longneckpat - Posted - 10/04/2010:  13:50:40

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Hi all out there,

Having been a Pete Seeger disciple for along time and a long neck freak, has anyone noticed that he has at least two home(handmade) banjos or maybe it has been covered before. Looking at the NY Times Article, the banjo he carries has got a light coloured fretboard and has not got the fibreglass bridge. Am I loosing it. Check out the following links and tell me if I'm correct. Th first two links contain the lighter coloured fretboard, possibly rosewood and what seems like a truss rod cover on the headstock

nytimes.com/2010/10/03/nyregio...l?_r=3&hp

2.bp.blogspot.com/_VhIJeRKiFqI...eeger.jpg

These two links contain the more familiar darker coloured fretboard and Tubaphone pot it seems.

blog.nj.com/entertainment_impa...EEGER.JPG

images.theage.com.au/ftage/ffx...454,0.jpg

Forgot to mention, the famous slogan on the head appears to be in a smaller circle in the light coloured banjo and nearer the tension hoop in the darker banjo before the head got changed recently!

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Edited by - longneckpat on 10/04/2010 13:53:20

mainejohn - Posted - 10/04/2010:  14:17:16

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The one to which he is most closely associated is the infamous lignum vitae banjo that he has played for over 50 years. The one pictured in the NYT article is also pictured on an instructional VHS tape he produced a number of years ago, and is obviously a different banjo. I suspect the latter of the two is his "back-up", but I'm just speculating.

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Edited by - mainejohn on 10/04/2010 14:43:08

longneckpat - Posted - 10/04/2010:  14:26:27

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That makes sense mainejohn. I am not very active as you can see on this site, but it is a pity I didn't know you were in Ireland. We could have met up and exchanged info!
patkelleher.net

Basic Strum - Posted - 10/04/2010:  15:33:51

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The banjo with the blonde fretboard is the mystery banjo. As beat-up as the lignum vitae banjo is, it's hard to imagine that Pete leaves it at home when the going gets rough, but maybe that's the role he has consigned the mystery banjo to. To which he has consigned the mystery banjo. Whatever, Pete could make great music on a blue plastic Smurf banjo. Great piece in the Times -- I just learned I've been overcooking corn on the cob for 40 years. Bill

reese158 - Posted - 10/04/2010:  16:25:36

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There is also a third Pete mystery banjo as pictured on Seansvoice's BHO page:

banjohangout.org/myhangout/pho...umid=3051

JonT - Posted - 10/04/2010:  20:05:11

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What interested me about the banjo in those photos was that the pot appears to be the newer 24-bracket item, not the vintage 28-bracket Tubaphone pot.

For what it's worth, in honor of this topic, I will resurrect a piece I wrote a long time ago about how Pete came to invent his long-neck. I'll post it on my BHO blog in about, oh, say, 10 minutes. If you're a long-necker, feel free to check there.

longneckpat - Posted - 10/05/2010:  00:13:04

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Thanks reese 158 and JonT for your posts. Very enlightning!

jan burda - Posted - 03/10/2011:  11:10:05

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The 24 bracket banjo is most likely a Deering ersatz reproduction of a "Pete Seeger" model, first commercially made by Vega. As you probably are aware, Pete had a luthier graft a section in his #2 Tubaphone making the banjo he used for many years. What many are not aware of.....is that Pete" friend, and former business partner of mine, the late Bob Gibson, took the idea to the Nelsons at Vega, and talked them into making the Pete Seeger Model. For the use of his name , Bob told me that Vega gave Pete two banjos. The Vega brand and logo's have been bought and sold several times, including the C.F. Martin Co. Deering is the current owner of the name.

mikehalloran - Posted - 03/13/2011:  22:36:35

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quote:

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Originally posted by jan burda

The 24 bracket banjo is most likely a Deering ersatz reproduction of a "Pete Seeger" model, first commercially made by Vega. As you probably are aware, Pete had a luthier graft a section in his #2 Tubaphone making the banjo he used for many years. What many are not aware of.....is that Pete" friend, and former business partner of mine, the late Bob Gibson, took the idea to the Nelsons at Vega, and talked them into making the Pete Seeger Model. For the use of his name , Bob told me that Vega gave Pete two banjos. The Vega brand and logo's have been bought and sold several times, including the C.F. Martin Co. Deering is the current owner of the name.

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Some of that is almost correct.

The banjo with the grafted neck was not a Vega. It was an Orpheum - later stolen. The luthier was John D'Angelico.

Pete and his friends later modified a number of Bacon 5 strings turning them into long necks but Pete is not known to have played these in public. Bacons had thick, one piece necks making them ideal - they always painted over the Bacon logo but you can see it under strong light. I have seen a few and Marc Silber is an expert on these.

No such thing as a #2 Tubaphone till Deering came out with one. Seeger's most famous banjo started life as a '20s Tubaphone Style 3. The entire neck is home made and is not grafted. I tried to buy the old neck for years.

