As you listen to a song to figure out the chords, beware of what I call "false positives"--things that feel to you like a chord is changing, but with no chord change. Typically, this will occur at the beginning of a line or phrase. Yes, that represents something new in the song, but it's something new in meter or lyrics, not chords. The other situation where you might feel a false positive occurs when the melody jumps dramatically to a higher or lower note, but on the same chord. Once again, this IS something new in the song, but it's something new in melody, not chords.

As with all of this, the more you try, the better you get at it.

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Originally posted by Baytree

Most of my musical experience until now has been singing a capella and playing melody on winds. 

 

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A capella, huh? What do you sing - soprano, alto, tenor or bass? I've sung in choirs longer than I've played banjo or guitar, and my feeling for chord changes has benefited from that. I should add that, in a mixed choir I sing bass, so I'm accustomed to hearing where the root of the chord should be, and going there. But I've also sung alto in a male voice quartet, and that also helps you to hear when a chord change is coming.

Apart from that, just learn the chord shapes for each key, and be aware of what key you're in.

Some folks have recommended learning the guitar as a help. My recommendation is the Autoharp! On it, you can run through all the possible chords so quickly that you're bound to find the right one. The name of the chord is even printed on the button! I often use the 'harp to work out more difficult arrangements.

Cheers,

John

In bluegrass chords are standardized... and usually simple and obvious. A person really doesn't need a good ear to play bluegrass backing...just attention to detail and collaboration with the rest of the band

Old time fiddle tunes and Irish fiddle tunes ...guitar chords are not standardized...but subjective and more personal choice... a much more complex process than bluegrass

popular songs are usually standardized as well... find a lead sheet

Try my new book “5-String Banjo: How to Play Chords All Over the Neck,” available on Amazon. It might be just what you need.

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Originally posted by BobbyE

Every key has its own set of chords. Also, there is a minor chord as well. In bluegrass music most songs follow the root chord, the IVth. chord, and the Vth. chord. And then the minor and IInd. chord can be played on certain songs.

For instance: G is the key and root chord. Four chords up from that is the C chord. G, A, B, C. (always count the root chord as I). The Vth chord is the D chord. G, A, B, C, and D. D is fifth chord up from G.

This works this way for every major key, or at least most that you will use in bluegrass. Key of C.
Root chord C and 4 up is F chord, and 5 up from that is the G. Chord. Same for A.

The second chord is the next chord up from the root chord of the key. The minor chord is the second chord down from the root chord. The minor for key of G is Em. ( G, F, Em)

If this ain't what you are asking, my apologies but perhaps it can help someone else.  

Bobby

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Bobby-
I am just a little confused. When you describe how to know the IV and V chords you go up the scale Four or Five tones, COUNTING the Root. But when you describe the minor chord- in this case Em in the key of G- you say it's the Second chord down, which if you were counting the root as before, would be the F#. Counting the root, as before, would make the Em the Third chord down from the root.
Is going down the scale treated differently than going up the scale?

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Originally posted by mkwbanjo

quote:

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Originally posted by BobbyE

Every key has its own set of chords. Also, there is a minor chord as well. In bluegrass music most songs follow the root chord, the IVth. chord, and the Vth. chord. And then the minor and IInd. chord can be played on certain songs.

For instance: G is the key and root chord. Four chords up from that is the C chord. G, A, B, C. (always count the root chord as I). The Vth chord is the D chord. G, A, B, C, and D. D is fifth chord up from G.

This works this way for every major key, or at least most that you will use in bluegrass. Key of C.
Root chord C and 4 up is F chord, and 5 up from that is the G. Chord. Same for A.

The second chord is the next chord up from the root chord of the key. The minor chord is the second chord down from the root chord. The minor for key of G is Em. ( G, F, Em)

If this ain't what you are asking, my apologies but perhaps it can help someone else.  

Bobby

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Bobby-
I am just a little confused. When you describe how to know the IV and V chords you go up the scale Four or Five tones, COUNTING the Root. But when you describe the minor chord- in this case Em in the key of G- you say it's the Second chord down, which if you were counting the root as before, would be the F#. Counting the root, as before, would make the Em the Third chord down from the root.
Is going down the scale treated differently than going up the scale?

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The triads built off the scale degrees of a major scale would be as follows. 
 

1 (root or tonic) - major (I)

2 (supertonic) - minor (ii)

3 (mediant) - minor (iii)

4 (subdominant) - major (IV)

5 (dominant) - major (V)

6 (submediant) - minor (vi)

7 (leading tone) - diminished (vii0)

Em in the key of G is built off of the 6th degree  

Couple simple almost always rules/PATTERNS.
Song starts in 1 chord or G and ends in the same.
Before the ending G chord is the 5 chord or D.
After starting with the G Chord, it usually goes to 4(C) or 5 chord (D).
C chord goes to G or D.
D chord most always revolves back to G or 1 chord.

Strum along with some songs and see what sounds right and what sounds back. If it does not sound right, go back, do it again, and change chords. You will start hearing stuff coming.

Exceptions in G: EM (6M) used in place of C. (notice how it is almost made the same) next most used chord is Am (2M).

The circle of 5ths is a musical cheat sheet for all of this.
Ken

Ken

If you type the first line (or any line, I think) of a song that you don't know into the search box of the internet on your computer, you should be able to find the name of the song. I just put in "what is the name of the song with the line _________, and the answer will usually come up.  Then you can take the song name and type in "banjo chords and lyrics for such and such song name", ahd some websites will come up.  That way, since you know know the tune goes from singing, you can play it..  At least that usually works for me.

