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Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/331086
JanetB - Posted - 05/26/2017: 08:30:26
Here’s a fiddle tune played by so many in the old-time world, but – in my mind – requiring a special dedication to “catch.” I first paid attention to Old Sledge when the Macrae Sisters of Portland, Oregon performed it, surprised at how the fiddle and banjo synchronized so well in this close musical family. They traced their version to Ernie Carpenter who in turn learned it from Lewis Johnson “Jack” McElwain, both from West Virginia.
Jack McElwain
I looked for other Old Sledge recordings. Next was a version by West Virginian fiddler Melvin Wine, plus a story of meeting Jack McElwain as a teenager. Another West Virginian, Burl Hammons, recorded yet a different version, learned from his uncle, Edden Hammons. I found Ed Haley’s energetic recording and learned that when Haley visited with Jack McElwain they would “trade tunes.” Emory Bailey is another noted fiddler of Old Sledge and is a source for the B part of the Fuzzy Mountain String Band’s recording. Tom Dillon and Harvey Sampson are yet other West Virginia fiddlers who played the tune. Old Sledge obviously has had many variations, not uncommon for very old tunes, and sometimes has three parts instead of two.
Back to their source: “Uncle Jack” McElwain was born in 1856 and lived in one community all his life on the White Oak tributary of Laurel Creek near Erbacon in Webster County, West Virginia. His passing in 1938 just missed the era of historic West Virginia recordings of Louis Watson Chappell in 1939 and there are no known recordings of Uncle Jack. Those who knew him claimed he was the very best fiddler around and Old Sledge was his best tune.
Melvin Wine tells of meeting Jack when Melvin was a teenager and was offered a $20 gold coin by Jack if he would just enter a fiddling contest. Jack was familiar with Melvin’s father, Robert Wine, and complimented his fiddling. Unfortunately, Melvin didn’t enter the contest, but he was so impressed with Jack’s fiddling that he visited him many years later to listen and learn. For more information see: wvencyclopedia.org/articles/1634 and muse.jhu.edu/chapter/1503950.
In a 1988 interview of Ernie Carpenter by BHO member Brendan Doyle, Carpenter said Uncle Jack was the greatest fiddler he ever heard. Considering the Carpenters were a prominent fiddling family themselves, his comment speaks loudly.
Jack McElwain took one of his many “fiddlin’ trips” to the 1893 World’s Fair in Chicago when he was 37 years old, where he entered and won their fiddle contest playing Old Sledge. One fiddler named Harry Scott from the same community of Erbacon as Jack, is quoted by Gerald Milnes as saying “when Uncle Jack played Old Sledge you seemed to rise three feet up off the ground.” It was a winning tune for Jack McElwain in many fiddling contests and Melvin Wine tells how it beat out his own father playing Arkansas Traveler.
The term “old sledge” can refer to a colonial card game (also called High Fours, 7-Up, or High-Low-Jack), a fiddler, sled, sleigh, mule, or dog. It’s the oldest extant card game in England and is still played today. Here’s how to play: pagat.com/allfours/allfours.html. I got through half the directions and gave up! The fact is we’ll probably never know what Uncle Jack was referring to when he played the tune.
Old Sledge reminds me of Bonaparte’s Retreat as played by William Stepp – full of movement and energy. Linking it to Bonaparte’s Retreat was coincidentally mentioned in this Fiddle Hangout discussion in 2009 of Old Sledge: fiddlehangout.com/archive/7895.
Listen to the phenomenal Macrae Sisters: youtube.com/watch?v=YEzSKegQ9xg
BHO member Chris Yohn learned from them: banjohangout.org/song/38722
Here are other recordings to check out:
Burl Hammons: slippery-hill.com/recording/old-sledge
Melvin Wine: slippery-hill.com/recording/old-sledge-0
Ed Haley (a bit hard to hear and very rapid): youtube.com/watch?v=PAxxM1IUBcI
Cliffhangers (with BHO member Brendan Doyles): allmusic.com/song/old-sledge-mt0015955040
Dan Gellert (he plays all six parts of the Ed Haley version -- a good learning source here): youtube.com/watch?v=A3D-tS7dHYg
Bob Carlin with Judy Hyman and Jeff Claus (Melvin Wine version): youtube.com/watch?v=3nKWvx3OFzk
Fuzzy Mountain String Band playing from Burl Hammons and Emory Bailey (B part): smile.amazon.com/dp/B0010VWM0O..._tlw_trk3
Kay Van (Burl Hammons version): youtube.com/watch?v=WlTApDK8rz4
Ralph Roberts (playing a tune he calls Old Sledge or Seven Up): youtube.com/watch?v=nkzaHK8zfpM
I’m thankful to BHO members Carl Baron and Brendan Doyle who shared their files and their experiences with Melvin Wine and Ernie Carpenter, respectively, whose music we gratefully still play. I hope Carl and Brendan will share some of those good memories and music.
My first recording combines the Melvin Wine and Ernie Carpenter versions in double C tuning. The second recording of the Burl Hammons version is in double C with a lowered 5th string (fCGCD) -- I liked the effect. It's the easier of the three to play.
