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Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/03/2013: 22:50:04
Hi Guy's
I was reading the Bluegrass Shack Blog this morning and this is what Chris Talley Armstrong's beginner students are currently working on. I thought this may be of some help to those of you planning to attend your first jam session what to look out for and what questions to ask when you get there.
Beginning Instructional Jam Material
Chris Talley Armstrong - Bluegrass Shack
I thought it might be helpful to include on our blog the information we covered at the Instructional Jam Class last night. This will give everyone the opportunity to review the information. We covered a lot!
VOLUME - Don't play too loudly if you aren't playing the melody.
BLUEGRASS vs. FOLK - In bluegrass music, only one person sings the lead and only one person plays the melody at a time. In folk, everyone does everything at the same time all the time. If you break this rule in bluegrass, no one will want to jam with you!
VERSE & CHORUS - The verses of a song have different words. Most songs have 2-3 verses. The chorus of a song is the part that is played after every verse. The words are always the same for the chorus. Usually, harmony is sung on the chorus and not the verses, though this is not set in stone.
KICK-OFF - The instrumental lead (melody) that starts a song.
BREAK - This is a "break" for the vocalist. It means that one of the musicians is going to play lead (melody) on their instrument.
STANDARD FORM - The standard form for a bluegrass vocal with three verses would be: Kick-off, 1st verse, chorus, break, 2nd verse, chorus, break, 3rd verse, chorus, tag & end.
TAG - The "tag" is when you repeat the last line of a song at the end of the song. It serves as an ending. Sometimes the tag is two lines, but usually just one.
THE MUSICAL ALPHABET - The musical alphabet goes from A to G and then starts over again.
NASHVILLE NUMBER SYSTEM - Very basically, this means assigning numbers to the chords of a song. This system is what studio musicians use so that there is only one chord chart no matter how many different keys the song may be played in. It makes it easy to transpose to different keys, and it doesn't matter if one person uses a capo and another doesn't.
The numbers used to designate the chords are Roman Numerals.
Most bluegrass songs use I, IV & V chords.
Mandolin and banjo players learned how the Nashville Number System and their moveable chords work together.
HOW TO SIGNAL THE END - Lifting your leg up on the last line of a song is a good way to let others know you are ending the song.
HOW TO TELL WHAT KEY A SONG IS IN - If the songs starts and ends on the same chord, the song will be in that key. If the song start and ends on different chords, then the song will be in the key of the ending chord.
We only played two- and three-chord songs last night, but we actually got through quite a few songs. Everyone received copies of the lyrics and chords so that the songs may be practiced at home. I will be passing out tabs to the songs at the next session. Our repertoire is currently all in the key of G and includes bluegrass, gospel and folk songs:
1. I Am Bound for the Promised Land
2. Buffalo Gals
3. Hot Corn Cold Corn
4. Mountain Dew
5. You Are My Sunshine
6. This Land is Your Land
7. The Crawdad Song
8. Worried Man Blues
Banjo players are working on their G licks and the walk-up. The G lick is played after the final D chord of a verse or chorus. It is used in place of simply returning to the G chord with regular back-up. Eventually, different licks will be used as well. Banjo players also learned that they may use the D7 chord in place of D, as long as the song is not in the key of D.
Fiddle players learned simple "chords" to use as back-up, and how and when to play them. Fiddle players may also play harmony to the vocalist, especially on slower songs.
Everyone, regardless of what instrument they play, learned what the G, C and D chords look like on guitar. We also talked about how people may make their chords differently, and how you might be able to still tell what chords they are even though they are a little bit different.
Everyone also practiced singing the chorus of the songs as we played.
HEADS UP - We will add Bile Them Cabbage Down as our first instrumental. Banjo players - start practicing with your capos at the 2nd fret! We will be in the Key of A for this song. Those without capos will be using the chords A, D & E.
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/04/2013: 05:44:41
A nice summary of bluegrass vocabulary and song structure.
marcel - Posted - 05/04/2013: 05:55:55
Tam, thank you for posting this up, it cleared up a few things for me. 
Fathand - Posted - 05/04/2013: 06:21:40
That is a decent summary. Please remember there will be exceptions to every rule.
Rich Weill - Posted - 05/04/2013: 06:59:10
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
HOW TO TELL WHAT KEY A SONG IS IN - If the songs starts and ends on the same chord, the song will be in that key. If the song start and ends on different chords, then the song will be in the key of the ending chord.
