Practice with backing tracks. That will give you more skills needed for ensemble playing (starting/stopping at the right time, playing with consistent tempo and volume, playing through mistakes).

quote:

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Originally posted by JDE4570

I am catching the Irish music bug and want to attend a session. So far my strategy has been to listen to a trad music radio, and when I hear a nice tune, go to thesession.org to get the sheet music and try to work on it until I can play without the sheet music.

How do I start developing my skills enough to play at an Irish session. I think playing with others is my weakness in general. I plan on attending a slow session to start but the session I want to end at, they recommended getting about 50 tunes down before starting. (These guys are experienced)

I am a 5 string player. Used to read music regularly a long time ago which is coming back quicker than I thought. I feel like I am stuck in the awkward experienced beginner phase. What advice would you give me.

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Do what you did to become proficient on your other instrument.  While reading skills will help absorb as many tunes as you can commit to memory, it's much better play along in order to get a grip on stylistic bits like musical phrasing, common ornaments, and harmonic structure.  Learn to play accompaniment using the ascending and descending harmonic scale (harmonized scale in triads) because this is so commonly done in Irish session music.  Playing accompaniment and not embarrassing yourself is your key to happiness.  Oh, and play in tune and in time.

quote:

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Originally posted by Eulalie

quote:

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Originally posted by JDE4570

I am catching the Irish music bug and want to attend a session. So far my strategy has been to listen to a trad music radio, and when I hear a nice tune, go to thesession.org to get the sheet music and try to work on it until I can play without the sheet music.

How do I start developing my skills enough to play at an Irish session. I think playing with others is my weakness in general. I plan on attending a slow session to start but the session I want to end at, they recommended getting about 50 tunes down before starting. (These guys are experienced)

I am a 5 string player. Used to read music regularly a long time ago which is coming back quicker than I thought. I feel like I am stuck in the awkward experienced beginner phase. What advice would you give me.

---

Do what you did to become proficient on your other instrument.  While reading skills will help absorb as many tunes as you can commit to memory, it's much better play along in order to get a grip on stylistic bits like musical phrasing, common ornaments, and harmonic structure.  Learn to play accompaniment using the ascending and descending harmonic scale (harmonized scale in triads) because this is so commonly done in Irish session music.  Playing accompaniment and not embarrassing yourself is your key to happiness.  Oh, and play in tune and in time.

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I think one of my short-term goals, so that I can play in tune will be to get a better banjo. I’m currently playing on a cheap one with a pot assembly made of plastic… while functional does not sound so great. Seems like I can never position the bridge just right and the open strings never match up with the fretted notes

I made that same transition a few years ago, coming from five years of online clawhammer lessons with Adam Hurt. I switched to tenor banjo because it seemed so much easier to break into local Irish sessions than to find a welcoming old time jam session in the area. After starting in a slow Irish session, and much as I love banjo, I decided to try mandolin, which worked out really well. I was much more comfortable with the mandolin while working on repertoire and easing my way into the sessions. The mandolin is not as loud as the banjo so mistakes aren't as apparent, but I can still hear myself easily enough. Plus, with so much Irish music played on fiddle, the mandolin gets you in the same octave when picking up new tunes by ear. The fingering is a little different for most people between banjo and mandolin, but there is a huge amount of carryover between the two. I think time spent on the mandolin will only improve your progress on the banjo and session playing. Sorry if this is heresy to my banjo friends!

Once you have the basics down, then it's time go to go jams. Sit in the back, watch the rhythm guitar picker. That will show you what chord is being played. Don't play guitar? Get a guitar picker to show you some basic chords: G, C, D, A, and maybe a couple more. Then watch and try to strum along. Eventually, you'll begin to hear a chord change and as you get better, you'll learn to anticipate them. When you feel good about following along, try to take a break on your own. If you mess up, so what, it's not the end of the world. Just try to play through it, grin, make a joke about it and go on.

The more you play with others, the easier it becomes and the easier it is to hear musical phrases that can be played for many songs.

