mipake - Posted - 03/01/2014:  14:49:52

With all the threads about B&D banjos I am still confused about the different models.  How did they differ in construction and quality.   how was the tone rings constructed?

I know silver bells seem to be the top of the line but how many different grades of silver bells were there?  were the rims on B&D banjos all the same?

thanks

Mike

jbalch - Posted - 03/01/2014:  15:54:07

MIke:

There is not a short answer to your question.  The history of The Bacon Banjo company is very interesting.  There was an almost constant evolution of models, styles, and specifications.   Examples:

1. FF Professional with internal resonator and spun brass donut ring

2. Pre- Silver Bell models:  Super Banjo & others

3. Silver Bell Models ( styles 1-9, at least three (3) different tone ring types, many resonator types, Montana, Sultana ... etc.)

4. Non silver bell models - with simple brass hoop & skirt tone ring (Style C, Peerless, Special, Senorita, and many made for sale under other brand names)

I have really not scratched the surface.  Maybe one of the more knowledgeable fellows around here will jump in.  I am linking this to the Back & Day group for more exposure...best wishes!

hielandman - Posted - 03/01/2014:  16:17:51

Mike,

you are opening up a big can of worms, for sure!  (a very interesting, and complicated can of worms though!)  And JBalch, you have scratched the surface, but there is so much under the surface, and gave Mike a lot to think about.    Mike, get yourself a reprint of the 1924 Bacon catalog, you can find them around.  Also, late 20's, early thirties catalogs are out there, sometimes on a DVD, CD, whatever, sometimes printed.  Also, the 1914 catalog is available in print form also.  Pick those up, that will give you an idea of what was available off the shelf.  But, they did a lot of custom work as well.  And look at the pictures, sometimes the picture will tell you something that the description overlooks.  Bacon 's are great, have fun!

Don

mipake - Posted - 03/01/2014:  17:13:21

thanks i downloaded a 1930 and 1920s catalog .   that helps but i still don't understand the description of the tone ring on the silver bells. 

Mike

jims38134 - Posted - 03/01/2014:  17:21:32

Here is a picture showing the "guts" of a B&D Silver Bell tone ring.  This one has the inner "holes"; earlier ones had holes both on the inside and outside of the "skirt", and later ones had no holes.  The copper rod sits on top of the rim, covered by the tone ring. jim

Edited by - jims38134 on 03/01/2014 17:22:44

jbalch - Posted - 03/01/2014:  17:48:04

Here are some more photos...

Gordon tone ring by B&D	silver bell tone ting - with interior holes	1925 Silver Bell #2	Silver Bell tone ring - no interior holes
Resonator flanges 1925 (left) & 1930s (right)

jbalch - Posted - 03/02/2014:  04:33:21

For what is is worth .... my favorite Silver Bell incarnation is the "type 2" as pictured on Jim's photo and the #2 silver bell in my pictures.  These have holes inside the tone ring but none outside.  I think these were produced approximately from 1925 through 1927.  

I'm aware if these various types of silver Bell rings - I think they appeared in this order too.  (Are there others?)

1. holes inside and outside the rim a5.images.reverb.com/image/upl...easrc.jpg

2. holes inside only (my favorite - photos above)

3. no holes (photo above)

4. archtop (larger rim - can't find a photo)

jims38134 - Posted - 03/02/2014:  05:25:41

Archtop tone ring

Edited by - jims38134 on 03/02/2014 05:26:28

rudykizuty - Posted - 03/02/2014:  08:55:37

There is so much that can be added to this thread. Here are a few of my more immediate thoughts.



Pertaining to the "evolution" of the Silver Bell product line in particular, Bacon more or less did away with the 1-9 numbering system in approx. the 1931 time frame. Sales were down dramatically with the emergence of the Great Depression and their line was revamped. Here are some of the particulars as I understand them:



1) the 1-9 numbering system was abandoned.

2) production of the Montana line was ceased.

3) new Silver Bell models were released that represented the majority of SB production, including the Serenader and Symphonie.

4) the Symphonie was equipped exclusively with the newly designed arched top tone ring.

5) The Sultana continued to be produced but ultimately with a new design in markings on the peghead and fret board.

6) the Senorita (not in the Silver Bell line) was released as Bacon's new "student" model.

 

Edited by - rudykizuty on 03/02/2014 08:55:55

mipake - Posted - 03/02/2014:  10:44:10

really appreciate everyone taking the time to educate me.  Were the 1920's silver bell tone rings cast or spun metal?

Thanks

Mike

dspainters - Posted - 03/02/2014:  11:23:31

hi mark here are some pictures of 2 different style tone rings.. on the left i have a 1927 radio special no tone ring with the resonator it also..on the right is a picture of 1921 bacon blue ribbon orchestra model.. hope that helped a little bit still new here to  bho  good luck .dave

Edited by - dspainters on 03/02/2014 11:27:38

rudykizuty - Posted - 03/02/2014:  13:13:15

quote:

---

Originally posted by mipake

really appreciate everyone taking the time to educate me.  Were the 1920's silver bell tone rings cast or spun metal?

Thanks

Mike

---

They are all spun. 

Polle Flaunoe - Posted - 03/03/2014:  04:08:13

quote:

---

Originally posted by rudykizuty

There is so much that can be added to this thread. Here are a few of my more immediate thoughts.



Pertaining to the "evolution" of the Silver Bell product line in particular, Bacon more or less did away with the 1-9 numbering system in approx. the 1931 time frame. Sales were down dramatically with the emergence of the Great Depression and their line was revamped. Here are some of the particulars as I understand them:



1) the 1-9 numbering system was abandoned.

2) production of the Montana line was ceased.

3) new Silver Bell models were released that represented the majority of SB production, including the Serenader and Symphonie.

4) the Symphonie was equipped exclusively with the newly designed arched top tone ring.

5) The Sultana continued to be produced but ultimately with a new design in markings on the peghead and fret board.

6) the Senorita (not in the Silver Bell line) was released as Bacon's new "student" model.

 

---

Tony,

Great observations and thoughts - I do agree with most of these.

The 30s were for sure extremely difficult for many manufacturers - I´m impressed, that the Bacon Co. chose and managed to continue their fantastic level of constructions, features and craftsmanship (and thus the strength, sturdiness and especially the musicality of the banjos built in these years).

I´m f.ex. the lucky owner of one of the last SB #6 NPU´s built - by looks this banjo comes only somewhat close to its mid/late 20s sisters - but it´s in fact even better built and much better performing.

I have owned many other examples of 30s models/styles/versions - and do still own a few - each of these did/do for sure impress me and others.

Polle