Don't you find this advice a little impractical for jam purposes? Determine the key according to the ending chord? Okay -- but I'd really like to jam along before the end. Yes, I know that the song will be repeated many times as verses and choruses are sung, and breaks played, but I'd still like to play along from the start.
Aren't there better guidelines for determining the key at the beginning (assuming the song leader hasn't done the courtesy of announcing the key)? From the first two, or first three, chords, for example? Then again, a lot depends on the song. "Don't Let Your Deal Go Down" starts VI-II-V before you ever get to the I chord.
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/04/2013: 07:28:24
Well, in a jam setting you determine the key by being told, "Let's do this one in the key of A", or whatever, right?
;^)
CreekRunner - Posted - 05/04/2013: 08:24:35
I would love to attend a class like this. Intended for pure beginners, no pressure.
Rick McKeon - Posted - 05/04/2013: 09:37:32
Thanks for the summary. Good info.
Rick
Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/04/2013: 12:41:26
quote:
Originally posted by Rich Weill
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
HOW TO TELL WHAT KEY A SONG IS IN - If the songs starts and ends on the same chord, the song will be in that key. If the song start and ends on different chords, then the song will be in the key of the ending chord.
Don't you find this advice a little impractical for jam purposes? Determine the key according to the ending chord? Okay -- but I'd really like to jam along before the end. Yes, I know that the song will be repeated many times as verses and choruses are sung, and breaks played, but I'd still like to play along from the start.
Aren't there better guidelines for determining the key at the beginning (assuming the song leader hasn't done the courtesy of announcing the key)? From the first two, or first three, chords, for example? Then again, a lot depends on the song. "Don't Let Your Deal Go Down" starts VI-II-V before you ever get to the I chord.
Rich your free to pick holes in it all you want. I lifted this straight from Chris' blog ( this is advice/instructions to Chris own students.) I thought it may be of some help to someone here on the BHO preparing to attend a jam for the first time.
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/04/2013: 17:40:33
quote:
Originally posted by CreekRunner
I would love to attend a class like this. Intended for pure beginners, no pressure.
See if you can get to one of Pete Wernick's Jam Camps, or a Wernick Method class. drbanjo.com/classes-camps.php#jamcamps
Tim13 - Posted - 05/04/2013: 18:09:26
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
BREAK - This is a "break" for the vocalist. It means that one of the musicians is going to play lead (melody) on their instrument.
I often wondered where the term "break" originated.
Tim
Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/05/2013: 05:04:51
quote:
Originally posted by Tim13
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
BREAK - This is a "break" for the vocalist. It means that one of the musicians is going to play lead (melody) on their instrument.
I often wondered where the term "break" originated.
Tim
Hi Tim
Yes I took me a while to get my head round this term "playing a break" It'd the vocalist that is having the break from singing. We just fill the space with noise.
Phil - MO - Posted - 05/05/2013: 06:02:24
Surprised you heard of Chris in Scotland. Isn't internet a great tool for learning. She has a store (The Bluegreass Shack) in a small farming town in Illinois.
You can't go wrong in reading her advice on playing most bluegrass instruments and repairing them. She does both full time in a small town in Illinois. Excellent fiddle and banjo player and I attended a seminar on banjo setup and repair a couple of years ago.
Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/05/2013: 06:11:35
quote:
Originally posted by Phil - MO
Surprised you heard of Chris in Scotland. Isn't internet a great tool for learning. She has a store (The Bluegreass Shack) in a small farming town in Illinois.
You can't go wrong in reading her advice on playing most bluegrass instruments and repairing them. She does both full time in a small town in Illinois. Excellent fiddle and banjo player and I attended a seminar on banjo setup and repair a couple of years ago.
Hi Phil
I have been reading Chris' blog for many years, I do almost as much research as I do pickin and I pick alot.
Rich Weill - Posted - 05/05/2013: 08:21:32
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
quote:
Originally posted by Rich Weill
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
HOW TO TELL WHAT KEY A SONG IS IN - If the songs starts and ends on the same chord, the song will be in that key. If the song start and ends on different chords, then the song will be in the key of the ending chord.