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Originally posted by Baytree

Nopix,

I’m not sure of the proper term for what my right hand is doing… I pick individual notes with my thumb and index finger (mostly up picking, some down picking), and strum chords with the nail of my index finger.

I have an idea of the songs I’d like to play, but I don’t know titles for most of them… I learned to sing from family and we rarely talked about songs by name. A couple I do have titles for are Little Brown Jug, Wayfaring Stranger, Pretty Saro, and John Henry (though with a different tune than I’ve heard anywhere else).

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It's getting easier all the time. My Google has a microphone picture in the search window. If you touch that, and then start to sing, it searches songs.

>>I am just a little confused. When you describe how to know the IV and V chords you go up the scale Four or Five tones, COUNTING the Root. But when you describe the minor chord- in this case Em in the key of G- you say it's the Second chord down, which if you were counting the root as before, would be the F#.<<

I am referring to the letter only that refers to the key. E-F-G. Two letters down from G is E, or Em as far as the precise chord is. If in F it would be D-E.F, so minor chord is Dm in key of F. Key of C would be A-B_C. Minor chord is Am in key of C. Music theory is somewhat math based in the ways that it works in some ways, or at least, it helps me with theory all along. What little theory I know.

Bobby

Bobby

I am simple and self taught and figured this issue out. I'll try my best to help you. The musical chords and keys alphabet is, A,B,C,D,E,F,G. Each key has its own chords in a different order. The theory you can look up is the Circle of fifths. They have charts for visual learning that helps. They usually use Roman numerals to Identify the chords order. I use 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 instead. Say you want to play a simple 3 chord song, you know you will be in the key of G. G, C, D ( are the three chords in the song).

To find the chords in the key of G, counting order starts with G, is number 1. 2, 3, 4 is chord C, 5 is chord D. 6th number will be the minor Chord. E minor (whenever you choose to use a minor).

note: When using the circle of 5 theory, whatever key the song is in, number 1 is that key. The music alphabet count starts in the Key you will be using for the song.

Say you like a simple 3 chord song in the key of D. (D, G, A) counting order starts with D as Chord number 1. 2, 3, 4 is chord G. 5 is chord A. 6 is B minor.

This is what I commented to Megan Lynch Chowning:
Early on, I counted on my fingers.
The key/root/1, would be my thumb.
Alphabetically count over to my ring finger is the 4 chord.
Count over to the pinky is the 5 chord.
It works on the common, G, D, A, E, & C keys.

Getting back to the original question, listen to, or better yet,learn to play the bass.

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Originally posted by Baytree

Do you have any advice or resources for training myself to hear chords?

Unfortunately I can’t just look up other people’s arrangements since many of the songs I know are very hard to find.

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Keep looking. Even hard to find songs can turn up.

And keep spending time with songs you can find. That's how I developed the ability to figure out chords at about age 13 - 14 in 1964-65. I learned chords to Beatles songs out of books and to popular folk songs of the day from other guitar players.

After enough time, I began to recognize the sounds of music, and especially how nearly every song ended on the chord with the same name as the key.

I also stumbled on the same discovery of how a capo works as you mentioned.

Work on finding the key of a song through trial-and-error of matching chords on your banjo to the likely root (I) chord of a recording of the song you're trying to learn.

You've received good explanations and advice elsewhere that I don't need to repeat.

But I'll offer a few comments: The chords after I, IV and V (sometimes V7) that will appear most in folk music are the vi (6) minor and maybe the ii (2) minor. In key of G, that would be E minor (vi) and A minor (ii).  The iii (3) minor (B minor in G) is less likely to occur, in traditional songs. Composed songs, yes.

The true vii° (a diminished) chord is almost never used. In key of G: F#dim. Not by name, that is. But the 3 notes of F#dim are inside the 4-note D7 chord!  Bluegrass and traditional folk do occasionally use the "flat seven" chord from outside the key. That would be an F Major chord in the key of G. Something else to train your ear for.

In songs outside of traditional folk, the 2 and 3 are sometimes switched to Major -- which is outside the key, so can throw off beginners. The 2 chord -- whether used as minor or non-key Major -- will almost always be followed by the V chord.  That's because the 2 is the "five of the five" and so makes a stronger resolution to it.

Rick's advice about bass is excellent. The bass is almost always going to be playing the root note on the beat where a chord change happens or on the first note of a measure. So try to match the bass note and over 90% of the time you'll have the name note of the chord. But, again: only on the beats where the bass seems to be anchoring the chord.

Good luck.

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Originally posted by BobbyE

I am referring to the letter only that refers to the key. E-F-G. Two letters down from G is E, or Em as far as the precise chord is. . . Music theory is somewhat math based in the ways that it works in some ways, or at least, it helps me with theory all along. What little theory I know.

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Counting down two is definitely a quick way to get there. Nothing wrong with what works.

But I think it's also useful to count up, which will show that the chord you're after is always the six. Another number worth remembering along with the four and five. Or just remember that when you count "down" two, you're taking a shortcut to the six.

As to "what little theory" you know: I like to say people probably know more theory than they realize they know.

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Originally posted by Nopix

This is what I commented to Megan Lynch Chowning:
Early on, I counted on my fingers.
The key/root/1, would be my thumb.
Alphabetically count over to my ring finger is the 4 chord.
Count over to the pinky is the 5 chord.
It works on the common, G, D, A, E, & C keys.

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Great, simpler explanation. I started the same way you explained it, I still do the finger count some times.