orbiteleven - Posted - 03/21/2016:  07:51:36

Looking for a louder (or more present in group settings) 11" than my Deering Tubaphone. Leaning towards a Bart Reiter. Anyone know which tone system has the most "cut" and volume? This would pair with my 12" Ome and be used for both old-time and "claw-grass" in group/stage settings?

Without this devolving into a "my banjo is better", any other recommendations?

jbalch - Posted - 03/21/2016:  08:15:01

Damon:

A Whyte Laydie is a classic string band instrument because it can have plenty of clarity & volume, but not too much sustain.  That gives it good note separation while retaining plenty of brightness and ring.   I think the WL sound mixes very well with other instruments in a band.

The Bacphone model has a warmer, more-woody, sound with subtle sustain (more Dobson-like).  I think the volume might be less than a Whyte Laydie or tubaphone. I like these banjos for solo play or maybe in a duet with a fiddle or mandolin.

I doubt either model will be louder than your Deering.  A tubaphone ring can be very loud  - with especially long ringing sustain.  That sustain may may make the tubaphone less distinct in the mix with other instruments.  So ... I said above, the punchy sound of a WL may mix better with other instruments. You might feel that it "cuts" more effectively.

You can't go wrong with Bart Reiter banjos. 

Best Wishes.

Joven - Posted - 03/21/2016:  08:52:41

or just get a pickup for either banjo

I would say you have very good quality instruments there

Ivan

orbiteleven - Posted - 03/21/2016:  09:02:27

To clarify: I'm looking for a banjo that can work for both stage and louder "pickin' circle" settings

banjered - Posted - 03/21/2016:  09:05:10

Agree with jbalch, spot on. It is kind of hard to think a tubaphone isn't loud enough. Just about any head on a tubaphone set to the maximum volume should do the trick. Tubaphones are great instruments but set up is as crucial with them as any other banjo. I've heard wonderful and terrible sounding tubaphones and whyte laydies. Banjered

orbiteleven - Posted - 03/21/2016:  09:16:11

My problem with the Deering tubaphone is that with all that sustain, the sound just gets lost. I've played with various heads (fyberskin and now an elite opaque) and various amounts of "dish rag" (or sock, hat, etc), but I still find the sound can't get on top of even a smaller circle.

I've played with a few folks with Bart Reiters and they (the banjos, not just the people ;) ) have always sounded louder. Must be some magic in the wood.

Thanks, @jbalch, for the summary. I'm tempted to go with the bacophone just because I like that "woody" sound, but I'll consider the WL just for overall sound.

banjered - Posted - 03/21/2016:  09:29:14

Have you tried one of John Balch's hide heads? Have you listened to someone else play your banjo in a jam circle?  I've played in jams with whyte laydie banjos and they didn't sound all that loud. But when I made a beer run you could hear the whyte laydie very distinctly above the din. Could be true with your Tubby too. Banjered

csacwp - Posted - 03/21/2016:  11:25:24

The Tubaphone in my experience as a classic style player is the loudest of the three. I would work on other aspects of your setup... Try a frosted head or a good (not very thick) calfskin. Use a light weight bridge without an ebony cap. With low tension nylon strings, a light, period bridge, and a frosted top my Tubaphone is deafening. I could easily play with a pianist on stage for a few thousand people and be heard without a microphone or pickup.  Remember that they were built for very thin gut strings... wire strings tend to be much more quiet, even with a period-correct setup.

Here's an example: youtube.com/watch?v=aMNIqMwxPpE

Edited by - csacwp on 03/21/2016 11:28:09

ceemonster - Posted - 03/21/2016:  23:17:34

Bart Reiter Whyte Laydies (or his current maple "Regent" model with a WL ring but no bracket band) do have a certain "crack" thanks not only to the characteristics already described by other posters of the WL ring, but also thanks to the rims Reiter uses on his full-metal-tone ring banjos. At 5/8" thick, they are a hair thicker than the rims many other makers use for WL, tubaphone, and bacophone-ish models. This makes for a powerful version of a WL. (Reiter's rolled-brass-hoop models get a 1/2-inch rim)  Technically, of course, current Reiters with WL rings are "Electric" iterations, since they have the scalloped WL ring but no bracket band.   (I do see a Reiter WL No. 9-ish model with lots of snazzy inlay and a BB at Elderly's used openback listings, btw)     If you do end up going for a Reiter, I would definitely go maple, not the mahogany Galax, if you're looking for "cut."    I love mahogany WLs and tubaphones, but if you want "cut" and sparkle, maple is the way to go.



Having said all that . . . I think it's safe to say that many an oldtime dance band player in the Carolinas and the Virginias makes quite a joyful noise with a Vega Tubaphone. They often go heavier strings with a high action, and you can hear them down the block.

Edited by - ceemonster on 03/21/2016 23:20:22

csacwp - Posted - 03/22/2016:  07:49:56

quote:

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Originally posted by ceemonster

 

 Technically, of course, current Reiters with WL rings are "Electric" iterations, since they have the scalloped WL ring but no bracket band.  

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The tone ring is called the Electric tone ring.  There is no such thing as a WL tone ring.  A WL is an Electric with a bracket band.