Don't you find this advice a little impractical for jam purposes? Determine the key according to the ending chord? Okay -- but I'd really like to jam along before the end. Yes, I know that the song will be repeated many times as verses and choruses are sung, and breaks played, but I'd still like to play along from the start.
Aren't there better guidelines for determining the key at the beginning (assuming the song leader hasn't done the courtesy of announcing the key)? From the first two, or first three, chords, for example? Then again, a lot depends on the song. "Don't Let Your Deal Go Down" starts VI-II-V before you ever get to the I chord.
Rich your free to pick holes in it all you want. I lifted this straight from Chris' blog ( this is advice/instructions to Chris own students.) I thought it may be of some help to someone here on the BHO preparing to attend a jam for the first time.
No one suggested otherwise, Tam. But my questions about determining the key are serious ones, and remain regardless of whose blog this advice came from.
Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/05/2013: 09:01:52
quote:
Originally posted by Rich Weill
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
quote:
Originally posted by Rich Weill
quote:
Originally posted by Tam_Zeb
HOW TO TELL WHAT KEY A SONG IS IN - If the songs starts and ends on the same chord, the song will be in that key. If the song start and ends on different chords, then the song will be in the key of the ending chord.
Don't you find this advice a little impractical for jam purposes? Determine the key according to the ending chord? Okay -- but I'd really like to jam along before the end. Yes, I know that the song will be repeated many times as verses and choruses are sung, and breaks played, but I'd still like to play along from the start.
Aren't there better guidelines for determining the key at the beginning (assuming the song leader hasn't done the courtesy of announcing the key)? From the first two, or first three, chords, for example? Then again, a lot depends on the song. "Don't Let Your Deal Go Down" starts VI-II-V before you ever get to the I chord.
Rich your free to pick holes in it all you want. I lifted this straight from Chris' blog ( this is advice/instructions to Chris own students.) I thought it may be of some help to someone here on the BHO preparing to attend a jam for the first time.
No one suggested otherwise, Tam. But my questions about determining the key are serious ones, and remain regardless of whose blog this advice came from.
Hi Rich... When I joined the Hangout five years ago. I asked how do folks determined a Key. This was the same stocking answer I was given. I too think it is unsatisfactory but in reality that's exactly what happens. I am not saying it's right. The fact that it is written here at least prepares a newbie for such a situation when it happens. Personally I would much prefer it were common practice to announce the Key and Chords in the progression. But in my experience this never happens and it is unlikely to change in the foreseeable future, so Newbie's will always be fumbling around trying to fine the Key all the way through a tune.
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/05/2013: 09:52:19
When someone says you determine the key b the last chord, they're telling you how to determine the key when you're at home, trying to figure out a song from a recording. But in a jam session, it's the obligation of the song leader to tell everyone else what key the upcoming song is in. If he/she doesn't, then you should ask. Experienced jammers don't need to be told the progression beforehand; once they know the key, they can pick it up on the fly by listening and watching the other players. If a song has anything unusual in it (for example, that 3 chord in "Old Home Place", it's good form to alert one's fellow jammers.
MOUNTAIN GOAT - Posted - 05/05/2013: 14:42:39
So many know how to play the banjo, and know how to blend it right in to back up. It is a totally different skill to be able to transfer that knowledge / skill to one who does not know. Just like many of the very poor auto repair manuals. Undo this bolt, turn the page and it says " now that the engine is out". Or the computer guy that says he will explain something, only he hit ten times as many steps as the steps he tells you.
I have been in two jams now, both with about 20 people. All are singing and looking at words to the tune with chords above the words. I was told this was a bluegrass jam. Has not been a bluegrass tune yet. That isn't a problem, but I have not heard any of these tunes. I told them I haven't heard these tunes. So I was told to sit where I could watch and follow the guitar. The 2nd time I went, I could do that. I tried, as I also listened for chord changes, the beat, the flavor of the tune. They rarely said what key, even though I kept asking. I was sitting right next to the lead guy. And then following a guitar that is making tons of mistakes. I felt like I shouldn't be doing this for another year, but then I got lucky on some and it sounded really good. Practice means nothing, when you don't understand how to get to the first step, what to follow, how to follow, etc. Keeping the beat was not a problem with me, but following the chords was. Figuring out what key the tune is in, on the fly, to something you never heard before is impossible. Extremely frustrating. I do and I don't want to do this, and don't know what to do to get some comfort feeling about it. Some people just know this stuff, but some of us need it explained totally clear.
