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Jan 12, 2025 - 3:01:09 PM
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195 posts since 4/19/2024

I’ve been a frustrated new player for a while. I’m n = 1 as a clinical study so all of my thoughts are merely anecdotal but here is what has and has not worked for me:

What has helped:
Having a 1:1 instructor weekly. My instructor is virtual but she has been spectacular at helping me improve. Her name is Hilarie Burhans and she has both a Patreon and virtual 1:1 instruction.

Strum machine. This subscription lets me take 90 percent of banjo tunes and have a backup that I have to follow along with. It lets you pick any tuning and then set the speed. I go very slow.

Practicing in between measures. A key problem I have had is getting good (through thousands of reps of single measure) at playing that measure. I wasn’t able to transition to the next one without a pause. Starting the practice in the middle of a measure and going to the middle of the next one helped me practice the transitions.

Thousands of reps. I’m a huge fan of writing things hundreds or thousands of times to memorize them and I love the simplicity of playing one measure a thousand times, 5x a day until I just know it so well it’s a reflex. It’s not playing a song, it’s getting the part down that I have trouble with. I once read about Larry Bird breaking the court up from the baseline to the free throw in 1/2 inch marks and making himself shoot 10 in a row from each starting at the baseline and if he missed one he started over. I’ve always enjoyed that kind of stuff whether it’s playing chess, learning math or biology, learning to sketch or now playing banjo. The repetitive nature is meditative to me.

Saying notes while I play them. I like to know the notes that make up each chord and what notes I’m playing so I write them out and I make sure I know what each one is. It’s a goal of mine to understand music theory as well as play music.

Playing with other beginners. When I play with others who are just starting out whether it’s guitar or banjo mandoline and bass as a group we really develop an understanding of playing.

Practicing techniques over and over. Bum ditty, drop thumb, slides, hammers, pull offs, and patterns practiced over and over and over helped me a lot. Learning to hit any string with either index or middle finger cleanly helped me a great deal.

What hasn’t worked for me

Playing in jam sessions with experts. They’re simply too good, the songs are not easy to understand, the key isn’t know and the groups I’ve been to have not been forgiving at all of beginners even though it was open. Learning to play isn’t something that’s done well with groups of people who already play music well at least for me.

Brainjo. I tried it for three months and it was much too overwhelming and confusing. The no picker left behind felt like a guessing game and I just couldn’t follow what was going on. I didn’t get though a single song with it.

Nashville numbering. It took me so long to get it and when I finally just sat and memorized every key and every sequence I was finally able to get the pattern. It’s way easier for me to just know what three actual chords exist and what notes make up those chords than to memorize the 1-4-5 or other sequence. It just didn’t make sense to me so I internalize it, make sure I know the chords and learn where they are played.

Hearing chord changes. I’m so terrible at this I can’t even begin to describe it. That aspect of music just doesn’t sound right to me and I know this is just me. I can see it in strum machine, I can see when it occurs in tab but I have no idea when it occurs in a song and I really can’t hear it. I try with songs at church and at the cars, even happy birthday or listening to my teacher and I’m hopeless but that’s just me. I’ve learned to memorize the chord changes from playing the song and that works for me.

Trying to pick up a song by just watching and listening. I have a mental block about this one. If I hear a note or a strum or a bum ditty I think that I have a random guess of five strings and 18 frets and I better hope I’m lucky. I just haven’t been able to hear something and know hot it breaks out into notes.


Accomplishments:

Last year from Feb through end of year I missed 16 days of practice giving me 316 days. Besides the missed days my shortest days of practice was 18 min and my longest was a marathon 2 hours and 35 min. I have a graph of minutes per day in my planner.

I had a total amount of practice of 147 hours and 28 minutes which averages to 28 min per day for those days I didn’t miss. 16 days were zero. I have learned 6 songs and two of them I can play quite well anytime. I also learned to tune my instrument quickly with the tuner and I memorized all of the major and minor tunings so I can get to them quickly with the tuner. I also memorized every chord pattern major minor and in between for each of the major and minor tunings so that I can find them anywhere on the neck.

Next year I have some goals that I shared with my teacher and I’m tracking them. I’ve definitely gotten to know my instrument and definitely learned some patterns and have begun to understand how songs are put together.

Jan 13, 2025 - 3:19:51 AM

695 posts since 3/9/2013

With that kind of dedication it will all come.
It’s funny that things I thought I’d never get I got somewhere along the way. Not sure I know when even.
I’ve been playing for a lot of years and still consider myself a beginner. I think I always will be unless I run into a group of like minded people to regularly jam with. You really need others to get over humps in my opinion.
I second your opinion on Hilarie. I wish I was as dedicated as you and could fully utilize her teachings.
Sounds like you’re on the right track!

