campandstrum - Posted - 05/15/2023:  20:52:25

What does the ideal clawhammer banjo sound like?

Please post sound clips or video.

Paul R - Posted - 05/15/2023:  23:20:33

What's a clawhammer banjo?

There's too much variety to pick one "sound". For example, while the open-back is stereotyped as the default clawhammer banjo, lots of pickers use resonator banjos. And that's just the start. Head material, string type, tailpieces, rim thickness, tone rings - all have their adherents. Personal choice is fine, but there's not one "ideal clawhammer banjo" sound - not even for me.

campandstrum - Posted - 05/16/2023:  00:05:13

quote:

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Originally posted by campandstrum

In your opinion, what do you think the ideal clawhammer banjo sounds like?



Please post sound clips or video.

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banjoak - Posted - 05/16/2023:  01:51:54

Pretty much like any other instrument, depends on the the type of music, and what other instruments, how fits in mix.

Why different banjos are made.

Many folks own different banjos for that reason.

Edited by - banjoak on 05/16/2023 01:54:21

Bill Rogers - Posted - 05/16/2023:  02:09:06

It varies according to players’ tastes. You can set up a banjo for differing sounds, too.
And as Paul noted above, you can play clawhammer on most any banjo. I don’t trust recordings. Too easy to do poorly and too easy to manipulate. I prefer the sound of the scalloped “electric-style” tone ring, but I have several different types of tone rings, and a couple with none. K

Alvin Conder - Posted - 05/16/2023:  04:21:32

With Old Time- whatever sounds good to you.

Eric A - Posted - 05/16/2023:  04:37:25

If you have recordings or festival experiences that you like, then that's what it should sound like, for you. Objectively, there is no standard. No one can say "clawhammer should sound just like so-and-so on the XYZ recording".

So different from bluegrass, where there is a flock all worshiping at the same church.

If you like it...it is good. Marketing people hate people like that. They would much prefer you are a slave to a certain sound and look. That's the only way they can get you to overpay for things.

KCJones - Posted - 05/16/2023:  05:51:57

quote:

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Originally posted by Paul R

What's a clawhammer banjo?

 

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Obviously, it's a '60s Gibson Mastertone Archtop:

Clarence Ashley performs "The Cuckoo" - YouTube

campandstrum - Posted - 05/16/2023:  09:14:08

I really like the sound of Abagail Washburn's banjo in this video:

youtube.com/watch?v=5rDrPBzJo5o

banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/16/2023:  09:31:04

Well I was going to post a clip of Adam Hurt playing something that sounded great, but on three different clips he somehow managed to sound great on three very different sounding banjos. So just search for Adam Hurt Banjo and hear good sounding clawhammer banjos of every variety. But it just might be the player!

janolov - Posted - 05/16/2023:  11:23:57

My neighbor would probably say that the ideal clawhammer banjo is a silent banjo.......

campandstrum - Posted - 05/16/2023:  19:29:48

Banjo Bill-E.

Adam Hurt is so good, he makes any banjo sound good. Certainly the player is a big factor.
youtube.com/watch?v=woBwgIjyUEo

tbchappe - Posted - 06/22/2023:  10:56:54

quote:

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Originally posted by campandstrum

What does the ideal clawhammer banjo sound like?



Please post sound clips or video.

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It's all about setup, and less to do with brand or tone-ring. I have several banjos with which I down-pick ("clawhammer"). I've had compliments from many about my setups and tone from banjos. I've also had a couple of complaints from "old-time" "clawhammer" players expressing that my banjo is, "too loud for clawhammer."

Those poor saps.

Blaine

Helix - Posted - 06/22/2023:  15:44:49

It ain't the banjo, it's the boy.

OldPappy - Posted - 07/11/2023:  19:25:26

In my humble opinion, it sounds like the last banjo I built for Dwight Diller which he played in his last public performance. He said this banjo was the ideal banjo for his style of playing, and Diller knew what he was talking about, because he was Dwight Diller.

And like Larry says, "It aint the banjo, it's the boy".

 google.com/search?q=Dwight+Dil...lVuQkzqLs

Edited by - OldPappy on 07/11/2023 19:33:18

Helix - Posted - 07/12/2023:  17:33:31

four flat tires on a muddy road.

Bill Rogers - Posted - 07/12/2023:  19:33:05

Note that Diller (properly) did not say the banjo was perfect for anyone, With traditional playing styles, sound preference should be with the player. “I don’t like that sound” Is very different in tone and effect that “that sound is truly wretched.”

Noah Cline - Posted - 07/14/2023:  21:06:45

It's partly the player and partly the instrument; the rest is subjective. 

However, this combo (Ray Chatfield with a Vega __(?)) is a good candidate (sweet, crisp, and warm, to me):

youtu.be/fdROoZaKyko

youtu.be/8fGg2gUgkT0

Personally, I'd put myself in the Whyte Laydie camp, as that's what my main player has (well, a copy of) for a tone ring. It's what I've grown accustomed to sound-wise, playing it all these years. 