Kemo Sabe - Posted - 05/07/2013: 09:49:28
Mountain Goat - you are doing a lot better than you think you are. Most of us - including those folks in your jam have been exactly where you are. One lesson you have learned is how NOT to run a jam. As others have mentioned, the person leading off the song should have the courtesy to announce the song and the key. Yeah - I've been to jams where not even the song title (or key) was announced. One thing you might want to do is to watch for the lead person's capo placement. For example, if the next leader is putting his/her capo on the second fret you might be going to the key of A (playing out of G) ... Or you might be going to the key of D (playing out of C position) .... Or maybe E (playing out of D). Another thing you might want to do is find a friendly person at the jam that you can sit by for friendly little helping hints re: Key.....off- chords, etc. You will discover that folks are glad to help. You are doing good. Phil
Tam_Zeb - Posted - 05/07/2013: 10:13:31
quote:
Originally posted by Kemo Sabe
Mountain Goat - you are doing a lot better than you think you are. Most of us - including those folks in your jam have been exactly where you are. One lesson you have learned is how NOT to run a jam. As others have mentioned, the person leading off the song should have the courtesy to announce the song and the key. Yeah - I've been to jams where not even the song title (or key) was announced. One thing you might want to do is to watch for the lead person's capo placement. For example, if the next leader is putting his/her capo on the second fret you might be going to the key of A (playing out of G) ... Or you might be going to the key of D (playing out of C position) .... Or maybe E (playing out of D). Another thing you might want to do is find a friendly person at the jam that you can sit by for friendly little helping hints re: Key.....off- chords, etc. You will discover that folks are glad to help. You are doing good. Phil
Phil My frustration at jams is not know which chords are in the progression. I am getting better now but in the early day's the not know when a tune had an Em, Am or F Chord really had me lost and I guess most beginners get that way when they are being told to learn tunes using 1 4 5. To me more emphasis should be on introducing tunes like Dark Hollow at Salt Creek to beginners at an early stage where you go beyond the 1 4 5 progression.
250gibson - Posted - 05/07/2013: 11:42:48
I never understood all of this "instruction" on how to jam. Some seem to make it more complicated then it actually is.
KISS system works best:
1. If the key isn't announced and you are unsure, ask.
2. If there is an off chord, and you are unsure, and can't read another players hands, ask.
3. If the leader is looking at you for a break, either nod yes if you want to take one, or no if you don't, don't just stare back at them
4. If you are not making contact eye contact with the leader when time for a break comes, don't expect to be given one.
5. If you are leading a tune, announce key and name of song, and be prepared to dole out the breaks when appropriate.
Moral of the story. Pay attention and if you are unsure, ask someone. (no one will fault you for asking a chord or key, however they may look at you funny if you continually get it wrong without asking: ie: playing in A when the song is in D, etc.)
MOUNTAIN GOAT - Posted - 05/07/2013: 13:54:54
Thanks They only have used a capo twice. I would need a clip on to make that work. I am going to go torture myself again tonight at the same jam. I am thinking of trying to follow a fiddle pciker instead of the guitar guy who is leading the whole thing. What do you think about trying to follow a fiddle player? I would ask them to show me their chords first to get an idea of what to look for.
250gibson - Posted - 05/07/2013: 14:33:50
quote:
Originally posted by MOUNTAIN GOAT
Thanks They only have used a capo twice. I would need a clip on to make that work. I am going to go torture myself again tonight at the same jam. I am thinking of trying to follow a fiddle pciker instead of the guitar guy who is leading the whole thing. What do you think about trying to follow a fiddle player? I would ask them to show me their chords first to get an idea of what to look for.
Some people just don't use capos, but that doesn't mean that you can't if you need to. I would ask the name of the key if you are unsure and either capo or uncapo according to what you need to do to play in that particular key. I would not follow the fiddle player as they are the hardest to follow as they don't play chords, there are no frets, and the fingerboard is aimed toward the ceiling. I would look at another banjo player or guitar player. No harm comes from asking
MOUNTAIN GOAT - Posted - 05/07/2013: 14:55:24
My mistake Since they pick it and it has frets, it must be a mandolin? There aren't any other banjo pickers there, and only one acoustical guitar. The electric guitar guy is too involved with others.