There is no easy or quick way. The banjo is used for melody in an Irish trad session so you have to know the tunes. Some people can pick up and retain the tunes faster than other people. A slow session is the perfect place to start. It's also helpful to have friends who play the music that you can get together with outside of the session. The more opportunities you have to play the better. I'm lucky that my wife (fiddle player) and I started at the same time. It took us about 3 years to get where we were ready to go to a session. We don't have any sessions near us and really only had the opportunity to go to a session once a month. We would write the tune names down of tunes we didn't know and learn a few before the next session. We became good friends with the regulars and they were happy to play some sets that we recently learned. Fast forward a few years and now my wife and I run the sessions in our town. We play weekly in our house and have 2 public sessions. The first hour in our house is when we will play any tune(s) that people want to play slower or need help with. This has really helped grow the music in our little town. It's a lot of work but it's worth it when you experience the euphoric feeling of a great session.

Get a tenor banjo tuned to Irish tuning so that your are in the same domain as the fiddle but an octave lower and don’t worry about chords because there’s no standard chord progressions during most Irish tunes

I use a lyrics sheet with the chord transitions labelled, then adapt my tempo to those playing. Its not hard to strump or roll chords quietly in the background.

Even though there is a long tradition of playing Irish tunes on the 5-string banjo, you'll find most sessions to be unwelcoming toward the instrument. Few people today are aware of the classic style banjo tradition that once flourished in Ireland.

Getting a decent instrument is always top goal to have if you have one that is not worthy.  If this is the state of the instrument you play,  I doubt you can even be the judge of what progress you are or are not making.  Not serious if you dont prioritize that

quote:Few people are aware of the classic or the guitar style banjo tradition that once flourished in all kinds of music in the USA either.

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Originally posted by csacwp

Even though there is a long tradition of playing Irish tunes on the 5-string banjo, you'll find most sessions to be unwelcoming toward the instrument. Few people today are aware of the classic style banjo tradition that once flourished in Ireland.

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JDE4570
Something that helped me a lot when I was learning to flat pick Irish tunes on guitar was learning the tunes by ear using a slow downer app. Takes a bit of patience but pays off in the end. Recommend immersing yourself in the music, listening especially to the music you record from the local session. Each geographical area will have their own interpretation of a tune.
If you’re using sheet music, “dots” hum the tune while playing it. Learning and hearing the 6/8 jig style may take a bit of time.
I think having a beginner’s mind set is an advantage, keeps us curious and open minded. You are in for a wonderful journey, enjoy the process.

A lot of Irish sessions follow idea of sets of 3 or 4 tunes; 3 times thru each tune then onto the next... so go through a lot of tunes. It is much more either know the tune or don't.

Mostly by ear. A general familiarization with the vast repertoire, listen a lot to typical session tunes. Diddle along. So that as hear these tunes being played, at least your mind audiates it, already recognizes how it goes, sound wise; should be able to hum/diddle along. That can take a while, but more you do this the faster you will build up mental library. Playing by ear, in this context, is the ability to have fingers respond to what you can audiate. That is a skill that develop, and there are some things that help. I find top-down music theory and schema work well.

Start going to the local session, mostly to listen to what they play. As each can have their own style and common sets. Talk to them, tell them your goal, ask for good sets to start with, ones they play often; ask if can record them, so learn how they play it as the model. Might also ask for recommendation of other musicians recordings that they have used as model; to get sense of their style.

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Originally posted by Texasbanjo

Once you have the basics down, then it's time go to go jams. Sit in the back, watch the rhythm guitar picker. That will show you what chord is being played. Don't play guitar? Get a guitar picker to show you some basic chords: G, C, D, A, and maybe a couple more. Then watch and try to strum along. Eventually, you'll begin to hear a chord change and as you get better, you'll learn to anticipate them. When you feel good about following along, try to take a break on your own. If you mess up, so what, it's not the end of the world. Just try to play through it, grin, make a joke about it and go on.

The more you play with others, the easier it becomes and the easier it is to hear musical phrases that can be played for many songs.

