jsinjin - Posted - 03/19/2025:  07:23:28

First, in the OP portion of this, I picked up banjo so that I could learn music theory and learn to play a few songs. Those were and are my goals and they may be good or bad but I am doing them.

For the longest time I couldn’t understand the difference between the music in my music theory books and tab for and playing by ear. I went on a big study for myself in the wrong way to learn to play banjo to try and understand sheet music and how it relates to banjo tab. It does relate and plenty of people already know that but I didn’t understand how. For the last year each evening I’ve transcribed a tab manually into sheet music with pen and ink from a banjo song whether I know how to play it or not. I also worked to memorize how notes in sheet music are represented in the bass and treble for conventional piano or other instruments. I also spent many hours playing each fret jn a key and sayin the notes and then playing notes from sheet music at the frets and strings on my banjo in a given tuning.

And yesterday a lot came together. I was able to transcribe Angeline the baker to sheet music and get the nearly appropriate quarter and 1/8 note notation and bum ditty and brush thumb converted so I can read it and play it. I realize this is useless but I really truly feel happy because I am now understanding how music is represented between the notes in standard notation and what is physically played on my banjo.

Then I picked up a version of my kid’s piano book from many many years ago with a song called “the mighty wave” and I was able to see the notes and find them in G tuning and in Double C tuning just by reading them. I can’t sight read meaning automatically play them but I was definitely able to plink then out and get to the right places. I am quite thrilled with this and intend to continue. I’ve filled up multiple notebooks of homework for myself over the last year but this is making so much more sense from the fret to fret distances to the vibrations to the frequencies to the circle of fifths. This is my sort of super joy!

Texasbanjo - Posted - 03/19/2025:  08:09:33

Sounds like you've had one of those "ah ha" moments where suddenly things begin to make sense. Congratulations! Keep up the good work. Sounds like you're headed in the right direction.

Eulalie - Posted - 03/19/2025:  08:15:18

Congratulations. It seems as though you have replicated the age-old method of learning music and reading notes for your instrument. If you are interested in music theory, that goal will involve another level of understanding. Music theory is not that complicated but there are many moving parts. The rules for building chords and managing their interactions have been established for centuries, and there are many textbooks on harmony that will help you out. I suggest you defer the circle of fifths until you have a grasp on triads and their functions.

jsinjin - Posted - 03/19/2025:  08:54:38

I used the following books:

Behind Bars, the definitive guide to music notation by Elaine Gould

The musicians guide to theory and analysis by Jane Piper Clendinning and Elizabeth West Marvin

Alfred’s essentials of music theory by Morton Manus etal

Structural functions of harmony by Arnold Schoenberg

I selected all of these as recommendations from a colleague at my college who is a professor in the school of music and fine arts.

I worked through them last year but still refer to them a lot.

Another book I love is called Hanon exercises which details these exercises for piano like scales that I’ve adapted for clawhammer for no real purpose other than the patterns are fun up and down the neck.

mud400 - Posted - 03/19/2025:  13:53:28

That's awesome! I ended up going to guitar to learn notation, then that turned into piano.... Now I can play all three and it is pretty neat. Honestly, the banjo gets played the least of the three. I am not a fan of learning to play by ear and there is not that much music that is not tab out there for three finger style.

jsinjin - Posted - 03/19/2025:  13:58:09

We have a piano and my kids took lessons for a time but it is furniture and storage for photos now. I have only time for one instrument for sure but I enjoy practicing it.

mud400 - Posted - 03/19/2025:  21:03:28

quote:

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Originally posted by jsinjin

We have a piano and my kids took lessons for a time but it is furniture and storage for photos now. I have only time for one instrument for sure but I enjoy practicing it.

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Piano was helpful for understanding the roll/melody relationship for me.  I have always had a hard time picking out the melody. Now it is easier.

