rkdjones - Posted - 03/05/2026:  10:40:12

This is not really theory but applies to all styles in which one might want to pick out melodies.

I downloaded the free Functional Ear Training app on my iPad. I just started using it. I'm aware that apps have their limitations. I will continue playing with this one, partly because it is kind of addictive. But I am wondering if others here have used this app, and found it helpful. Did it really train your ear to recognize notes?

Nopix - Posted - 03/05/2026:  14:31:55

I insist on having a trophy when I'm done, so I get songs from Ultimate Guitar tab /chord site and figure them out so I can play them. It sounds easy/straight forward, but piano tunes/songs are difficult because a piano can easily do so much. Like slash chords and passing/transitional chords guitars and banjers wouldn't generally use.
A journey it surely is.

banjomobob - Posted - 03/05/2026:  14:49:18

You could also train your ear by playing your banjo.

kayakeradam - Posted - 03/05/2026:  16:14:43

I used to have a terrible ear. I've been working on it and now I have just kind of a weak ear. But I have made a lot of improvement.

I started with an app called Perfect Ear. I just used the free modules and got a lot better.

Then I used ChatGPT to vibe-code a tool. I told it what I wanted in terms of being able to choose what scale, duration of the notes, etc. And that I wanted Space Bar to repeat the notes, S to show what the notes are, and Enter to give me new notes.

It spat out some HTML code. I saved it on my PC and bookmarked it. Now I can just sit at my computer, have it play some tones, I figure out what notes they are. I've gotten a lot faster at it.

I'd be happy to share, though am I allowed to post an HTML file to this forum? I could see that setting off a LOT of alarm bells.

rkdjones - Posted - 03/06/2026:  10:09:02

I didn't know chatgbt would write code for me, but why not. Great idea. Sharing code is probably not good computer hygiene. If you remember could you send me the prompts you used to get AI to do your bidding?

I will try Perfect Ear also. I suspect that using a variety of apps that do the same thing would be more effective, particularly if one could mimic a violin, guitar, bass, or banjo.

kayakeradam - Posted - 03/07/2026:  09:26:47

Well, like I said, I kind of vibe coded it. I'll give you my side of the thread; you can probably condense some of it into a single prompt.

I want to improve my ear so that I can pick up melodies and play them on my banjo. I want you to create something for me that plays notes so I can work on figuring them out on my banjo. I'd like a selector so I can choose which major key the notes should be in. I'd like a selector where I can choose how many notes play. I'd like a selector that lets me choose the duration of the note. All the notes need to be in the range that can be played on a standard 5 string banjo tuned to the key of G. I want to hit the space bar to play the same notes again, hit the letter S to show what the notes were, and hit enter to get a new set of notes. I'd like a toggle that lets me choose if the notes play in a loop or just play once. Do you need any more info to make this for me?

(It asked some questions and offered some pretty good suggestions)

I'll take the full note range. For playback style, can you include a selector so I can choose among them? Evenly spaced is fine for timing. Give me a toggle for the passing notes. And yes, I'll take a toggle for difficulty.

(It gave me some code. I clarified that I wanted it as html)

this is good. can you make the play button the width of the other two buttons and put it underneath them. Can you also add a pause button

(it spat out some more code. there was a bug that made a dropdown not work. I reported that and it made some fixed code. At that point the difficulty was in language I wasn't familiar with, like "stepwise" and "leaps." Also, when it revealed the notes, they were a little hard to read.)

for the difficulty options, can you put easy, medium, hard in parentheses next to the appropriate option? And when you reveal the notes, can you make the font bigger and put a box around each note?

(At that point it gave me some code that worked well enough. I'd used up my free credits for this chat so I decided not to futz with it anymore. But the tool is kind of awesome. it's like having the most patient person in the world willing to sit in front of their 1980s casio keyboard and play notes until you figure them out.)

rkdjones - Posted - 03/07/2026:  12:25:44

Adam (I assume), Thanks. You set me on a whole new path.

As an aside, I used to work developing computer models to simulate fate and transport of pollutants in the environment. The rise of AI had me wishing that I hadn't retired; there is going to be some interesting work in the world of modeling. I even dreamt that I was still working and excited about using AI in a coding project.

rkdjones - Posted - 03/07/2026:  12:27:36

SONOFIELD EAR TRAINING APP:

Wondering if anyone has experience with this approach?

kayakeradam - Posted - 03/09/2026:  06:10:47

quote:

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Originally posted by rkdjones

Adam (I assume), Thanks. You set me on a whole new path.



As an aside, I used to work developing computer models to simulate fate and transport of pollutants in the environment. The rise of AI had me wishing that I hadn't retired; there is going to be some interesting work in the world of modeling. I even dreamt that I was still working and excited about using AI in a coding project.

---

Yeah, the funny thing about AI is that it knows nothing about music or coding. If you remember that it actually doesn't know or understand anything, you can get it to do some pretty cool stuff. I heard a great quote: it's not a brilliant assistant, it's infinite mediocre assistants. 

CantSing - Posted - 03/09/2026:  12:07:47

quote:

---

Originally posted by rkdjones

SONOFIELD EAR TRAINING APP:



Wondering if anyone has experience with this approach?

