Bill Rogers - Posted - 09/29/2023:  13:42:51

I was greatly surprised to find that this interesting tune has never been a totw. So.....

My source, and pretty much the only American source, it seems, is the late Art Rosenbaum, artist, professor, folklorist and banjo picker. He recorded it on Kicking Mule back in 1975 and I quote from his liner notes: "I adapted this arrangement from Jim Lucas' banjo setting of a rare fiddle tune. The approach here is not a strictly traditional one, as it is uncommon in folk practice to drop the thumb to the 3rd & 4th strings to produce melody notes." So Rosenbaum's arrangement is the basis for what we have of an American version of "Cottage in the Grove." Tuning is sawmill, in A. (aEADE) capoed or tuned up.



As far as the internet goes, the tune is indeed rare. The only two versions I could find were from Rosenbaum's recording and tab. One is here:

Bernard Cornelis:youtube.com/watch?v=YcGM6V-QSDY



But there are several Irish tunes called "Cottage in the Grove" or "Tommy Coen's" that appear to be precursors of the Rosenbaum version. Different rhythms and somewhat different melodies, but they seem ancestral to me.



Irish, tenor banjo: youtube.com/watch?v=m3Oqnt2sWb0

Irish, flute:youtube.com/watch?v=Z7Fkn-5MVnE

I also found this deep in the Hangout pages. I read neither music nor tab, but I assume the is relevant:

Music & tab: google.com/url?q=https://www.hangoutstorage.com/banjohangout.org/storage/tabs/c/tab-cottage-in-the--26106-016132532023.pdf&source=gmail&ust=1696105190908000&usg=AOvVaw1mUYejjV-oQ3PoraVRK0sg" href="https://www.hangoutstorage.com/banjohangout.org/storage/tabs/c/tab-cottage-in-the--26106-016132532023.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.hangoutstorage.com/banjohangout.org/storage/tabs/c/tab-cottage-in-the--26106-016132532023.pdf

Not a lot to go on that I found, including any posting of Rosenbaum's recording. Maybe some other members will have better luck.

Edited by - Bill Rogers on 09/29/2023 13:50:08

RG - Posted - 09/29/2023:  22:44:16

Great tune Bill! My dad distributed Kicking Mule records for Ed Denson in the 70's. I have this LP, I'll see if I can get a digitized version to post here. First met Art in the late 70's, he and Eddie Lowe were a major influence in me switching from Scruggs style BG to OT, great memories...

Bill Rogers - Posted - 09/29/2023:  22:51:43

Thanks R G. It’s going to take folks like you to fill this one out.

carlb - Posted - 09/30/2023:  05:58:47

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bill Rogers

"...............I adapted this arrangement from Jim Lucas' banjo setting of a rare fiddle tune. The approach here is not a strictly traditional one, as it is uncommon in folk practice to drop the thumb to the 3rd & 4th strings to produce melody notes." So Rosenbaum's arrangement is the basis for what we have of an American version of "Cottage in the Grove." Tuning is sawmill, in A. (aEADE) capoed or tuned up.

---

I do that all the time since I started playing banjo in 1973. Never heard that is was "uncommon" to do.

JanetB - Posted - 09/30/2023:  11:28:45

Nice tune title. Learning Cottage in the Grove been quite the challenge, Bill.  Not knowing what Art played nor finding his tab, at first, I listened to the other links you provided, liking the mandolin version best.  I couldn't get a consistent melody from it and kept exploring.  There's a site called Flute Tunes with an mp3 and notation that helped me arrange a tab.  Then I found Art's tab in one of the BHO links you provided. The clawhammer tab above Art's tab has a 1927 Irish tunes source.  There are a few measures I'd play differently, but the melody is very similar to what is in Art's tab, and is also similar to the flute version.

The Traditional Tune Archive has some information including alternate titles. The first notation of many in this link, which appears to be much like what I'm playing, is dated from a 19th century source.

In my mp3 I play through my arrangement twice and then play from Art's tab so you can hear them together.

Thanks for this contribution, Bill!

