mandopickr - Posted - 03/02/2012:  21:53:08

We have a “venue” which has 6-8 events per year, and with 3-5 songs being played at each. We pay a license fee, which was $150 about 5 yrs ago. I’m not sure what it is today. But if it is at least the same now, we’re paying $5/song, and often playing from ASCAP or BMI sheet music. There is no admission, no money changes hands in any way.

I’ve tried reading both the BMI and ASCAP to get some idea of what the artist will be compensated, but with no luck. I have no doubt the larger corporations get paid well, but what about the bluegrass songwriter/composer. It doesn’t even appear to me that we have a category, but are merged into others. I also found it strange that while the sites list the compensation, it doesn’t list the number of artists compensated.

For example, what does Earl get yearly for Foggy Mountain Breakdown, or the Bryant’s get for Rocky Top. If I play a Gilliam Welch tune, how much of the $5 does she get. If I report the songs played, will that insure the artist gets their due. Or does it go (unfairly) to corporations such as Sony.

banjoak - Posted - 03/03/2012:  03:32:05

quote:

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Originally posted by mandopickr

We have a “venue” which has 6-8 events per year, and with 3-5 songs being played at each. We pay a license fee, which was $150 about 5 yrs ago. I’m not sure what it is today. But if it is at least the same now, we’re paying $5/song, and often playing from ASCAP or BMI sheet music. There is no admission, no money changes hands in any way.



I’ve tried reading both the BMI and ASCAP to get some idea of what the artist will be compensated, but with no luck. I have no doubt the larger corporations get paid well, but what about the bluegrass songwriter/composer. It doesn’t even appear to me that we have a category, but are merged into others. I also found it strange that while the sites list the compensation, it doesn’t list the number of artists compensated.



For example, what does Earl get yearly for Foggy Mountain Breakdown, or the Bryant’s get for Rocky Top. If I play a Gilliam Welch tune, how much of the $5 does she get. If I report the songs played, will that insure the artist gets their due. Or does it go (unfairly) to corporations such as Sony.

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 The license you pay is not a direct payment per song. It would be near impossible to have a system that counts each and every listener for each time a song is played. The license fees collected goes into a pot, then gets distributed according to their statistical modeling formulas based what they can track better. No doubt radio air play, but also take live performance set lists, internet and other. So Earl, Bryant and Gillian get compensated from that collected license based on what they statistically represent in the overall play. 

This is the system (PRO) which  Earl, Bryant and Gillian opted in to use. If they feel they are being cheated, they could always opt to not use the PRO, and have you contact them personally and negotiate terms and payment each time you want to perform their song. My guess is they prefer the PRO system.

Not sure why any money would go to a corporation such as Sony; unless they Earl, Bryant or Gillian negotiated for Sony to OWN the performing rights for the composition. 

drefoss - Posted - 03/03/2012:  04:07:43

I sure hope it doesn't hurt some of the bluegrass festivals they have in Maine through out the summer, just the money the towns make from all the visitors, it would hurt a lot of people with out the spin off's.

Sheldon - Posted - 03/03/2012:  06:22:07

Banjoak
Are you saying, in effect, Lester and Earl cheated their record label by putting some of their compositions in their wives names???

Sheldon

banjoak - Posted - 03/03/2012:  12:29:22

quote:

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Originally posted by Sheldon

Banjoak

Are you saying, in effect, Lester and Earl cheated their record label by putting some of their compositions in their wives names???



Sheldon

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 Huh??? Not in any effect am I saying that. How would that cheat? 

And ASCAP, BMI are about managing the performing rights, not recording rights. 

banjoak - Posted - 03/03/2012:  12:38:39

quote:

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Originally posted by drefoss

I sure hope it doesn't hurt some of the bluegrass festivals they have in Maine through out the summer, just the money the towns make from all the visitors, it would hurt a lot of people with out the spin off's.

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Festivals are not exempt, they need to get a license to allow all those bands to perform those copyrighted bluegrass hits. Most of them probably already do that. 

barbbanjo - Posted - 03/08/2012:  02:58:00

quote:

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Originally posted by Jazzy Al

I feel that Banjoy has explained the situation quite well. I am represented by SOCAN in Canada and BMI in the United States. I hesitate to even mention this because of the very strong opinions in this thread. I certainly don't want to be wrapped in chains and thrown into Lake Superior. However, I would like to receive some modest compensation when one of my compositions is performed in a venue that is charging for individuals to enter and listen or when one of my recordings is streamed or played on commercial radio. SOCAN and BMI provide that service for me to the best of their ability. At the moment there is no alternative to these organizations.

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 Question for Jazzy Al.....since you are involved on both sides of this issue, how do you feel about PROs requiring local jam sessions, etc., to pay licensing fees?  Does it make sense to you that if the jam sessions can't operate, your song may not get off the launching pad  - so to speak?  If hundreds of musicians begin to play your song as it goes from jam to jam and more folks hear it and want to buy it on a CD, doesn't it make sense that you would sell more CDs?  I think you are in a special position here and can give us some valuable insight from an artists point of view.