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The OP was asking the question in the context of Irish music.  So, I'm going to take gentle exception to a few aspects of Sherry's post.  ITM (Irish Traditional Music) is not played in "jams".  It's played in sessions, by folks who are serious about Irish traditional music.  In sessions, if you don't know the tune (they are tunes, not songs), then it is expected that you will sit out and listen.  If you do attempt the melody, do so softly until and unless you have it down.  Further, in ITM sessions musicians do not play "breaks". That's for Bluegrass.  And strumming along with chords on a banjo is just not done. 

Just mentioning these things to save you from wondering why you are getting strange looks, negative comments and/or folks running to the bar.

Lastly, if you want to really go deep into ITM, get a 4-string tuned GDAE.  

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Originally posted by NotABanjoYoda

I use a lyrics sheet with the chord transitions labelled, then adapt my tempo to those playing. Its not hard to strump or roll chords quietly in the background.

See my post above.  With respect, at a serious ITM session, do not strum or roll chords on the banjo.  At least not without asking permission and/or studying carefully the unwritten rules of the particular session.  I've witnessed strumming and rolling on the 5-string being done at an Irish session, and the same night I witnessed the gentleman politely being informed later that it was not to be done again. 

Nah ^^^^^^^^^^^

Going to a serious ITM session sounds like it could harsh ones mellow.

I did once play with a really uptight irishman years ago (his last name was O` Sullivan anyways). That guy texted me for 6 months asking when our next group practise was. His thesis on etiquette rejected. Shame because his prs rocked.

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Originally posted by Matt Buckley

quote:

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Originally posted by Texasbanjo

Once you have the basics down, then it's time go to go jams. Sit in the back, watch the rhythm guitar picker. That will show you what chord is being played. Don't play guitar? Get a guitar picker to show you some basic chords: G, C, D, A, and maybe a couple more. Then watch and try to strum along. Eventually, you'll begin to hear a chord change and as you get better, you'll learn to anticipate them. When you feel good about following along, try to take a break on your own. If you mess up, so what, it's not the end of the world. Just try to play through it, grin, make a joke about it and go on.

The more you play with others, the easier it becomes and the easier it is to hear musical phrases that can be played for many songs.

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The OP was asking the question in the context of Irish music.  So, I'm going to take gentle exception to a few aspects of Sherry's post.  ITM (Irish Traditional Music) is not played in "jams".  It's played in sessions, by folks who are serious about Irish traditional music.  In sessions, if you don't know the tune (they are tunes, not songs), then it is expected that you will sit out and listen.  If you do attempt the melody, do so softly until and unless you have it down.  Further, in ITM sessions musicians do not play "breaks". That's for Bluegrass.  And strumming along with chords on a banjo is just not done. 

Just mentioning these things to save you from wondering why you are getting strange looks, negative comments and/or folks running to the bar.

Lastly, if you want to really go deep into ITM, get a 4-string tuned GDAE.  

 

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Thank you for the information.   I didn't know that Irish traditional music was so different from bluegrass. 

quote:

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Originally posted by JDE4570

I am catching the Irish music bug and want to attend a session. So far my strategy has been to listen to a trad music radio, and when I hear a nice tune, go to thesession.org to get the sheet music and try to work on it until I can play without the sheet music.

How do I start developing my skills enough to play at an Irish session. I think playing with others is my weakness in general. I plan on attending a slow session to start but the session I want to end at, they recommended getting about 50 tunes down before starting. (These guys are experienced)

I am a 5 string player. Used to read music regularly a long time ago which is coming back quicker than I thought. I feel like I am stuck in the awkward experienced beginner phase. What advice would you give me.

---

Hi~
 I have found Enda Scahill's site IrishBanjoLessons.com to be a great resource> There are many many lessons available that offer something for every one. It also has a very active discord component with a welcoming community that Enda regularly comments and offers ideas.  
Well worth the  small investment.

 George R.

Just to be clear, Enda is all about ITM on 4-string. The OP plays 5-string.

