover non-tip, which was what CE was using on their banjos.

I've not had a problem with matching fingerboard width as I like a narrower spacing.

With the Morley bridge, I have often wondered if it was more about giving the 4th string more space to vibrate than space for the thumb to strike it. When playing a "bass solo" (as featured in many Morley compositions) being heavy handed can cause the 4th to buzz against adjacent strings if you are striking it correctly (and not "hooking it" so it buzzes against the frets).

My experimenting has also been well within the limit of fingerboard width.

The wider spacing between 4th and 5th has sparked my curiosity. Could there be lateral vibration of the 4th that would need a wider gap? Wouldn’t that sort of lateral movement require an equal gap either side of the bass string? My thinking is that the string moves vertically making Ethan’s tapered height modification more relevant. But I’m no physicist.

The only vibration issues I’ve encountered have been string buzz - always on the 4th string - usually due to a poorly fitted vellum. Too low and obviously it negates all the other elements of set-up. A higher bridge is a ‘fix’ but I prefer to go back to basics and re-fit the vellum and get everything set up so that my preferred height bridge functions normally.

My finger-style playing experience is with English banjos, with one exception - a 6-string Buckbee made for export to the U.K. Recently I’ve been playing a Weaver 5-string but this is really happenstance because it’s one of only a few later fretted vintage banjos that I have. Weavers have a beautiful tone and playability and a deserved reputation; but I’m always a little frustrated at the cult status Weavers have among the ‘classic’ community. There are other English makers whose tone and playability are on a par. I tend to assume this singularity is a by-product of the disproportionate ‘classic’ focus on a very few high-profile players - particularly Morley -whom we know played/recorded on Weaver banjos. The effect of our modern 'celibrity culture' being retrospectively (and selectively) applied?

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

Curious to try the altered string spacing mentioned earlier in this thread, I finished this bridge this morning.

Canadian Sugar Maple 1/2” height. Overall string spacing 42mm. The first 4 strings spaced using a slot rule giving graduated spacing from treble to bass side. New (to me) wider spacing between bass and 5th string.

Currently not as thin as my own design bridges. Working on the principle that you can shave wood off but you can't put it back. Play first, assess, and then maybe amend...

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

This something that is worth experimenting with, and there is definitely a case to be made for Crowe spacing. However, when I tried it, it placed the outside strings too close to the edge of the neck. So it seems like neck design and bridge spacing are codependent to an extent.

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Crowe bridge string spacing closely mirrors that of many popular acoustic guitars which is beneficial to those of us that play multiple instruments fingerstyle. Crowe bridge spacing works well with 1" string spacing on a 1-1/4" banjo nut which seemingly has become today's common standard. Many banjos of bygone days have very narrow nuts, ergo very narrow necks at the nut which will cause the strings to ride close to the sides of the fretboard. 
I prefer all of my instruments to have the same string spacing on bridge and at the nut which is beneficial in numerous ways. 
Experimentation is always a musicians friend and it's also fun try out different bridges until just that right one happens along  

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

 

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

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Fingerstyle could be played on any type of banjo. Fretless and flush fret, any size rim, any scale length. I've only owned one tenor banjo,  a Clifford Essex Clipper, and I played that finger-style. A vintage model at the lower end of their range but it had a beautiful warm tone played with bare fingers. Not at all a tone we normally associate with the tenor banjo.

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

 

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

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Define "modern banjo".

quote:

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

 

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

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Define "modern banjo".

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Banjos made today (figuratively speaking).

quote:

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Originally posted by EEB

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

 

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

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Fingerstyle could be played on any type of banjo. Fretless and flush fret, any size rim, any scale length. I've only owned one tenor banjo,  a Clifford Essex Clipper, and I played that finger-style. A vintage model at the lower end of their range but it had a beautiful warm tone played with bare fingers. Not at all a tone we normally associate with the tenor banjo.

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I don't know when resonators were invented but when I see really old pictures of banjo players they always seemed to be holding open back banjos. 
I have gobs of resonator banjos so I thought this would be the perfect excuse to get an open back. 
 

you're not helping. 

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

quote:

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Originally posted by EEB

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Which are the popular/preferred vintage U.S banjos for finger-style?

It might be interesting to start a thread on the use of modern banjos for finger-style? I can almost hear the brittle crunching as purist’s teeth clench down on briar pipe stems!

 

I think I hear them!

but I would be interested in that too. I assume that the starting point would be open back?

---

Fingerstyle could be played on any type of banjo. Fretless and flush fret, any size rim, any scale length. I've only owned one tenor banjo,  a Clifford Essex Clipper, and I played that finger-style. A vintage model at the lower end of their range but it had a beautiful warm tone played with bare fingers. Not at all a tone we normally associate with the tenor banjo.

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I don't know when resonators were invented but when I see really old pictures of banjo players they always seemed to be holding open back banjos. 
I have gobs of resonator banjos so I thought this would be the perfect excuse to get an open back. 
 

you're not helping. 

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You need help? 
 

Gobs of resonator banjos? Buy an openback, and something cheap that will pass muster as a removable 'resonator'. Car wheel trim, circular bread board, a dinner plate at a push. Camoflage on entry and that's mission accomplished.

A friend of a close friend has a thing for acquiring shotguns. He stains each new arrival the same dark colour. His wife thinks he just has one.

I use standard bluegrass spacing and yes picks--anyway I go thru different 2 type of bridges or a modified bridge of the same kind --some nights one for a fuller sound or one where the first string is too loud--Or just change out the tone--
I do the spillway or the bigfoot--unfortunately--Don New who made these passed and his adds are just artifacts --I just don't hang out in the region of the usual bluegrass types--

But I do find myself going back and forth--

I have seen that rules can be bent a little by those that pull a rabbit or 2 out of the hat--and then --run for cover