oldplayer - Posted - 10/09/2009:  03:22:15

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90% of all banjo players make mistakes - the other 10% are good liars

JasonL - Posted - 10/09/2009:  23:12:12

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If you really want to see the mistakes pile up, try sitting in front of a webcam and recording yourself.

Works for me.

Jason

dinla - Posted - 10/09/2009:  23:47:02

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The first ten years of playing I made many many mistakes...most were made in uncertainity about what I really was going to play in a break, tunes I didn't have written out note for note, and extra added measures in the song that didn't quite fit the break like I had learned it. After a while you get pretty good at playing straight thru a mistake like it isn't one at all.. If you play and smile right thru it, most people never hear it.. and some even think you did something exceptional.. its all in how you act when you make it.

KANINJACK - Posted - 10/10/2009:  05:37:52

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I always thought mistakes were just a form of improv.

Gold Star GF-85 - Posted - 10/10/2009:  05:40:56

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I don't think I ever play without some type of mistake, I just play through them if and when possible.



Big John,
1987 Gibson Earl Scruggs Standard
1986 Stelling Sunflower

alfiedog - Posted - 10/10/2009:  16:21:56

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I think everybody makes mistakes pickin, there is such a small margin for error. A bit like Golf your brain has got to react so fast its unbelievable. The skill is if you come unstuck being able to get back in to the tune, its a very hard skill. On the positive side the more you practice the less mistakes you make. I know it might sound a bit nerdy but i have a list of songs that i play every day, if i make a mistake i make it a rule that i go back to the start of the list of songs. Doing this will soon improve your pickin no end ,stick with it, and monitor the improvement by recording yourself.

SandyR - Posted - 10/11/2009:  00:10:29

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One way I look at this is as "The art of the save." (Term borrowed from athletics.) Not the same as "do it again and people will think it's intentional" (or crack up); rather, if you see the miss coming, make something else out of it. In doing so, you may find yourself doing something interesting (a moment of improvisation) and you can even "learn it from yourself" and keep it in your toolbag.

Sandy

gdoc - Posted - 10/11/2009:  09:23:08

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Mistakes can be your best friend..... I've learned some great improves that way... A mistake means you didn't do it the way you wanted, it doesn't mean it's wrong.

gdoc

JoeZ - Posted - 10/11/2009:  09:36:21

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In two words - heck, yeah.

Squirrels - nature's little speedbumps. Joe Z

Cornflake - Posted - 10/11/2009:  18:01:05

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[quote]Originally posted by barbbanjo

Boy! You guys made my day! I loved every single post and appreciated every one. I think I'll go forward with a lot more confidence in my "mistakes" and perhaps even turn them into opportunities. You guys are a wealth of encouragement and information. Sometimes when I get on BH, as a woman, I feel like before I log on, I subconciously (since I live in the West US) put on my tallest stetson, pull on my cowboy boots, strap on my six shooters, slide on my spurs, bow my legs and swagger into the saloon. Ask for a brew, turn to you sitting next to me and say, "Let's talk banjo." It can be challenging to be a woman in the banjo world sometimes. I've been told to "shut up", "keep up", and I won't say the other thing but for 99% of the time it is great. It's probably kind of how you guys would feel walking into a fabric store. Glad the lady pickers are here, too, and I always look for them. I'm new to BH so thanks for helping out and for letting me vent and ramble. Have a great day.


+++++++++++++++++++++++++


You're right. I HATE walking into fabric stores.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I love my excellent sense of humor. Unfortunately it gets me into trouble, and un-funny people think I'm an idiot.

thetexan - Posted - 10/16/2009:  08:16:30

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Yes, with all modesty, I can play most of my reperatoir without mistake at one time or another. For example, I can play, say, Groundspeed flawlessly 10 times then botch it once or twice.

I think you are asking 'do you get to a point where you never make mistakes'? Even if you mean by that 'on a certain set of your most rehearsed songs' the answer is no. Im sure Bela makes mistakes during a concert. He's just so good at it we don't realize he's done it.

I don't think you will ever get to 100%. Some players are at 50%, others at 80%, and the greats are at 95% or 96% but none hit 100%.

tex

banjer5 - Posted - 10/16/2009:  08:31:46

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YES! I still make them but I practice to minimize them too. I always practice any difficult "lick" many times to try to eliminate mistakes. It still happens. I think its part of the mystique of the banjo to try to play flawless.............it never happens though.