Matt

I’ve got a couple of 5 stringers on my lessons and they use the transcriptions and knock out some awesome music!

quote:

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Originally posted by NotABanjoYoda

Nah ^^^^^^^^^^^

Going to a serious ITM session sounds like it could harsh ones mellow.

I did once play with a really uptight irishman years ago (his last name was O` Sullivan anyways). That guy texted me for 6 months asking when our next group practise was. His thesis on etiquette rejected. Shame because his prs rocked.

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It is the same as any sort of "club" or group.  You need to blend in to their culture, both musically and socially.  Anybody who is respectful and doesn't stand out too much is welcome.  

Sounds like you're already on the road to success. It's like the man said when I asked him how to get to Carnegie Hall: "Practice, practice, practice." When you do feel ready to go to the jam session don't expect too much of yourself the first time, that is, don't expect perfection. A jam can and should be a learning experience as well as a fun time out with other musicians. There may be songs you don't know. They may play a slightly different version of a particular tune. If you play any other instruments, watch the other players' fingers to see what chords they're playing. You can always vamp thru a tune you're not familiar with or don't know at all. You may surprise yourself and catch on quickly once a tune comes around to repeat itself. Enjoy it!

quote:

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Originally posted by JDE4570

quote:

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Originally posted by Eulalie

quote:

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Originally posted by JDE4570

I am catching the Irish music bug and want to attend a session. So far my strategy has been to listen to a trad music radio, and when I hear a nice tune, go to thesession.org to get the sheet music and try to work on it until I can play without the sheet music.

How do I start developing my skills enough to play at an Irish session. I think playing with others is my weakness in general. I plan on attending a slow session to start but the session I want to end at, they recommended getting about 50 tunes down before starting. (These guys are experienced)

I am a 5 string player. Used to read music regularly a long time ago which is coming back quicker than I thought. I feel like I am stuck in the awkward experienced beginner phase. What advice would you give me.

---

Do what you did to become proficient on your other instrument.  While reading skills will help absorb as many tunes as you can commit to memory, it's much better play along in order to get a grip on stylistic bits like musical phrasing, common ornaments, and harmonic structure.  Learn to play accompaniment using the ascending and descending harmonic scale (harmonized scale in triads) because this is so commonly done in Irish session music.  Playing accompaniment and not embarrassing yourself is your key to happiness.  Oh, and play in tune and in time.

---

I think one of my short-term goals, so that I can play in tune will be to get a better banjo. I’m currently playing on a cheap one with a pot assembly made of plastic… while functional does not sound so great. Seems like I can never position the bridge just right and the open strings never match up with the fretted notes

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Deering. American made. Any model will be an improvement. Check Reverb.com , you might find one there for a fair price. I did pick up an Americana in outstanding condition on craigslist for a song. Many people buy the dream of playing banjo, only to have them sit in a case in the closet. Good luck.

There are no shortcuts to anything. Also, you failed to list your location. For instance, it would be much easier were you in Dublin, Ireland than the sticks of west coast, USA! The easiest way I can think of to learn Irish music would be to sell everything you own & move to Dublin. Purchase a tenor banjo & start hanging around with people who play Irish music.

Coming late to this discussion so my only thought, since all the previous posters have pretty much said it all, is that you have to expect to be frustrated for many months and accept that frustration as part of your process of learning the instrument and the music. It really doesn’t matter what genre of traditional music you want to play on banjo: Irish, Old Time, Trad Jazz, and any others (at one time I was having fun learning how to play along with Ali Farke Toure who comes from a totally different tradition.

The point is to have fun! Enjoy the learning experience. I am 72 and am totally enjoying continuing to learn tunes on 4-string banjo CGDA tuning. Mostly chordal accompaniment for “traditional” jazz but also for Old Time. And, now I am learning how to play octave mandolin tuned GDAD to play Irish and Breton and even Old Time tunes. I accept I’ll never reach the skill and performance level of so many of you but just to be able to play and enjoy the music is what is important to me.

But, that is just me.