---

I have experience with Sonofield.

I started with interval training in a few other apps.  I used parts of reference songs to memorize.  (Perfect fifth, Star Wars theme song.  Octave, Somewhere Over the Rainbow).  I got really good with just the major and perfect intervals very fast.  

Then I tried sonofield, which is different, as you probably know.  For others that may not, it doesn't teach you to identify intervals, but it teaches you to recognize scale degrees against a tonic or a "key center."  Even though it's almos the same thing as interval recognition, it was much harder for me, and I ended up getting frustrated and quitting.  Then I came back to it, and it finally started to click, but it certainly took a lot longer for me to master compared to intervals.  I was a beta tester early for the app, but I have since paid for the full version and it is worth it.  It has been very fun to do in the car if I'm waiting for the kids.  I enjoy doing it as a little game to waste some time on my phone, much like chess or solitaire.  It's worth it just for that in my opinion.  

I believe both types of ear training are very useful, but I think the sonofield approach is a bit more useful.  I have never really tried to consciously apply it to playing my instruments, but I can very much tell that it has helped me.  My fingers are automatically going to the note I hear in my head much more than they used to, and I have become way better at learning songs by ear.  



Note that the creator of sonofield recommends that you don't learn the scale degrees by using reference songs.  He instead suggests taking a "feeling state" approach, which I have tried to do, but I have never been successful at it.  Perhaps we are just wired differently, or maybe I'll get it one day.  

I use reference songs with sonofield, but it's a little different since it's not quite the same thing as an interval.  For example, in sonofield, when I hear the 5, I hear the first note of silent night in my head.  This makes sense because the first note of that song is the 5, in the context of a 1 chord.  Or for the 2, I hear "WHAT you are" which is the 2 going down to a 1.  After enough times, I don't think about the reference songs anymore, and I just know it.  Again, when I play my instrument, I'm not actively thinking about this or trying to call out the notes... I have just noticed that I got significantly better at figuring songs out by ear since I started doing this.  

Nopix - Posted - 03/09/2026:  13:24:48

If I have a banjo or a mandolin in my hands, the song in my head is going to come out in G, as I strum the G chord. The next or first chord change will go to the 4 or 5 chord, where there's a better than 50/50 chance. Then I listen for the next change, and so on. Nobody does this? I can't be the only one.

Laurence Diehl - Posted - 03/09/2026:  13:37:18

Everyone learns differently. I am wondering how using the app interfaces with the music you’re playing. Or is it more of an academic exercise?

CantSing - Posted - 03/09/2026:  13:45:45

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurence Diehl

Everyone learns differently. I am wondering how using the app interfaces with the music you’re playing. Or is it more of an academic exercise?

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For me, it is more of an academic exercise that happens to be very fun and engaging and a replacement for mindless scrolling.  I never try to say "okay let's apply this thing I learned to the banjo (or guitar or mandolin)."  I just know that I got better at playing by ear and also at playing the same song in different keys after I started doing it.  

CantSing - Posted - 03/09/2026:  13:47:14

quote:

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Originally posted by Nopix

If I have a banjo or a mandolin in my hands, the song in my head is going to come out in G, as I strum the G chord. The next or first chord change will go to the 4 or 5 chord, where there's a better than 50/50 chance. Then I listen for the next change, and so on. Nobody does this? I can't be the only one.

---

This is also what I do.  I just happened to get better at it after doing some ear training.  

rkdjones - Posted - 03/09/2026:  15:48:19

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I find it all very helpful.

I have two related goals involving playing by ear. My first was just being able to pick out melodies. I think identifying the first note of a piece relative to the tonic and the intervals between notes would be mostly what I need. I often try this on a baritone ukulele tuned GDAE.

The second is identifying the chord progressions. This is harder for me in Old Time jam sessions where there are a lot of fiddles, than at a bluegrass session where there is a bass, and some guitars (and the session I attend has a lot of mandolins but no fiddlers). Right now I am trying to take some shortcuts using the StrumMachine app, but try to distinguish the chord progressions without looking. My biggest problem in sessions is hearing what I am playing over the other musicians, particularly a bunch of fiddlers. I keep looking for some sort of pickup that feeds into headphones.

I appreciate CantSing's comments about their experience with Sonofield. "Feeling" the notes eludes me. But hearing the music with lyrics might be the best way for me to discern melodic patterns. I'll likely go back to "Functional Ear Training" app but also find some songs with melodic patterns that I can remember and apply to other melodies (e.g. that melody sounds like a song I know).

Nopix - Posted - 03/09/2026:  16:36:06

For sure, it takes time and a love for puzzles.
I found if I voice similarities between songs or tunes, it's best to keep it to myself. For some reason a lot of folks are trying to keep song and tunes 'separate." Especially in OT, or Bluegrass, the difference between songs is just the words.
There's definitely a finite number of two and three chord progressions. (Excluding the key) There's a few more melodies, but style hemms this in too. For instance Waltzes: Hook, hook, turn around, hook in 3/4 time. Anyone could compose a Waltz. Twelve bar Blues are another predictable pattern. But as I said, for some reason you have to keep it on the down low, like it's your magic power. If a magic trick is exposed, it's sort of anticlimactic.