Fast Freddy the engineer says: Throttle in RUN 8 and highball, then don't look back, something might be gainin' on ya. 73,s de K5BGZ

Kenneth Logsdon - Posted - 10/16/2009:  14:32:36

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???Why??? NO!! At least not since I go up this morning.

KL

The KIDD - Posted - 10/16/2009:  14:43:33

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Dang Fred! Its still mystique at 70?..I thought you 2nd genners had it all figured out and just wasnt tellin us young punks....Well Heck, if thats the case Im gonna quit tryin..Put my time to better use for the next 20..

myspace.com/johnkuhnbluegrass

vespababy - Posted - 10/16/2009:  22:28:14

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Hey that whole Banjo in the Hollow story turning into Blackberry Blossom happens to me all the time too! So happy to know I'm not alone. Mistakes? Yeah, I like the creativity pitch!

Vespababy

???????

Cia Cherryholmes - Posted - 10/16/2009:  22:59:51

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I make mistakes all the time. The trick is, as mentioned before, not portraying it on your face...And learning to "save" yourself so that maybe you dont actually make a mistake, you just play it differently than you intended :)

lazyarcher - Posted - 10/16/2009:  23:44:01

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Mistakes...heck yeah!! Anyone who DOSN'T make mistakes is hiding in their own musical safe zone. Stretching into unfamiliar, uncomfortable, unpracticed musical territory is full of risks and mistakes, but also full of growth. I love subing with a band whose material I'm unfamiliar with. You leave a humble but wiser musician...and do you notice that the next day..week..you have a ton of new directions to explore?

Ms.Cherryholmes, I've seen you perform a number of times...and if you make mistakes, you are certainly a master of the save!!

Dave Jack

dpeters - Posted - 10/17/2009:  00:42:16

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I've found some very interesting licks by mistake! And some reall shockers but we won't mention those...

Dave

Nosferatu - Posted - 10/17/2009:  09:20:48

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Do I still make mistakes? Everyday, I burned some pancakes this morning...

The Navaho weave a mistake in the rugs they make and while playing Taps the bugler will make a small mistake, why? Nothing is perfect in life, not even banjo pickers.

Thank you,
"Count" Hugh


"I bent over him, and tried to find any sign of life, but in vain." -- Jonathan Harker, Dracula

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Edited by - Nosferatu on 10/17/2009 09:26:07

sugarinthegourd - Posted - 10/17/2009:  09:29:16

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If you don't make mistakes, you're doing something wrong.

Win a FREE copy of the New Lost City Ramblers' 3-CD retrospective: sugarinthegourd.com

Nosferatu - Posted - 10/17/2009:  09:30:42

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Yes, if you don't make mistakes, you're not human.

Thank you,
"Count" Hugh


"I bent over him, and tried to find any sign of life, but in vain." -- Jonathan Harker, Dracula

stormoveroklahoma - Posted - 10/17/2009:  17:29:19

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every new mistake I make seems to lead to a new lick discovered. Yeah for all the mistakes that got us here.

Storm

Jaminbanjo - Posted - 10/17/2009:  17:41:13

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Everybody makes mistakes, I don't care what they say.

Austin

OleRed - Posted - 11/22/2009:  19:58:20

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quote:

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Originally posted by JasonL

If you really want to see the mistakes pile up, try sitting in front of a webcam and recording yourself.

Works for me.

Jason

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I hear ya! I was just about to say that here. I'm a novice and mistake is my middle name. I make mistakes all the time. Desperately struggling to keep my left hand holding the neck in the right position to. But I tell you what, whenever I get to make them videos, it's a pain in the behind. My hands get sweaty, I get nervous and mistakes kick in hard. I could play a song majestically all day, but when I'm in front of the camera, alone, boom, it's my first day all over again! Funny enough, I've been getting used to picking in front of people, anywhere. The camera still gets me though!

steve davis - Posted - 11/22/2009:  21:02:00

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My mistakes help define my style.

tombrien - Posted - 11/23/2009:  07:10:08

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Ok.......... I agree we all make mistakes.......... but seriously............... someone here earlier in this thread whose name I won't mention said "Earl is not god" .............. and no one has corrected him jest kiddin' Don

Bluegrass - Posted - 11/23/2009:  07:57:23

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I make tons of mistakes.

