barrybush - Posted - 06/02/2012:  06:40:31

Would you share with me your definition of good right hand technique and the categories that includes? I have tried searching the archives but I am still not clear.

Correct me if I am wrong. "Anchoring" the ring finger or the pinkie or both would be a category. (Different opinions, that's ok) The "position of the wrist", how much arch would be a category. The "angle of attack" , how the picks strike the strings. Am I using the correct words? Are these in fact parts of good RH technique? What others am I missing. Thanks for your replies. If you know of an older post that has this, forgive my over looking it and send me a link.

kmwaters - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:06:00

Attached is one that was written years ago.  Then just look a the free online lessons and right hand closeups.  They vary from player to player but most are fairly conventional when it comes to position on the head, amount of arch in the wrist raising the back of the hand above the strings, and the angle of the fingers across the strings which dictates the angle of attack on the strings.  The greatest variation seems to come from the anchoring - number of anchor fingers as well as location and angle.  Most prescribe keeping those anchors fairly upright and don't let them splay out.

Gestalt Right Hand

Texasbanjo - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:06:17

Another technique would be "economy of motion" of the fingers; i.e., fingers close to the strings, little movement when picking.

 

As far as good technique, whatever works for you and gives you smooth picking would be okay.

There's no "one size fits all" in right hand technique. 

If you can plant two fingers, it gives you a better stability from which to pick.  If you can't, one finger will normally suffice.   If you have your arm on the armrest, that will give you some stability and one or two fingers on the head will do the rest. 

As far as wrist arch, some people arch high some don't arch at all.  Whatever feels good and works for you is the right technique.  Some people have small fingers, some large and that makes a difference in the wrist arch or not arch.

As far as angle of attack, try to hit the strings straight on -- you can move the banjo neck up and down or you can move your wrist position.  Some people angle their picks, which I don't do, but if it works for them....  Again, whatever works for you. 

There are probably other categories but I can't think of any right now.  I'm sure someone else will chime in here with more ideas. 

Texasbanjo - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:08:21

Check out these topics for right hand technique:  banjohangout.org/pages/search....technique

There's a bunch of them.

HSmith - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:15:38

Hi

I'd say that good right hand technique is the one that allows you to get the degree of tone, speed and precision you desire from your banjo when playing the type of music you choose to play. IMHO, it doesn't matter how much you arch your wrist, whether you plant one, two or no fingers, what angle your picks hit the strings, as long as you achieve the sound you want. That said, I strongly believe in the importance of economy of movement in the picking fingers. Provided your hand feels comfortable, you sound the way you want to sound, and there's no excessive 'flailing around' in the picking fingers, I'd guess your technique is good for you. It  may be that an experienced teacher could observe your playing technique and possibly recommend some beneficial changes, but I think that would need to be based purely on your personal style and hand structure.

Harry

Earls 5 - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:21:34

Relaxing of the hand while picking in any position is crucial to true good technique. If you are tense & uncomfortable your tone and timing will suffer. There are basic guidelines surely, but absolutes are few. Pick to string angle is also very important to the tone and volume you will be able to pull from your banjo. Good attack is what that boils down to.

Rich Weill - Posted - 06/02/2012:  07:44:07

quote:

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Originally posted by kmwaters

They vary from player to player but most are fairly conventional when it comes to ... the angle of the fingers across the strings which dictates the angle of attack on the strings.

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I'm not so sure about that.  Take a look at J.D. Crowe's wrist angle youtube.com/watch?v=LA7mjbioF8Ayoutube.com/watch?v=LA7mjbioF8A">here.  [Personally, I find this position painful even to watch.]

Then read what Pat Cloud says about cocking your wrist in Masters of the 5-String Banjo: "[T]he reason I angle my fingerpicks and straighten them out is because I can just put my hand in a very comfortable position where I don't have to cock my wrist to the side. I've noticed a lot of bluegrass players cock their wrist to the side, and if tendinitis or tension results, it's because the wrist function is being impaired. In other words, you're running those tendons through a kink in your wrist. So I do what I do to be as comfortable as I can with the right hand.”

Another factor worth considering, according to a post some months ago, is whether your picks hit the strings at different distances from the bridge:  "The more of a straight line you have (fingers and thumb hitting strings the same distance from the bridge), the more even your tone will be."

I found this post very interesting.  If you hold your fingers perpendicular to the strings, each pick is then a different distance from the bridge.  If you hold your fingers across the strings at an angle -- what I find to be a more relaxed position -- your picks tend to line up all about equidistant from the bridge.  But this finger angle then requires that you rotate your picks.