Edited by - JanetB on 05/27/2017 19:32:27
Brooklynbanjoboy - Posted - 05/26/2017: 08:49:52
Great post. Great tune.
Here's John Hartford doing a version - I believe an Ed Haley derived inspiration:
youtube.com/watch?time_continu...y6QfMZMec
Edited by - Brooklynbanjoboy on 05/26/2017 08:50:35
atleson - Posted - 05/26/2017: 14:20:38
great work, Janet. I like this tune, but i often forget it since i don't hear it played very often. I've heard both Melvin Wine and Ernie Carpenter play this tune---too long ago---and i like both versions.
RG - Posted - 05/26/2017: 17:22:28
Oh wow Janet, such a great choice!!!! And as always, cool write-up!
Edited by - RG on 05/26/2017 17:23:10
carlb - Posted - 05/27/2017: 10:48:59
Good job Janet. Melvin, almost always, played Old Sledge as a solo, even though I did learn his version on the banjo and fiddle.
I recorded this clawhammer version on a fretless banjo in 2000 and supplied the following information for my CD "Banjo Stuff":
OLD SLEDGE - aDADE (tuned low to about B); Burl Hammons & Emory Bailey (via Bill Hicks on the first Fuzzy Mountain String Band record).
stevel - Posted - 05/27/2017: 12:18:58
I tried working on a version based on the Ed Haley notation but didn't get very far.
home.hiwaay.net/~eabaggot/EdHa...ledge.htm
This fine gentleman stopped by our local jam a few weeks ago.
Edited by - stevel on 05/27/2017 12:23:28
mojo_monk - Posted - 05/27/2017: 13:57:30
quote:
Originally posted by stevelI tried working on a version based on the Ed Haley notation but didn't get very far.
home.hiwaay.net/~eabaggot/EdHa...ledge.htm
This fine gentleman stopped by our local jam a few weeks ago.
JanetB - Posted - 05/27/2017: 18:11:54
The response so far confirms what I feel about the tune -- hearing it is memorable, the melody is hard to pinpoint, and there's much variety.
I'm working on tabbing out Ed Haley's second time through (he plays it three times). I'm reminded of the complexity that Bill Monroe demonstrated on mandolin. He could take a phrase and express it in multiple ways, changing rhythmic accents and note sequence, which, though not necessarily implying much melody, made for an interesting listen. I'll keep working on Haley's version and (half-way through) have actually found some enchanting melodic moments.
Nikos Pappas is indeed great. He seems able to take Ed Haley's piece and give it the life it deserves as a complete concerto with perhaps six parts. It's interesting that Gerry Milnes, winner of the Vandalia Award and a West Virginia folklorist, filmmaker, fiddler and author of books such as of Play of a Fiddle: Traditional Music, Dance, and Folklore in West Virginia, thought that Ed Haley's version wasn't "notable." Nikos turns that statement around!
In the same book Gerry Milnes tells a cute story about Jack McElwain. On page 24 he writes, "Many remember that McElwain, on being told what a fine fiddler he was, would reply in his whiney voice, 'It ain't me, it's my feedle.'"
John Hartford also did a fine job of portraying Haley's rendition. Thanks for finding it, Lew. Imagine internalizing that whole tune -- when I look at the notation Steve included in his post above I feel discouragement and dismay. It was good to watch Mike Compton as he accompanied Hartford on mandolin with a simple chordal back-up (at least he makes it sound simple, but I know it's really not). A master of Monroe style, I'd sure like to see Mike take a solo crack at Old Sledge...
I'm grateful you shared your recording, Carl, and the fact that Melvin Wine played his Old Sledge solo.
All in all, there seems to be a lifetime of study embedded in getting to know this TOTW.
JanetB - Posted - 05/28/2017: 15:00:26
Here's my Ed Haley clawhammer version. There's at least four parts I could distinguish. My tempo is 65% of the speed Haley and others recorded it. When studying Ed Haley I've had to get used to variations upon variations. It's just amazing how folks like John Hartford, Dan Gellert, and Nikos Pappas memorized this piece and could perform it!
If you want to know more about Ed Haley through John Hartford and Brandon Lee Kirk's in depth exploration, check out: brandonraykirk.wordpress.com/2...nding-46/. Just type in a subject in the search box, like Old Sledge, and you'll find their entries.
mojo_monk - Posted - 05/28/2017: 19:18:46
quote:
Originally posted by JanetBHere's my Ed Haley clawhammer version. There's at least four parts I could distinguish. My tempo is 65% of the speed Haley and others recorded it. When studying Ed Haley I've had to get used to variations upon variations. It's just amazing how folks like John Hartford, Dan Gellert, and Nikos Pappas memorized this piece and could perform it!
If you want to know more about Ed Haley through John Hartford and Brandon Lee Kirk's in depth exploration, check out: brandonraykirk.wordpress.com/2...nding-46/. Just type in a subject in the search box, like Old Sledge, and you'll find their entries.