Bob Gibson, Peggy Seeger and Erik Darling are all credited with convincing Vega to come out with the PS-5. According to Vega, they came up with the idea themselves after making a number of customs - including those for Bob Gibson, Peggy Seeger and Erik Darling... Vega called and asked Pete for permission. Later when they discovered he did not have one, they sent him two. Pete played the blonde one in the '70s. Both were given away as prizes in fund raisers - one for the Clearwater; the other for Sing Out! magazine. The guy who won the Sing Out! contest made a big deal about not getting the blondie not understanding (or believing) that Pete had two.

Alex Hassilev of the Limelighters is credited with "inventing" the Excel version. It is nearly identical to Erik Darling's much earlier custom except for the Deluxe pot on Erik's (Peggy's also has a Deluxe pot). Alex was, no doubt, familiar with Erik's banjo and wanted one like it years later. Blonde necks, geared 5th tuners and Rotomatic tuners were all available without ordering an Excel - I know because I have one like that. The Excel had the 5th tuner up a fret. At least one Folklore was made that way. Moving the tuner up one made it easier to capo up to play in F according to Alex - Shubb capos made that mod unnecessary.

You knew Bob Gibson??? How cool is that??? I only met him once in Chicago (1991 I think).

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Edited by - mikehalloran on 03/13/2011 22:47:02

mainejohn - Posted - 03/14/2011:  04:11:27

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"Seeger's most famous banjo started life as a '20s Tubaphone Style 3. The entire neck is home made and is not grafted. I tried to buy the old neck for years."

...and this was the impression I was under, but in the article "documenting" the history of Pete's longneck which appeared in the Fall 2009 "Fretboard", vol 15, there is a photo on p. 42 of the inside of the pot of Pete's infamous lignum vitae longneck, clearly depicting an early 60's Tubaphone design and serial number A-100050. This pot can't possibly be the original as it was made 6-7 years after the neck was made. Did Pete have the lignum vitae neck moved from the original 20's pot to the one pictured? I'd post the photo but I don't want to violate the copyright.

Basic Strum - Posted - 03/14/2011:  06:33:31

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quote:

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Some of that is almost correct.

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Nice greeting to someone who's making his first contribution to the Hangout, Mike. Then again, sarcasm isn't necessary under any circumstances.

Welcome to the Hangout, Mr. Burda. If you haven't been scared off already, I'm sure your four decades of experience as a banjo builder will benefit many of us who, um, hang out here.

The history and evolution of Pete Seeger's longneck banjos and those of Bob Gibson, Erik Darling and Peggy Seeger is a topic that is rife with misinformation that often gets repeated in public forums such as this one. If you're interested, you can find at least one archived thread that includes a bullet-point list tracing the +2 fret, +3 fret, lignum vitae and Vega longnecks in sequence. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the topic. Bill

BobLusk - Posted - 03/14/2011:  08:23:08

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Another piece of information that may jsut muddy the waters a little is that Ihave been told by people close to Pete that several people have made him long necks as presents - I have seen some that were loaned out to local folkies in the Hudson Valley here. I rememb er one was a blonde, including pot.

reese158 - Posted - 03/17/2011:  18:42:52

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Whatever banjo Bascom Lunsford lent him. A White Laydie, later Lengthened 2. Orpheum #1, later lengthened 3. Lignum Vitae matched to mystery Vega (later Vega #100050). At least two complimentary VPS-5s. A Frank Proffitt. Two mystery banjoes (c. 1990-2011). And let's not forget the one he broke jumping from a train in 1940. Those are the ones that I know about.

I'll bet Pete would think this is a big waste of time. Go sing a union song.

BobLusk - Posted - 03/20/2011:  11:48:39

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Just saw Pete and Peggy last night. He was playing the light colored banjo in the photos posted above. She was playing an old timey "normal neck" banjo with nice inlays. She was also playing a nice 12 fret 00-18 guitar. He had his usual 12 string. It was great hearing them play banjo at the same time. He did a lot of tunes without the banjo capo and a few capoed way up high. He fumbled a few times but still plays and sings great - had the audiance in the palm of his hand.

john bange - Posted - 03/20/2011:  12:29:30

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I envy you. I would love to see and hear them. the odd fumble or two just adds to the show.(at least, that's what I tell myself).
john

Jim Yates - Posted - 03/20/2011:  14:22:03

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What was the long neck with block and dot inlays that Peggy plays? (played?)

Jim Yates - Posted - 03/21/2011:  07:33:25

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This is the one I was asking about:

Peggy Seeger

mainejohn - Posted - 03/21/2011:  15:20:43

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jim Yates

This is the one I was asking about:

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...a pretty and very talented lady playing a very cool Vega longneck. From what I understand, her longneck (and a very similar one built for Bob Gibson), were custom ordered before Vega introduced the more familiar Pete Seeger PS-5 model in the mid/late 50's. Lots of urban legend surround the early Vega longnecks so I'll leave it at that.

BobLusk - Posted - 04/04/2011:  17:00:02

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More details on Pete's blonde banjo. It was made for him by Ralph Storm quite awhile ago. He had loaned it out over the years and just got it back. The neck is some dogwood that was on Pete's property. Pete was having his other banjo worked on recently and starting using the blonde - now plays the blonde about 50% of the time.