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KCJones - Posted - 08/31/2024: 06:30:44
Thank you for the detailed review and your honesty. Sounds like the rumors have been confirmed. Hopefully someone at Gibson gets the message and makes it right.
GrahamHawker - Posted - 08/31/2024: 08:04:41
This is a great review. It's almost as if Epiphone were hoping that no one found out before they had sold enough to make their money back. We can see why they were so quiet about the tone ring.
Phil - MO - Posted - 08/31/2024: 08:18:30
Are all of the review posts locked?
Texasbanjo - Posted - 08/31/2024: 08:21:40
quote:
Originally posted by Phil - MO
Are all of the review posts locked?
All duplicate posts were locked. Duplicate posts are not allowed.
Phil - MO - Posted - 08/31/2024: 08:31:08
Somebody should mention that the statement "not a current rep of Goldtone" is not correct since he stated being a rep, of OME and wearing an OME cap. I read somewhere that Goldtone recently purchased OME?
Might be a conflict of interest?
Old Hickory - Posted - 08/31/2024: 09:01:14
quote:
Originally posted by Phil - MO
Somebody should mention that the statement "not a current rep of Goldtone" is not correct since he stated being a rep, of OME and wearing an OME cap. I read somewhere that Goldtone recently purchased OME?
Might be a conflict of interest?
He acknowledges that and says outright he doesn't receive anything for talking about the Gold Tone brand. "Gold Tone" is the name of the company and some of its lines of instruments. But not all of Gold Tone's instruments are branded "Gold Tone."
The point of the review speaks for itself. The Epiphone neck buzzes and frets out all over the place. It came from the factory shimmed -- badly -- at both heel connection points and the neck still doesn't play. A magnet sticks to the tone ring, proving it's steel or something else that's not brass. Epiphone's product description doesn't say what the tone ring is made of. Now we know why.
His affiliation with Gold Tone has nothing to do with the obvious defects of the Epiphone banjo.
banjoez - Posted - 08/31/2024: 16:07:03
So all the folks who complained about GT using the "Mastertone" name can now see what great work Gibson can do with it. A "genuine" P.O.S. The original ESS's were so-so banjos but this is a travesty in comparison. Earl on the truss rod cover? Oh my.
Edited by - banjoez on 08/31/2024 16:17:12
andyctas - Posted - 08/31/2024: 18:42:17
That really is terrible, feel sorry for people who bought Epiphone Scruggs model banjo, (the GT OB150RF is excellent ) a bit like the tuners on their 50's repo J45.......pants !!
andyctas - Posted - 08/31/2024: 20:31:53
quote:
Originally posted by andyctas
That really is terrible, feel sorry for people who bought Epiphone Scruggs model banjo, (the GT OB150RF is excellent ) a bit like the tuners on their Epiphone IBG 50's repro J45.......pants !!
banjonz - Posted - 09/03/2024: 15:16:44
This is not the first Asian made bluegrass banjo to have a steel tone ring. The reissued Ibanez B600's have one. I purchased on with was very dirty and was missing a reso. After string it down, I found there was not only a 3-4mm slop fit between the rim and the ring, but the ring was steel. Looked good on the outside by inside was rough as guts.
Bradskey - Posted - 09/03/2024: 18:57:42
You can say Gibson should know better or how to build a banjo and do it right, although I doubt they have any such expertise in-house any longer. But what this really amounts to is Gibson ordering an import model banjo of a certain grade with a certain cosmetic design from a generic Asian factory. They didn't "design" this beyond cosmetics and they didn't involve knowledgeable American banjo luthiers or provide very detail specs I'm guessing. This banjo is almost no different from the $500 Asian Fender I bought 20 years ago, or any number of Washburns, Morgan Monroes and assorted other generic import models since (although many of those used to have pot metal rings). The deep pot, the chintzy-looking gold, the nut, the neck shape, it all matches, nevermind the questionable tolerances and assembly. Even the orientation of the head screaming generic Asian model. Seriously it has Earl's name on it but you have to bother correcting the head orientation so people don't mistake this product for a "Remo"? Better Asian brands solved for some of these things years ago, although early Recording Kings had similarly narrow necks as I recall. If this was better assembled it might be okay-ish, except for the price it's atrocious. Yeah everything is up, but it wasn't that long ago you could get something far far better for that kind of money.
But it is interesting that Gibson has at least retained the right to use and display their own historic brand, Mastertone. Not that I like seeing it on an Epiphone much better than Gold Tone, and on relative terms a Gold Tone deserves it more than this thing does. Gold Tone has gone to town marketing a whole line of Mastertone strings now, I'll probably try some.
MatthewH - Posted - 09/04/2024: 05:43:13
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
The original ESS's were so-so banjos but this is a travesty in comparison.
You talking about the whole run of ESS's? Or just that brief pre-Rich era?
banjoez - Posted - 09/04/2024: 13:26:10
quote:
Originally posted by MatthewH
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
The original ESS's were so-so banjos but this is a travesty in comparison.
You talking about the whole run of ESS's? Or just that brief pre-Rich era?
The whole run. I'm not just picking on the Scruggs models either. The Gibson reissues in general were a nice attempt at trying to duplicate the prewar banjos and they did do a great job in the looks department but none of them seemed to capture the essence of the prewars tonally. I'm not convinced that the Kulesh rings were the right choice to go with. They always seemed kinda one dimensional and a bit brassy and tight to me across the board. Not much depth IMHO. I think there were better rings they could've used instead.
