I believe the Prucha has a wonderful full, rich, and warm tone as contrasted to other banjos that in my humble opinion sound great but yet kind of thin compared to Prucha. I was just wondering if anyone else has experimented with different heads on their Prucha and what were their conclusions.
I've changed mine a couple of times. The original head had a small split, half inch, up inside by the aluminum band of the head. So I changed it. Got the new head too tight once. It sounded pretty much like a thud, lost loudness and brilliance. I changed it because I had read that once you get it too tight that you have reached some limit of elasticity or something and it would never sound the same. don't know if that is true or not. Anyone have anything to substantiate that? right now I have a five star full frosted head on it which sounds pretty bright and loud.
15 Comments |
 | nicecloud says:
1/15/2013 5:57:59 AM
Mine came with Remo but I've seen some of his banjos with renaissance head also. My Ome banjo has a renaissance head, quite different sound. I believe you should go with a remo as basic as reference.
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 | stanger says:
1/15/2013 7:55:22 AM
Heads always break that way. Most of the time, I never see the break as it's covered up by the tension hoop, but I can instantly tell when a head has broken.
My banjo came with a Renaissance, and it's still on the banjo. When I got it in 2006, I had already used Rens on 2 of my other banjos and found I liked their tone, but my Prucha Diamond Point really sounds the best of them all with its Ren. My banjo head has been consistently tuned to around G#, but it has gotten a little brighter over the years as they head aged.
When I last saw Jarda in 2009, he checked out my banjo and tightened the head. It became a little too bright for my tastes, so after I came home, I loosened it again just a bit and haven't touched it since.
Prucha said he likes them a lot and uses them often. he particularly favors them on his top tensions. He uses a standard Remo most of the time on his Gibson style banjos, and also likes the tone of the Remo black heads.
I think a top frosted 5-Star would be a good head for Pruchas; they're thicker than Remos, and have a different method of attaching the head to it's hoop. Remo uses epoxy to glue the head to the hoop, and 5-Star crimps the head between 2 thinner hoops. I've never seen a 5-Star break.
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| stanger says:
1/15/2013 8:12:28 AM
Tightening a head is easy. Loosening a head requires more; must backing the nuts off won't do it because of the massive amount of friction between the head, hoop, and tone ring.
To loosen a head, you have to physically push it so the head hoop comes up to the bottom of the tension hoop again. I do it by pushing down hard with my thumbs in the center area of the head first, on the under side, in a circle, then move my pushing outward toward the rim. Then I turn the banjo over and do the same from the top side. This works with all the heads I've ever used.
Once they're pushed, they will sound like the head is very slack for a couple of days, but the plastic will tighten itself up again a little bit- it's called stored tension. Sometimes, after it re-tigtens it's just perfect, sometimes it may need a small tightening, and sometimes it needs to be a tad looser. I can never predict just how it will do 100%.
But once a head is loosened, I always give it at least 2 weeks before I tweak it. I've found it takes at least that long to have my ears get used to the changes. If I like the new tone after that, I don't touch the head again.
There is always something in every banjo's tone a person thinks could be better. I keep my heads relatively loose, and when I want a brighter tone, I crank my tailpiece down until I get the brightness I want. This works particularly well on my Prucha.
I always keep very little down pressure on the tailpiece at first, and I always use an adjustable tailpiece. My fave is the Kerschner DeLuxe, as it can put a lot of pressure on the bridge and is very adjustable. I'm no fan of the Presto, but I like the Presto DeLuxe, the ones with the clamshell cover and an adjustment thumbscrew.
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 | Chuck Taylor says:
1/15/2013 9:53:56 AM
Stanger,
Thank you for taking the time to answer and comment on my concerns of head tension and head selection.
I like the idea of adjusting downward pressure of the tailpiece to control brightness. I hope that works.
I've had a lot of trouble with maintaining the warm rich sound but not having the bright punch required in a jam. I finally found the head was never tight enough (was afraid of over stretching the head, causing it to tear and also wanting to keep the warm rich sound) .
I never had this problem with my Bill Sullivan "first quality" tone ring banjo which I have had for nearly 30 years.
Tightening it a tad every five years or so seemed to keep the "too loose a head" sound at bay. It is a five star head.
Loosening a head "backing off the nuts won't do it" makes a lot of sense. Still trying to envision though "physically push it so the head hoop comes up to the bottom of the tension hoop again" Isn't the head hoop always touching the bottom of the tension hoop? Are you talking about a few thousands of an inch gap? Will a head re-tighten after removal from the banjo and let set for a few weeks?
I really like the full tone and will eventually try a renaissance head. But I hope it will still be possible to get the brightness and loudness to punch through a jam that other banjos seem to do well.
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 | Halfgar says:
1/15/2013 10:31:06 AM
Hello Chuck,
i have tried 4 different Heads on my Prucha. A Remo Wagon Wheel, a Remo Taiwan Head, a AMB Remo and a Ludwig Head. For my Taste the Remo Taiwan is the best, followed by the Ludwig.
The Taiwan Remo has a similar mounting system as the Ludwig (crimped)
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| Halfgar says:
1/15/2013 10:44:07 AM
Hello Chuck,
i have tried 4 different Heads on my Prucha. A Remo Wagon Wheel, a Remo Taiwan Head, a AMB Remo and a Ludwig Head. For my Taste the Remo Taiwan is the best, followed by the Ludwig.
The Taiwan Remo has a similar mounting system as the Ludwig (crimped)
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| Chuck Taylor says:
1/15/2013 12:30:48 PM
Interesting, I have never heard of any of these. Are they hard to find? I do play "wagon wheel" every chance I get though , ha LOL. Is your taste in banjo tone more like mellow rich full tone or like the grass pickers from back east that tune-up with capo on the 4th fret on a prewar mastertone type tone ring? My self, I like the sound of Alison Brown's banjo.