Glenn Tate - Posted - 11/23/2009:  08:11:23

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I have played and attended many, many bluegrass festivals and events in my 40+ years if picking. I have seen about every big name professional band there is. I have seen the banjo pickers in these bands, start the wrong song, start the song in the wrong key, and make easily recognizable mistakes in their break. They just laugh with everyone, and keep on picking.

And yes, I make mistakes.

banjorino - Posted - 11/23/2009:  08:17:48

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I´ve been playing for 17 years and still make mistakes. But sometimes a mistake sounds better than what was the intention to play. Cheers

minstrelmike - Posted - 11/23/2009:  10:41:02

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Maybe another way to view it is like spelling or punctuation or pronunciation.

I've been typing since 3rd grade.
And even though I've spent 46 years typing stories and songs and articles and letters and emails and flames, I don't think I'd be safe saying that because of my experience, I will never again make any errers.

Mike Moxcey

Dickson - Posted - 11/23/2009:  13:12:38

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I thought I made a mistake once....but I was wrong!

GHohwald - Posted - 11/23/2009:  13:36:02

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I don't know if this applies to your situation but I know that when I am playing for someone new or in a new crowd I start playing the hardest thing that I know, the things that I am working on and haven't quite mastered. I lost the one and only banjo contest I ever entered because I tried to play something that I had not mastered. I've noticed that trying to play above your level is quite common among musicians including beginners and professionals. I seems to be an automatic response unless you do something to counter act it. I have a friend who is an excellent banjo player and every time he picks up the banjo try's to play this lick that he cannot play. It is unclear and out of time. One day he did this and I asked him to play a simpler version and he nailed it. This same person has told me on several occasions that when I play simply and focus on timing that it sounds great and people comment on how great it sounds. This generally happens when there are seasoned musicians in the crowd that I would be embarrassed if I played something that was in bad taste or that I made significant mistakes. Typically when this happens and I get positive feedback my reality is that I did not play anything out of the ordinary and that I am almost embarrassed by the lack of hot licks. On the other hand when I try to play these hard hot licks apparently I loose timing and drive and it does not sound good at all. So in conclusion if you feel good and are not distracted and are "one" with the music and are playing things that you have played a lot before your mistakes will be minimal. On the other hand if you are distracted, nervous and when making a mistake criticize yourself mentally, you are more likely to make additional mistakes. uote]Originally posted by barbbanjo

I know I'm not a terrific banjo picker but I never seem to play a tune without making mistakes. I have tunes that I have played for years and I always make at least one mistake if not more when I play them. One time I'll miss a note here or there or a pull off or hammer or slide won't be just right. When I listen to other people play I don't hear bunches of mistakes. I've learned how to practice correctly from going to banjo camp, etc. so I don't think that's it. Do any of you have this problem?


[/quote]

5stringpicker2 - Posted - 11/23/2009:  14:30:29

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Been playing 40 years or more both as a pro and a park'n lot picker and believe you me mistakes will happen. There are several videos on youtube of ole Earl making some good ones if it's ok for him it's ok for you.

(I )===='---<::)

mdhokie - Posted - 11/23/2009:  15:16:11

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Play it once its a mistake, play it twice and its jazz.

Bassora - Posted - 11/23/2009:  17:08:33

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There's a book called "There Is No Such Thing As A Mistake" (I Was Only Trying Something........).

Actually, there's a famous quote by Miles Davis. "Do not fear mistakes. There are no mistakes in jazz."

Personally, I don't think there's mistakes in traditional music. There's simply a new variation on an old tune.
Actually, some of our arrangements have come out of mistakes. So don't think of mistakes as a bad thing.
Sometimes I think we play mostly obscure tunes (at least obscure to the unknowledgeable) so that if we make a mistake no one will notice.
That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

Bassora -- still pluckin' near the Big Mo

Jim T - Posted - 11/23/2009:  19:03:47

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Boy, what a comforting thread knowing I'm not alone in this mistake business. With that in mind, I've been working hard on being able to keep the tune going in my head so that when I make a mistake I can get back in some place further along. Playi,ng with the metronome or with a backup track is helping a lot with this.