Edited by - banjoez on 09/04/2024 13:38:03
Old Hickory - Posted - 09/04/2024: 14:23:03
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
The Gibson reissues in general were a nice attempt at trying to duplicate the prewar banjos and they did do a great job in the looks department but none of them seemed to capture the essence of the prewars tonally. I'm not convinced that the Kulesh rings were the right choice to go with. They always seemed kinda one dimensional and a bit brassy and tight to me across the board. Not much depth IMHO. I think there were better rings they could've used instead.
That doesn't describe my experience at all.
I've heard several Rich Era and later Gibsons, including a Granada, RB-4 and I forget what other models, and to my ear they were always the best sounding banjos at the jams where they were played -- even when not in the hands of the best players those nights.
I played an RB-3 and RB-250, from around 2000, and also thought they were fine sounding.
Old Hickory - Posted - 09/04/2024: 14:34:49
quote:
Originally posted by Bradskey
But it is interesting that Gibson has at least retained the right to use and display their own historic brand, Mastertone.
I believe we don't actually know from anything that's been made public whether Gibson retained, or obtained in any way, the right to use that name. All we know is they're using it.
If anything is possible, then I suppose it's possible Gold Tone granted Gibson some use of the name in exchange for withdrawing their challenge to Gold Tone's registration. That doesn't strike me as likely, but it's possible.
It's also possible Gibson's use of Mastertone is intentionally provocative, as in: "Look at this. What are you gonna do about it?"
banjoez - Posted - 09/04/2024: 14:47:20
My understanding is that neither Gibson nor GT actually owns the Mastertone name. Some violin maker does (please correct me if I'm wrong).
Edited by - banjoez on 09/04/2024 14:48:10
andyctas - Posted - 09/04/2024: 17:12:29
Well we're moving away from discussing the poor construction & materials used on the Epiphone Earl Scruggs Model Banjo but maybe Gold Tone agreed to Gibson using the Mastertone logo, maybe $'s changed hands ! The GT Grandee looks the business.
Re. ESS.The ESS I had was 1990's & very quiet compared to a friend's very early ESS with the copy of Earl's banjo at the time with a smaller headstock.Very plain maple neck, not setup just bolted together....poor.
An RB-4 early 2000's again just bolted together...that & a friend's Flint Hill Special Tone Ring weights varied, 3 Lbs & 3.5 Lbs, now there's quality control for you !
Best has been the Gold Tone OB150RF apart from the engraved armrest changed to plain & Terminator tailpiece changed to caste Presto from Brown Dog Banjos...
NotABanjoYoda - Posted - 09/04/2024: 19:45:03
\sarcasm
For some reason Im thinking if the peghead said "Gibson" instead of "Epiphone" there would be some positive reviews and those things would be backordered. Then an employee would quit, say "Ted Poor"and we would forever put a premium on the TP Era Gibsons that recaptured the GRE magic.
/sarcasm
Old Hickory - Posted - 09/04/2024: 20:46:41
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
My understanding is that neither Gibson nor GT actually owns the Mastertone name. Some violin maker does (please correct me if I'm wrong).
You're wrong. 
Yes, Potter Violin Company, not far from me in Silver Spring, Maryland, received registration for a trademark on Mastertone specifically for violas in 2006
Gold Tone received its registration on Mastertone in 2021, specifically "for musical stringed instruments, namely, banjos, guitars, mandolins, and ukuleles."
I believe it was even reported after Gold Tone's filing the previous year that Gold Tone and Potter had come to some agreement that allowed Gold Tone's application to proceed. I'm a layperson, but it appears to me the agreement is Gold Tone won't make violin family instruments and Potter won't make banjos, guitars, mandolins, and ukes.
coalcracker2 - Posted - 09/06/2024: 05:40:55
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
So all the folks who complained about GT using the "Mastertone" name can now see what great work Gibson can do with it. A "genuine" P.O.S. The original ESS's were so-so banjos but this is a travesty in comparison. Earl on the truss rod cover? Oh my.
Original ESSs "SO-SO" ???
I'd seriously rethink that one for sure ... !!!
banjoez - Posted - 09/06/2024: 06:04:32
quote:
Originally posted by coalcracker2
quote:
Originally posted by banjoez
So all the folks who complained about GT using the "Mastertone" name can now see what great work Gibson can do with it. A "genuine" P.O.S. The original ESS's were so-so banjos but this is a travesty in comparison. Earl on the truss rod cover? Oh my.
Original ESSs "SO-SO" ???
I'd seriously rethink that one for sure ... !!!
I've had half a dozen ESS's through the years along with multiple reissue Granadas, RB4's, RB3's, RB75's, Crowes and some I probably forgot including Rich eras looking for "the one" and can't say I ever found it. Good banjos but not great. There are simply better sounding banjos available and some for much less money. To me it's all about tone.
The new Epiphone appears to be another attempt by Gibson to capitalize on their glory days with less than stellar results.
Edited by - banjoez on 09/06/2024 06:15:21
Brett - Posted - 09/06/2024: 06:27:22
It’s hit or miss with the entire Epiphone import line. Some are phenomenal bargains in electrics and acoustics. But, their banjos and mandolins “lack”.
Their masterbilt acoustic guitars are fantastic bargains.
jlsorbit - Posted - 09/27/2024: 13:25:54
Thanks for your well thought out and detailed review. It's a shame that people will pay their hard-earned money for such low-quality for a name plate and appearance.