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| Halfgar says:
1/15/2013 1:00:59 PM
Hi, no, most of them are not hard to find.
AMB Head can be found here: americanmadebanjo.com/product_...ts_id=109
The Taiwan Remos have i once bought from First Quality Music (try to search for Taiwan Remo Head)
and the Ludwig Head are easy to find: (some) Deering Heads, Five Star and of course Ludwig are Ludwig Heads. Find them for example here: jdmc.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Scre...&CpValue=
My Taste is like between the two you describe. But for the Prucha it is not the pure Bluegrass Cannon i like (that is my JDGoldstar from 81 ;-)
Hope that helps
Marcus
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| Chuck Taylor says:
1/15/2013 5:43:34 PM
Interesting, I have never heard of any of these. Are they hard to find? I do play "wagon wheel" every chance I get though , ha LOL. Is your taste in banjo tone more like mellow rich full tone or like the grass pickers from back east that tune-up with capo on the 4th fret on a prewar mastertone type tone ring? My self, I like the sound of Alison Brown's banjo.
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| stanger says:
1/26/2013 10:52:22 AM
Hi, Chuck...
When the bracket nuts are loosened, all that happens is loose nuts. The head and tension hoop will stay right where they are due to friction and the down pressure from the strings.
The head has to be pushed upward to force the head hoop to push the tension hoop upward. How much push is needed depends on how much the bracket nuts were backed off. The pushing will snug the hooks to the tension hoop. Everything comes upward so the head can relax.
As I mentioned, plastic has a 'memory'- there's a lot of stored tension in the head, so after it is loosened, most often the head will become slightly tighter again as all of the stored tension is not released all at once.
If only the bracket nuts are loosened and none of the other stuff is done, the nuts will eventually just vibrate off their hooks. This happens a lot on tailpiece nuts.
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| Chuck Taylor says:
1/27/2013 9:41:47 AM
Stanger,
"all that happens is loose nuts" makes a lot of sense. I'll bet not many know this. Thanks for posting.
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| stanger says:
6/28/2013 1:49:40 PM
Hi, Chuck...
The Prucha tone is deceptive. Be assured that your banjo has plenty of punch- others listening to it are usually more aware of the power than the player is.
When I took mine to it's first jam, it was still brand new, and had only been a finished banjo for about a week. It was still settling in and the Ren head was still stretching.
The jam is an old long-standing one that has a lot of good players who know their business. I thought my Prucha lacked power when I played the first song on it, but everyone, especially the fiddlers and guitar players loved it for it's deep throaty tone, and said it had plenty of power when I leaned into it. More than I could hear until I handed it to another banjoist for the next tune.
The element they all liked best was how well it fit with all the other instruments. All of them were only familiar with the common too-loud, too-bright. glass shattering sound that so many other banjos are prone to producing.
They all thought that the Prucha's tone was much more 'musical' than any other any of them had ever heard before.
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| Chuck Taylor says:
7/2/2013 9:44:28 AM
After having this banjo for a year I can not agree with you more. Every other banjo I've played after having the Prucha sounds, er, well... I describe the tone as thin compared to my Prucha.
Though I have had trouble getting the head to the proper tightness. Most of the year has been spent with the head too loose. Two reasons: the first head had the small tear at the rim and I was being overly cautious, second I was looking for that Alison Brown sound which I thought came from a looser head.
I've had to stop playing for three months because of an ulnar nerve problem in the left hand that I had surgery for. finally just this past Sunday I was able to pick again. I did let some one else play it and he liked it. One of the other jammers said "wow that thing is loud". which brings me to the subject of picking power in the right hand. while having nerve conduction study for the left hand they did my right hand too and the test indicated there was some nerve lost there too. Greg of Boyd's Fine Instruments may know about nerve problems. (I think you two are friends)
It seems some of the people I play with are always telling me to "dig in" So maybe they have a point. Generally I'd rather play well than loud. same is true for speed. I'd rather play slow and soulful than fast and sloppy. Also I've noticed that the tone and brilliance seems to go away after picking for a couple of hours which I've blamed on the head getting loose or something. It might be more to do with my right hand getting weaker after a couple of hours.
Anyway thanks for giving me that feedback on the Prucha.
I am a proud Prucha picker.
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| stanger says:
7/3/2013 6:58:35 AM
Hi, Chuck...
I played Alison's banjo a couple of years ago. It's set up very loose, and has a low action combined with light gauge strings.
Her attack is lighter and very precise, so she relies on mics and amplification onstage for power, rather than her right hand.
Greg, too, has had nerve problems in his hands and arms over the years. He's a big guy and worked for a commercial hardware and bolt supply company for a long time. His damage came from lugging 100 lb. bins of bolts in and out of his truck.
For a very long time, he couldn't play the banjo very much, but over the past 4 years or so, has come back a lot, mostly due to good therapy, a regimen of vitamins, and a lot of very careful and diligent practice.
He's modified his playing style, and probably won't ever be able to play as fast or powerfully as he did when we first met almost 30 years ago, but it's coming back pretty well.
His favorite banjo is a Bat he sold, then bought back and decided to keep the second time around. We all have sold banjos we regret selling later, but dealers often get more second chances than the rest of us.
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| Chuck Taylor says:
7/3/2013 11:38:34 AM
Thanks Stanger,
I'm glad Greg's situation is improving.
"very careful and diligent practice", the word careful in there is interesting. I've been thinking a lot about that lately.
I'll call him and we can share "nerve" stories.
Also good information on Alison's set up. Boy would I like to talk to her sometime. She has recorded and written some great music, I just love it. And Greg Cahill just raved about her studio work (mixing and producing) when he recorded at her compass records studio.
-Chuck
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