mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  09:53:49

I've lately been trying to pick out a banjo for my birthday that is coming up. With an original budget of around $1000,  I went down to Banjo.com's warehouse to play some stuff. I ended up being sold on the Recording King RK-35, since it sounded just as good as any in the price range, but almost half the price (I actually think it looks better than the RK-80).



I've pretty much had my heart set on the Madison until I accidentally came across Bishline banjos. I love the Patriot due to the fact that it's walnut and is American made. I found a used (like new, supposedly) one for $1200. I'm back to agonizing over which one to get, again.



It's obvious to me that if I wanted to spend that much money on a banjo then I would jump on it, since it's a beautiful American made, walnut banjo at the same price as foreign made Gibson imitators. My question is whether the extra price is worth it. I understand that the Patriot does not have a full tone ring, while the Madison does. Is the price difference due to the American construction or is the sound that much better?



Thanks!

Fathand - Posted - 10/22/2011:  10:00:49

Check out the Gold Stars GF100 clearance price  on Banjo.com for under $1200.

Jason Wilkerson - Posted - 10/22/2011:  10:02:49

My vote would be for the Bishline.  I'm hearing really impressive things about the RKs, but as you pointed out, American made walnut speaks to alot of people.  When/if the day comes to sell it, the Bishline will do much better.

piscesgrrl - Posted - 10/22/2011:  10:04:19

I had planned on buying a Deering-I figured $1500-2000 was the most I would ever spend on a banjo. I, too, accidentally played a Bishline. I couldn't get the feel or sound of the Bishline out of my system. After speaking with Rob I decided to have a custom banjo built. I am spending about twice as much as originally planned, but I am confident that I am getting the right banjo for me. Take a bit of time to think about it. This is YOUR banjo-you want to absolutely love what you are going to be playing!

JRice43315 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  11:21:54

I currently play a Deering Deluxe. I think the RK-35 is a great looking and sounding banjo for the money and would love to have one. However I have spent quite a bit of time lately checking out the Bishline web site. Rob is building some awesome banjos. Check out the new Cimarron model. Would love to play one of those. IMHO if I were buying and planned on spending less than $1000 I would go for the RK-35. But if I had a grand or more to spend it would probably be on the Bishline Cimarron or one of the other Bishline models. Also as Jason mentioned above American made means alot. I also agree with piscesgrrl about taking your time and making sure you get the right one for you. Good luck with the decison and lets us know what you choose. Keep on Pickin!!

Jonathan

the-fish - Posted - 10/22/2011:  12:19:48

I would go with the Bishline. It will hold that value

mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  12:34:22

Thanks y'all!



I'm only concerned about the tone ring. How will the sound be affected?



If someone could post comparable clips of both banjos it would be helpful. I've played the RK, I just need a reference.

the-fish - Posted - 10/22/2011:  12:49:40

Rob should have a sound clip on his website?

mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  12:53:42

I've listened to them. It's hard to compare sound clips when they are of different qualities, in different rooms, ect. My bad.



Any opinions on the tone ring issue?

Emiel - Posted - 10/22/2011:  13:49:02

quote:

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Originally posted by mbm95

It's obvious to me that if I wanted to spend that much money on a banjo then I would jump on it, since it's a beautiful American made, walnut banjo at the same price as foreign made Gibson imitators. 



Thanks!

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"Foreign-made Gibson imitator" sounds a bit too negative in this case... Gibson lost a lot of it's quality in the 1970s. The same man that brought back the old-fashioned quality to the Gibson banjo line, working for Gibson and designing, now designed the whole line of the new RK banjos...

mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  14:02:27

I'm aware who designs the Recording Kings and I think that they are great instruments. I really liked the RK-35 and RK-80 that I played and wouldn't have a second thought about getting the Madison if I didn't find the Bishline at the price I did.



They are, however, foreign made and use the Gibson standards that many in the industry do. I don't necessarily think those are what determine quality though.

Emiel - Posted - 10/22/2011:  14:26:37

No, you should buy the banjo that speaks to you.... By all means. I like very different types of banjos. 