Edited by - JanetB on 09/30/2023 11:34:26

Cottage in the Grove

Cottage in the Grove (CH) tab

RG - Posted - 09/30/2023:  16:31:46

quote:

---

Originally posted by JanetB

Nice tune title. Learning Cottage in the Grove been quite the challenge, Bill.  Not knowing what Art played nor finding his tab, at first, I listened to the other links you provided, liking the mandolin version best.  I couldn't get a consistent melody from it and kept exploring.  There's a site called Flute Tunes with an mp3 and notation that helped me arrange a tab.  Then I found Art's tab in one of the BHO links you provided. The clawhammer tab above Art's tab has a 1927 Irish tunes source.  There are a few measures I'd play differently, but the melody is very similar to what is in Art's tab, and is also similar to the flute version.

The Traditional Tune Archive has some information including alternate titles. The first notation of many in this link, which appears to be much like what I'm playing, is dated from a 19th century source.

In my mp3 I play through my arrangement twice and then play from Art's tab so you can hear them together.

Thanks for this contribution, Bill!

---

Janet this is really close to what I hear on the LP (still trying to figure out how to digitize it), I don't think Art goes to the 7th fret on the first string, he stays on the 5th, otherwise you have it pretty much down... the motif repeats in the fine and coarse parts, it's actually a simple little tune that's not that simple to play-haha! I might try to work up a version if I get a free minute this weekend...

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 10/04/2023:  21:54:52

I've got the Rosenbaum LP.

It was listening to stuff like The Cottage in the Grove

that embarked me on a decade-long Irish fiddle odyssey.

Day 121 - The Cottage Grove - Fergal's Tune a day 2019 - YouTube

De Danann - The Cottage in the Grove , Sean Ryans Reel - YouTube

Seems like a different tune than the one on Art's album.

Edited by - R.D. Lunceford on 10/04/2023 21:59:31

Bill Rogers - Posted - 10/05/2023:  01:00:30

I agree, R.D. I do think the Irish tune (and versions differ there) is ancestral. I also think Rosenbaum’s “Cottage” is unique to him, as his album liner notes suggest.

R.D. Lunceford

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 10/06/2023:  13:08:42

Agee Bill.  Both great tunes, but if I had to choose, I prefer Art's piece.  Thanks for posting it.

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 10/06/2023:  13:21:52

quote:

---

Originally posted by carlb

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bill Rogers

"...............I adapted this arrangement from Jim Lucas' banjo setting of a rare fiddle tune. The approach here is not a strictly traditional one, as it is uncommon in folk practice to drop the thumb to the 3rd & 4th strings to produce melody notes." So Rosenbaum's arrangement is the basis for what we have of an American version of "Cottage in the Grove." Tuning is sawmill, in A. (aEADE) capoed or tuned up.

---

I do that all the time since I started playing banjo in 1973. Never heard that is was "uncommon" to do.

---

Me too.  I seem to remember that some of the older players in Missouri were said to have drop-thumbed on 2, 3, and 4 strings - my Dad did, and Mel Durham said that it was also common in So. Illinois.  

My Art Rosenbaum LP has been in the attic for many years now, but he spoke of something called "the Face of the Mountain style", and I think it may have been in reference to his playing on Cottage in the Grove, but memory may fail.

---

Edited by - R.D. Lunceford on 10/06/2023 13:24:20

Noah Cline - Posted - 10/06/2023:  18:09:57

Way down a thread on The Session regarding the Tommy Coen's/Cottage in the Grove version of this tune, I remember reading that Tommy apparently composed this tune (typically played in E Dorian), and according to his wife, he composed a handful of tunes, but didn't like naming them, and the names I guess got attached as they passed through sessions.

Art's Cottage definitely sounds Irish to me.  I keep listening to it and the other version and too seem to hear a little similarity, mainly in the basic chord structure going from the root to the 5th, and so on, and the last few measures repeated in both A and B parts. 

Edited by - Noah Cline on 10/06/2023 18:13:21

Bill Rogers - Posted - 10/06/2023:  19:22:33

I ran across some skepticism that Coen actually made the Irish tune, though he certainly put his stamp on it. Allegedly, versions were extant before his active time as a player.

Edited by - Bill Rogers on 10/06/2023 19:24:08