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Originally posted by MrNatch3L

Follow up to a previous post about a pristine little Fender FB55 I got a recently good deal on.

I've got the head and tailpiece set to where the banjo is sounding surprisingly good with the stock 1/2" bridge. The action is a bit high at the 12th and I'm thinking what to do. So, 2 questions.

1) I was taught that coordinator rods are not for adjusting the action, but this single one is a type I'm not familiar with. Could this type be used to adjust the neck angle? If so, how does it work?

2) I'm also wondering about the screw in the heel. It was very loose when I got the banjo and so was the neck against the rim. The screw snugged the neck and rim, but is that all it's for? Might it also affect the neck angle? Don't want to mess with it until I know.

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I guess I was under the impression that is exactly what you do with the coordinator rods, adjust the action.  Deering has a video showing how to do that.

That said, I had a Morgan Monroe with a single coordinator rod exactly like that one. I turned it every which way and it did nothing. I finally cut a shim from a piece of plastic, loosened the neck, and put the shim up toward the top of the neck. That brought the head of the neck back and lowered the string height a bit. It was okay then, but I ended up selling the banjo and decided that I probably won't buy another banjo with just a single coordinator rod. One word of caution, do not remove that screw in the heel there with string tension on the neck. I learned that the hard way.

What's the function of the screw in the ^^ heel?

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Originally posted by MrNatch3L

1) I was taught that coordinator rods are not for adjusting the action, but this single one is a type I'm not familiar with. Could this type be used to adjust the neck angle? If so, how does it work?

2) I'm also wondering about the screw in the heel. It was very loose when I got the banjo and so was the neck against the rim. The screw snugged the neck and rim, but is that all it's for? Might it also affect the neck angle? Don't want to mess with it until I know.

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This is the most basic one rod neck connection. While rods are not really for changing neck angle, except very slight adjustments, this tpye of design is definately not for doing any such adjustments. It would work exacyly as any other rod adjustment if it was attempted.

The screw is there to provide the co-ordinator rod with something to pull against to hold the neck tight. The general principle it not to touch the screw although it should be tight. The way the rod pulls against the screw means that the screw can get a bit bent and weak in the middle and people who try to take them out end up with a broken screw. I did this when I was innocent and naive and others have had the same result. You don't need to remove it to remove the neck. If this was required the rod will divide by turning the big turnbuckle nut after loosing up the tailpiece end nuts.

As Graham said, the heel screw is just a “pin” that holds the neck stud inside the neck heel. The big nut inside the rim, holds the neck to the rim. The turnbuckle lengthens or shortens the co-rod. There is no neck angle adjustment with this set up.

However, the rim hole is probably slotted “elongated”, so that you can slide the neck either higher or lower (closer or further from the strings) on the rim. I don’t know if the FB55 Rim hole is slotted in this manner, but the bottle cap banjos are, and this is how you adjust the action on them. This is also how action is adjusted on a Deering Boston model. Slack the strings, and loosen the big nut inside and against the rim, and see if you can slide the neck higher on the rim, to lower the action. The co-rod on this type of banjo doesn’t adjust action, it just keeps the rim round under string tension. In fact, it may be worth using a ruler, and checking the roundness of the rim. If someone in the past tightened or loosened the co-rod too much, the rim might be out of round.

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Originally posted by Owen

What's the function of the screw in the ^^ heel?

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As Graham said, it is a screw with a long shank that goes through a hole in the coordinator rod where it comes through the rim and into the heel of the neck there. It essentially holds the neck up against the rim when you tighten that nut on the single rod.

The nut that is where the bolt and rim join from the neck is redundant in my experience with the long turnbuckle nut on banjos. The long nut should hold the neck and rim together unless there is something going on not apparent in the photo. Back the long part of the rod toward the tailpiece completely out of the turnbuckle. Tighten the turnbuckle snug up against the neck/rim joint. Don't overtighten. Now come back and thread the tailpiece end of rod into the turnbuckle up to the point where you have enough of the threaded rod outside the rim and under tailpiece to get that nut on the rod. Tighten the inside and outside nut at the tailpiece end to stabilize the rod and keep it from backing out of the turnbuckle. Done properly, this will keep the rim in the neutral state and not egg it while holding the neck securely to the pot.

Bobby

Great tip about the elongated rim hole - thank you! I loosened the strings a bit before trying it. Now the action is like butter. I then had to add a little more head tension and crank the tailpiece a tad. I'd already checked rim roundness and it was good. 

Now it needs a little relief in the neck - hopefully the truss rod is ok. I'm thinking this banjo was never set up and that's why the seller unloaded it. It's playing and sounding much better than I expected from a low end banjo with a rolled brass ring. I think it's worth a better bridge.

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Originally posted by Dean T

As Graham said, the heel screw is just a “pin” that holds the neck stud inside the neck heel. The big nut inside the rim, holds the neck to the rim. The turnbuckle lengthens or shortens the co-rod. There is no neck angle adjustment with this set up.

However, the rim hole is probably slotted “elongated”, so that you can slide the neck either higher or lower (closer or further from the strings) on the rim. I don’t know if the FB55 Rim hole is slotted in this manner, but the bottle cap banjos are, and this is how you adjust the action on them. This is also how action is adjusted on a Deering Boston model. Slack the strings, and loosen the big nut inside and against the rim, and see if you can slide the neck higher on the rim, to lower the action. The co-rod on this type of banjo doesn’t adjust action, it just keeps the rim round under string tension. In fact, it may be worth using a ruler, and checking the roundness of the rim. If someone in the past tightened or loosened the co-rod too much, the rim might be out of round.

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Fantastic news! I’ve fixed up several goodwill banjos to pass on to students, and have encountered this set up several times. It’s pretty simple once you understand it. Congratulations on bringing a nice banjo back to life!

Attached is a PDF file of a 1932 Gibson catalog. If you scroll down to page 7 of the catalog (page 5 of the PDF file), you'll find a brief explanation of the purpose of the coordinator rods on Gibson banjos.

I scoured the internet looking for photos of the neck set up, and this is the best I could find. The neck stud has a hole in the end. You stick the stud the neck heel, and then run that screw from the bottom, through the hole. Then install the neck on the pot, and tighten the nut. The problem with this set up, is the screw that holds the stud in the neck, bends when you tighten the nut. And then over time, with stress, string pressure, and bumps and bangs, it bends more, and the neck gets loose. Then if someone tries to “tighten” the screw, the bent part actually acts like a cam, and may draw the neck tight. But this is iffy at best, and you never know when it will turn, or bend again, and loosen up. Whenever I encounter this set up, I remove the screw and stud. Measure the depth of the screw hole, and diameter of the hole in the stud, and then go to ACE Hardware, and get a nice stainless steel shank bolt of the proper size. Then I’ll drill out the screw hole in the neck, to the size of the shank bolt. Then when I put it all back together, I can get the neck to pot joint nice and tight, and not worry about some chincy screw bending.

Here's what the whole set-up looks like.  

On the "horizontal" image the stud and screw  on the left-hand side are what is in the heel of the neck