So I'm with Texasbanjo on this one.  Each person's arms are a different length, hands are a different size, and fingers are constructed differently.  Avoid tension.  A relaxed right hand and fingers will move more freely and quickly.

beegee - Posted - 06/02/2012:  11:55:32

Do what works. Our friend Lynwood Lunsford, for example,has a lot of finger movement and anchors only the pinkie. i haven't noticed that has hurt his playing any. He's a fine banjo picker.

Dave Magram - Posted - 06/02/2012:  12:56:55

Barry,

In my experience, shaping the picks correctly and positioning one’s right-hand correctly are extremely important to the tone, volume, picking efficiency and precision, and ergonomics to prevent injuries to one’s hands. I have done a lot of research over the years as to how the best banjo-players pick the banjo and shape their picks, and experimentation to apply what I have learned to my own playing.

(NOTE: If anyone reading this is perfectly happy with the way they are picking and see no reason to consider trying anything different at no cost at all, you might as well stop here.)

Let’s start with the greatest bluegrass banjo player of all time, Earl Scruggs:

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Earl Scruggs: “I hold the palm of my hand so that it is almost even [parallel] to the banjo head, and I keep the long parts of my fingers—the first bone part nearest the palm—almost straight with the palm. Then, after the knuckles, I bend my fingers back—more than most players do, I think. Because of that sharp angle, and the way I pick at the strings, I have to bend my picks back until the part that contacts the strings is flat with it. Most of my picking motion—in the parts of my fingers that do the most movement—happens after the big knuckle, and it is just the last two parts of the finger that do most of the picking and moving.” (Masters of the Five String Banjo, Trishcka & Wernick, pg. 25-26).

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Pay special attention to the two sentences I have underlined above; Earl is telling you how he gets such great tone, speed, and efficiency.

WHERE TO START

The place to start is not where some people seem to begin-- with wrist-arch or believing that fingerpicks must be used exactly how they came “out of the box” (Earl didn’t—see quote above). You need to start with how best to strike the strings with your fingers/fingerpicks. This is where the “rubber meets the road”— finding the best angle and motion to pick the strings most effectively. The rest of it will fall into place once you have got that basic motion and hand-posture worked out.

THE SECRET

You need to use the picking angle and motion that allows your fingers to exert the maximum force on the string with the least effort in the shortest amount of time. It is like throwing a Frisbee, swinging a golf club, or hitting a baseball. You need to examine both the physics and the physiology involved to be most effective, efficient, and ergonomic.

What does this mean for banjo-picking? The maximum force from your finger motion comes not from the pad of your finger, but from the tip of your finger. This is the “secret”.

Here’s a simple experiment: Press the pad of your right-hand finger (where your fingerprint is) against your right-hand thumb as hard as you can, and notice how much pressure is felt on your thumb. Now Press the tip of your right-hand finger (the very end of your finger) against your right-hand thumb as hard as you can, and notice how much pressure is felt on your thumb. Most people find that the force from their fingertip is nearly twice the force from their finger-pad. This is why Earl said, “I bend my fingers back—more than most players do”, to use his fingertip force to pick.

This means that to be most effective, you need to posture your hand and shape your picks so that your fingertip is driving the motion, not your fingerpad.  This is what Earl is describing in his quote above.

This means that to pick most effectively, you may need to re-position your right hand and re-shape your fingerpicks. If your fingerpick blades are too straight, you are using your fingerpads to drive the picking motion and probably are not picking most effectively.

I'd suggest playing without fingerpicks for a few minutes and noticing what the most effective motion and angle is. Then shape your fingerpicks (blade and band), so that they support that motion and angle.

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For more information on the results of studying dozens of photographs of Earl and other great banjo-players, and a diagram of what seems to be the most optimal starting point for how to shape your fingerpick-blades, see my posting on: banjohangout.org/topic/222047

- Dave

minstrelmike - Posted - 06/03/2012:  09:27:40

Good right hand technique is whatever gets the best sound out of the banjo for the least effort.

The arching of the wrist will be different for different banjos and for different sounds.

imo, what's required to achieve whatever techniques you think are useful is

1) a good ear,

2) confidence enough to trust your own ear and

3) ability to make different sounds merely by the way you do whatever it is you do with your picking hand

I usually get people to try working on option 1 instead of focusing first on option 3 when they cannot even hear the differences in their own picking that I can hear.