Edited by - Emiel on 10/22/2011 14:28:17

mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  14:42:05

Yeah, I agree. I've unfortunately played a very low number of banjos so I'm having some difficulty.

john m - Posted - 10/22/2011:  14:59:56

Just a thought. Go ahead and purchase the Patriot.  Since your buying it used, you should be able to sell it in the future if it does not meet your expectations for about the same amount you purchased it for.  I have never seen or played  the Patriot…but Bishline has a great reputation for quality & service.   

D.W. - Posted - 10/22/2011:  16:16:27

quote:

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Originally posted by mbm95

I've listened to them. It's hard to compare sound clips when they are of different qualities, in different rooms, ect. My bad.



Any opinions on the tone ring issue?

---

This might be the same thing as on the Bishline website, but here is a youtube of  Bishline's Patriot

I am pretty sure the sound clips/recordings/videos on Bishline's site and his Youtube channel all use the same recording equipment. I couldn't tell you what it is exactly, but I'm sure a phone call or email to them would get you an answer.  I'm guessing it's something pro quality.  And it's likely that will be a truer representation of the sound then some guy just using the mic on his laptop or video camera who's posting somewhere.

And I agree with John M,'s thought.  SInce you would be getting the Patriot used, if you didn't like it, you'd probably be able to resell it for about what you paid for it. 

And from their Youtube channel here's a video you might be interested in: "Bishline Banjos- How we build them"

Best of luck with your decision.

Edited by - D.W. on 10/22/2011 16:28:28

piscesgrrl - Posted - 10/22/2011:  17:04:21

If you gave Rob a call I'm sure he could help you out with any of your sound/quality questions. He is so kind and I would buy another banjo from him again...actually I really like the Madera.

Joe the banjo guy - Posted - 10/22/2011:  19:42:03

I thought pretty seriously about getting that Patriot you're talking about. I ended up getting a used Midnight Moon instead. It's hard to compare things based only on that one youtube clip of the Patriot, but to my ears, the Patriot has a very "round" sound....not too bright, not too dark. The rolled brass tone hoop cuts back on some of the overtones and the "crashiness" of the banjo. Personally, I really like that, but then again, some people really like super bright and metallic sounding banjos. I also think it would be a very versatile banjo, probably adaptable to clawhammer or other types of playing if that would interest you. It would probably also be somewhat easier to amplify, again, because it would have fewer overtones.

In general, I'm starting to think that people get way too worked up over tone rings. Yeah, it might make the banjo a little louder/brighter, but if you're playing through some sort of amplification system anyway, what's the big deal?

I don't know anything about the RK's, so I can't help you there.

mbm95 - Posted - 10/22/2011:  21:02:52

Thank you very much. I want the banjo to be fairly versatile, because I plan on playing in my church's youth group band (almost exclusively contemporary). Would the Patriot be a better choice?

Joe the banjo guy - Posted - 10/22/2011:  22:05:45

That would be my guess, yes. If you're playing with a big church band, you're probably going to want to get a pickup installed anyway, in which case the tone ring is just going to give you more troubles with feedback. It's really designed to help the banjo sound better and louder in an acoustic, jam-like setting, but I don't really go to jams much, so that's not a huge deal for me. If you're playing on stage through a pickup, you just want something that's easy to play (which the Bishline will be...they have great action and playability) and that doesn't give you too much trouble with feedback.

But I'm sure lots of folks would disagree with me, so take it with a grain of salt!

Joe

MrNatch3L - Posted - 10/23/2011:  05:24:05

I think you would be a very happy camper with the Bishline. RKs are good banjos, well designed, and with pretty good quality control for an Asian-manufactured instrument. Bishline has total quality control... slip-shod, off-the-mark stuff simply doesn't come out of Rob's shop. I wouldn't worry over much about this tone ring or that. If you set up either banjo right you will get a good sound. I'm continually amazed and how much I can change the sound of my Bishline Heirloom. I can make it sound bad... I've done that trying to learn how to do setup. When it's set up well I can still get different sounds out of it - darker, brighter, more or less pop. If you have a decent tone ring, try another bridge if you aren't getting quite the sound you want. . There was a nice original Sosbee bridge on mine but now I'm using a KatEyz and it gets me a sound I like. Mike Smith will work with you to come up with a bridge that will deliver.