Jim

Couchie - Posted - 11/23/2009:  20:42:05

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I make more mistakes now than I used to.

arnie fleischer - Posted - 11/24/2009:  16:29:20

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All the time.

gkella - Posted - 11/24/2009:  17:05:15

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I saw Bela Fleck and Edgar Meyer a couple of months ago.
I was sitting within five feet of them.
Bela made a couple of mistakes and when he did, he looked over at Edgar and you could see by the look on Edgar's face that Bela had screwed up.
That doesn't take away from the fact they are two of the most talented musicians on the planet.
If they can make mistakes, I think we can accept the fact we are going to mess up as well.
Glen

PruchaLegend - Posted - 11/24/2009:  21:12:46

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Victor Borge, concert pianist and comedian, said that all the notes he missed were enough to play an entire concert.
Me? I don't make mistakes. I play variations. You just have to learn the difference between "variation" and "mistake."

PruchaLegend - Posted - 11/24/2009:  21:13:41

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Victor Borge, concert pianist and comedian, said that all the notes he missed were enough to play an entire concert.
Me? I don't make mistakes. I play variations. You just have to learn the difference between "variation" and "mistake."

sawyer 12 - Posted - 11/24/2009:  21:49:15

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When I was first learning to play, I had this habit of stopping when I made a mistake. This was because I didn't know how to recover. My banjo teacher Haskell McCormick told me if I make a mistake while on stage to grin and keep on playing, that most people won't know the difference or will think you did it on purpose, lol.
Now after 30 years I still make lots of mistakes but I keep the roll going. Sure, its noticed, but not as bad as if I shook my head in disgust.

5-stringreiny - Posted - 11/25/2009:  05:41:53

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Mistakes?? I prefer to call them simple "variations!"

rhazelbaker - Posted - 11/25/2009:  09:07:37

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From the time my feet hit the floor in the morning, but dosn't it make life and music exciting!!!

cottontop - Posted - 11/25/2009:  10:02:58

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I make them all the time. The trick is to not let anyone else know that you did. I once saw Gordon Lightfoot at a concert, and he completely forgot the next verse of a song (which he wrote BTW), so he just made up some lines and kept the song going. After the song, he laughed and said, "Another new verse to an old song." If he had not said that, only his true ardent followers would have known.
I like what the late PBS artist/teacher Bob Ross used to say, "We don't make mistakes, we just have happy accidents."
cottontop

thomass - Posted - 11/25/2009:  11:18:29

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I'm a beginner...if it weren't for mistakes I wouldn't have anything at all !!

old7 - Posted - 11/25/2009:  17:20:49

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I used to worry about it a lot and it would really bother me when i made a mistake. Even when I was playing to n one but myself. Then a good friend told me to learn to recover on the fly and play right through them. Now they sound like part of the tune. It's hard to find two banjoist who play the same song the same way. Learn to play through the mistakes and don't worry about it.

Lexingtrick - Posted - 11/27/2009:  17:30:48

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Mistakes? Huh, it takes and engineer to make em. I just play mistakes. How about laughing at them. Isn't it funny to see them fingers go the wrong way. It's like ''Hey are they drunk, look at them walk.'' Something like that. Always have fun even when you playing right or wrong (mistakes).

For concentration? Try standing up in front of the TV (sitting down if you want) with a interesting show or movie then turn up the volume so you can hear both. Play all you need to play and looking at the TV. If your playing upper notes look once in awhyle. But the goal is to be able to have noise and image distration and perform at the same time. You can try to turn around or look away of the screen. I haven't try that yet. Just and ideal.

stanger - Posted - 11/27/2009:  18:14:18

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After 47 years of playing, I still make them all the time. The only thing that changes are the mistakes, for me became more complicated. Sometimes now, I have to slow waay down and disect my playing, often one note at a time, just to discover why I blow out at speed. Sometimes, it's the left hand fingering, sometimes it's the right hand.
And bad old habits just grow worse with age, believe me. Even when I know I'm doing something that's going to cause me problems and create mistakes, I will still do it on auto-pilot, even when I'm fully aware of the problem and try consciously to correct it.
regards,
stanger