Bill Rogers - Posted - 07/14/2023:  21:35:19

The first link is my banjo. A Clifford Essex Concert Grand, probably mid-1920s. The date on the site is wrong, but never corrected. The banjo is still pretty much the same as shown; now has a Renaissance head; same 1920s all-maple 1/2" Bacon bridge. My string set is .0115 x 2; .013, .015, .023 or .024  bronze-wound.   I do keep the head pretty tight. The second link is a decent recording of what it sounds like, For my taste, it's excellent, and in 54 years I"ve never found a banjo I like better.The fiddler is the late Dick Arnold of Stockton, CA.

frets.com/FretsPages/Museum/Ba...excg.html

banjohangout.org/myhangout/med...archived=

Obviously, many prefer a different clawhammer sound. I would note that you can set a banjo like mine up to be "plunky," but it's difficult at best to set up, for instance, a 12" wood-rim banjo to have the snap and "Whyte Laydie pop" you get with that style scalloped tone ring.

Edited by - Bill Rogers on 07/14/2023 21:59:17

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 07/17/2023:  10:48:51

Far too much variation to answer the question.

If you have a favorite player then find out about the banjo he's playing and go for that.

Keep in mind that set-up is key.

OldPappy - Posted - 07/17/2023:  21:28:20

quote:

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Originally posted by Bill Rogers

Note that Diller (properly) did not say the banjo was perfect for anyone, With traditional playing styles, sound preference should be with the player. “I don’t like that sound” Is very different in tone and effect that “that sound is truly wretched.”

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I totally agree with that. While that banjo suited Dwight, it was so responsive, and sensitive I could not play it because I have too heavy a hand.

I doubt many players would have liked that particular banjo, because it sounded harsh when played too heavy, but Dwight had incredible control, and in his later years he played with a very light touch which differed from how he played when I first met him.

This is what I meant when I qouted Larry's comment about it not being the banjo but the boy.

When I started building banjos for him he liked medium heavy strings, and in his later years he wanted light gauge strings.

That banjo started out with the suspended tone ring I made for years which is a hoop resting on a scalloped truss, similar to the WL tone ring but without a skirt. Dwight took it apart and sandwiched a Dobson style tone ring between the truss and the hoop. I suspect his hearing was going, and he just kept trying to get more, and more out of a banjo. 

Edited by - OldPappy on 07/17/2023 21:34:01

Bill Rogers - Posted - 07/18/2023:  00:57:58

quote:

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Originally posted by OldPappy

quote:

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Originally posted by Bill Rogers

Note that Diller (properly) did not say the banjo was perfect for anyone, With traditional playing styles, sound preference should be with the player. “I don’t like that sound” Is very different in tone and effect that “that sound is truly wretched.”

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I totally agree with that. While that banjo suited Dwight, it was so responsive, and sensitive I could not play it because I have too heavy a hand.

I doubt many players would have liked that particular banjo, because it sounded harsh when played too heavy, but Dwight had incredible control, and in his later years he played with a very light touch which differed from how he played when I first met him.

This is what I meant when I qouted Larry's comment about it not being the banjo but the boy.

When I started building banjos for him he liked medium heavy strings, and in his later years he wanted light gauge strings.

That banjo started out with the suspended tone ring I made for years which is a hoop resting on a scalloped truss, similar to the WL tone ring but without a skirt. Dwight took it apart and sandwiched a Dobson style tone ring between the truss and the hoop. I suspect his hearing was going, and he just kept trying to get more, and more out of a banjo. 

 

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What Dwight did was not unlike Bart Reiter's "Bacophone Plus".

@OldPappy

OldPappy - Posted - 07/18/2023:  07:28:50

quote:

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Originally posted by R.D. Lunceford

 If you have a favorite player then find out about the banjo he's playing and go for that.

I remember a while back when a lot of players were looking for an old Harmony "Resotone" so they could sound like Lee Hammons, but as you once said R.D. "It aint the bow, but the archer".

Nobody I ever heard could make a "Resotone" sound like Lee Hammons could.

youtube.com/watch?v=ngUtmDtB3Zc

We plan on camping next to the Hammons at Clifftop. Trampus said he would save us a spot if he gets there before we do, and if we get there first we will do same for them. Trevor is one of the best young banjo players I have heard in a long time, and he is taking up fiddle too. Listen close to him and you can hear something was passed down from his great grandfather.

Edited by - OldPappy on 07/18/2023 07:33:14

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 07/18/2023:  15:41:05

OldPappy

I agree, but getting the same kind of banjo was the closest I could come to any kind of advice when there may not really be any.

I'd like to hear Trevor, but when I click on the link you gave it brings me back to this thread.

OldPappy - Posted - 07/18/2023:  17:48:27

That is odd, don't know why it did that, but the link wasn't of Trevor playing it was his great grandfather Lee Hammons.



I'll try again.

Lee Hammons Walking in The Parlor

 

Edited by - OldPappy on 07/18/2023 17:50:57

OldPappy - Posted - 07/18/2023:  17:50:34

Here is one of Trevor playing at the Marlinton Opera House "Story Sessions".

youtube.com/watch?v=vQOZj5bZJn4

 

R.D. Lunceford - Posted - 07/19/2023:  16:43:17

Good videos, both.  Love Lee Hammons' playing.  Thanks Pappy!

campandstrum - Posted - 07/20/2023:  00:07:38

I am really enjoying all of the videos posted.

b4idie - Posted - 07/20/2023:  05:58:43

thanks for the video links ........ I too am really enjoying