In your shoes I'd jump on the Bishline and maybe invest in a professional setup job. Or better yet, invest in some lessons on how to set up your banjo. It's not rocket science. You just need a few simple tools, your ear, and some time. 

mahogchief01 - Posted - 10/23/2011:  14:57:42

Go with the Bishline. I have several banjo's in my collection, including a recording king which I like very much, but I think you would like the Bishline better over the long haul. Greg Rich and Rob Bishline are both very nice and very knowledgeable when it comes to banjos. Hope you love the banjo you wind up with.

Mickey

mbm95 - Posted - 10/23/2011:  18:00:04

Thank you very much, everybody!



After talking with my parents, I think I've decided on the Madison. Although I love the look of the Bishline, it's hard to justify paying that much more  at this stage of my life.



Rob Bishline is a great guy. I emailed him with the issue, and he sent back a reply within a few hours. He basically described the sound of the Patriot and told me that if I wanted to add a full tone ring in the future I could get a luthier to do so. He did say, however, that Recording Kings are great banjos and I would be happy with either banjo.



I'm sure that I'll be ordering a custom Bishline once I get out of school and some extra money!

Levi Fisher - Posted - 10/23/2011:  18:04:00

mbm95.............quit procrastinating, GO BUY THE BISHLINE!!!!!! or tell me where this "used one" for $1200.00 is and I'll buy it!!!

Levi

mbm95 - Posted - 10/23/2011:  18:36:38

AHHH! So many decisions! lol.



My birthday is November 2. I feel so rushed!

Jason Wilkerson - Posted - 10/24/2011:  07:48:17

quote:

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Originally posted by Levi Fisher

mbm95.............quit procrastinating, GO BUY THE BISHLINE!!!!!! or tell me where this "used one" for $1200.00 is and I'll buy it!!!

Levi

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Since mbm95 appears to have opted for the RK, I think he was looking at this from Zepp.

zeppmusic.com/Ubanjos/Patriot_...72002.htm

I hope that I'm helping out both you and Donald Zepp here.  It looks like a great deal, and I'm passing this one because mbm95 says he is going RK.

banjolina - Posted - 10/24/2011:  11:52:37

To late....I bought it today.  I hope to have it in a few days.  I can't wait.  I have been looking for something lighter and had been looking at a John Hartford but found the Bishline at Zepp's and could not resist. 

Todd

Levi Fisher - Posted - 10/24/2011:  13:57:52

quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Wilkerson

quote:

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Originally posted by Levi Fisher

mbm95.............quit procrastinating, GO BUY THE BISHLINE!!!!!! or tell me where this "used one" for $1200.00 is and I'll buy it!!!

Levi

---

Since mbm95 appears to have opted for the RK, I think he was looking at this from Zepp.

zeppmusic.com/Ubanjos/Patriot_...72002.htm

I hope that I'm helping out both you and Donald Zepp here.  It looks like a great deal, and I'm passing this one because mbm95 says he is going RK.

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 Jason, looks like mbm95 and I were posting at the same time when he announced he was going with the RK........................thanks for the link for the Bishline, but see it's already gone

Levi

Edited by - Levi Fisher on 10/24/2011 14:00:48

mbm95 - Posted - 10/24/2011:  15:02:15

Actually a friend of mine and I were talking and he said to go with the Bishline, which kind of sealed the deal.... 



Not a big deal, though. I guess the situation made the choice for me lol. Rob said the I'd be happy with either banjo, and my parents weren't wanting me to spend all my money anway.

mbm95 - Posted - 10/24/2011:  15:09:36

Banjolina, tell me what you think of it once you get it... Hope you like it!