Joel Hooks - Posted - 03/20/2025:  08:01:02

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

That's awesome! I ended up going to guitar to learn notation, then that turned into piano.... Now I can play all three and it is pretty neat. Honestly, the banjo gets played the least of the three. I am not a fan of learning to play by ear and there is not that much music that is not tab out there for three finger style.

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Not "bluegrass" but there are tens of thousands of pieces of music published in standard notation for regular banjo "fingerstyle" with nearly all of it in the public domain and thousands can be found online for free.

Also plenty of methods for teaching regular banjo by notation, the best IMO is Mel Bay Banjo Method, Concert Style, by Frank Bradbury.  This is still in print. 

Also many great methods that are public domain for free.

mud400 - Posted - 03/20/2025:  08:09:35

quote:

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

That's awesome! I ended up going to guitar to learn notation, then that turned into piano.... Now I can play all three and it is pretty neat. Honestly, the banjo gets played the least of the three. I am not a fan of learning to play by ear and there is not that much music that is not tab out there for three finger style.

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Not "bluegrass" but there are tens of thousands of pieces of music published in standard notation for regular banjo "fingerstyle" with nearly all of it in the public domain and thousands can be found online for free.

Also plenty of methods for teaching regular banjo by notation, the best IMO is Mel Bay Banjo Method, Concert Style, by Frank Bradbury.  This is still in print. 

Also many great methods that are public domain for free.

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Well, what I did worked for me. I learned to play banjo using tab and was having difficulty getting past that. My instructor was of no help at that time either.  I tried the Mel Bay book as well. Maybe I was just not committed enough.

Where are these publications? I can't find them. Are they the "classic banjo" (not to be confused with classical banjo) ones?

Joel Hooks - Posted - 03/20/2025:  08:54:53

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

quote:

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

That's awesome! I ended up going to guitar to learn notation, then that turned into piano.... Now I can play all three and it is pretty neat. Honestly, the banjo gets played the least of the three. I am not a fan of learning to play by ear and there is not that much music that is not tab out there for three finger style.

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Not "bluegrass" but there are tens of thousands of pieces of music published in standard notation for regular banjo "fingerstyle" with nearly all of it in the public domain and thousands can be found online for free.

Also plenty of methods for teaching regular banjo by notation, the best IMO is Mel Bay Banjo Method, Concert Style, by Frank Bradbury.  This is still in print. 

Also many great methods that are public domain for free.

---

Well, what I did worked for me. I learned to play banjo using tab and was having difficulty getting past that. My instructor was of no help at that time either.  I tried the Mel Bay book as well. Maybe I was just not committed enough.

Where are these publications? I can't find them. Are they the "classic banjo" (not to be confused with classical banjo) ones?

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Yes, classic and stroke style/thimble style, look for "Universal Notation" or "C notation" or anything published in England. 

mud400 - Posted - 03/20/2025:  09:04:26

quote:

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

quote:

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Originally posted by Joel Hooks

quote:

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Originally posted by mud400

That's awesome! I ended up going to guitar to learn notation, then that turned into piano.... Now I can play all three and it is pretty neat. Honestly, the banjo gets played the least of the three. I am not a fan of learning to play by ear and there is not that much music that is not tab out there for three finger style.

---

Not "bluegrass" but there are tens of thousands of pieces of music published in standard notation for regular banjo "fingerstyle" with nearly all of it in the public domain and thousands can be found online for free.

Also plenty of methods for teaching regular banjo by notation, the best IMO is Mel Bay Banjo Method, Concert Style, by Frank Bradbury.  This is still in print. 

Also many great methods that are public domain for free.

---

Well, what I did worked for me. I learned to play banjo using tab and was having difficulty getting past that. My instructor was of no help at that time either.  I tried the Mel Bay book as well. Maybe I was just not committed enough.

Where are these publications? I can't find them. Are they the "classic banjo" (not to be confused with classical banjo) ones?

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Yes, classic and stroke style/thimble style, look for "Universal Notation" or "C notation" or anything published in England. 

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AH yeah, I should have been more clear. Songs I want to play. :)