Jan 13, 2025 - 4:43:06 AM
Players Union Member

Eric A

USA

1951 posts since 10/15/2019

I congratulate you on your drive to objectively document every step on your journey.

Jan 13, 2025 - 6:08:56 AM
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233 posts since 6/22/2016

Interesting documentation of a 21st-century approach to learning music. As a teacher, two things surfaced in reading the run down of a year's investment in learning without in-person human interaction.

1) I have read somewhere that 70% of communication is non-verbal. Although I teach on-line, it's just a fact that in-person instruction is much more beneficial. A live lesson will allow the teacher to spot mechanical issues with finger movement and placement and impart meaningful corrections to technique.

2) There simply is no replacement for playing with people. It's sad to hear that available sessions are not accommodating for beginners, but that seems to be a common problem in this age where everyone is an expert because they're watched yucktube videos. In fact, the sad sessions in my area are rife with beginners who think they are experts, but who should really be striving to improve. But playing with people is the way to absorb all the things about playing music that simply can't be described in words.

For whatever reasons, we are being trained to isolate and be suspicious of our neighbors. Couple this factor with the 21st-century tendency to flee from a situation where a learner might make a mistake in front of other people, and you have a recipe for the end of social music.

My advice: Find nice people to play music with and don't be afraid to make mistakes. That's how we learn.

Jan 13, 2025 - 6:47:16 AM

ELittle

USA

5 posts since 3/9/2024

+1 for Strum Machine. Really great tool for beginners as it's like a musical metronome. It helps you play in time while at the same time making you feel like you're playing real music even when you're playing Cripple Creek at 40 bpm.

Jan 13, 2025 - 7:36:02 AM
Players Union Member

Rusty

USA

264 posts since 1/9/2007

Excellent job, I learned something new too, I had never heard of the Nashville Numbering System and I ahve been playing banjo, guitar and other instruments since 1979.
In regard to playing at a jam, I had the same experience, so I organized a jam I called "Dare to Suck", all levels welcome but focused on newer folks and we played all genre of music, e.g., country, old time, bluegrass, rock, blues, shanty tunes etc. People were encouraged to bring music for everyone, the focus was fun, many sessions we sounded great, others we sucked but had a great time! This is folk music, not a performance.
Keep up the great work, you have an awesome teacher with Hilary.
Go busking, you get better by playing in front of people and with people.

Jan 13, 2025 - 7:53:44 AM

Owen

Canada

16497 posts since 6/5/2011

Geez Rusty... busking?!?!?  IF I put some starter/seed money in my case, I expect that toot de sweet, passers-by would help themselves and still think they'd gotten a raw deal!!  devil

Jan 13, 2025 - 7:54:02 AM
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1515 posts since 1/26/2011

You have the determination necessary to play the banjo. I’ve been learning for 14 years now. Ive recorded how much I practice every day for all 14 years. I’ve gotten good enough to play in several bands. I tell people all the time that I’m not talented, just determined. Keep at it. You’ve got what it takes!!!

Jan 13, 2025 - 8:05:16 AM
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195 posts since 4/19/2024

quote:
Originally posted by Rusty


In regard to playing at a jam, I had the same experience, so I organized a jam I called "Dare to Suck", all levels welcome but focused on newer folks and we played all genre of music, e.g., country, old time, bluegrass, rock, blues, shanty tunes etc. People were encouraged to bring music for everyone, the focus was fun, many sessions we sounded great, others we sucked but had a great time! This is folk music, not a performance.
 


"Dare to Suck" is brilliant and something you should franchise out as a set of clubs across the country!  Similar to "alcoholics anonymous" but with an obvious different and music congeniality focus.   For now I'm stealing it and getting a group together soon at one of the rooms provided by the library in my town.

Jan 13, 2025 - 9:05:03 AM

3654 posts since 4/19/2008
Online Now

Start spending half of your time on learning relative pitch

Jan 13, 2025 - 10:54:25 AM

Adam Sea

Canada

79 posts since 1/20/2021

Find some folk jams to try out.

People who play clawhammer style don't have to limit themselves to old time music.

Folk jams are less intense and there's more room to noodle around. Most of their repertoire is in I-IV-V progressions with the odd minor chords. And the music is less complicated. Of course, you'll always get someone calling a song in B or F but that's an opportunity to either sit it out and listen and observe.

Learn chords and scales. You won't be able to appreciate how melodies are constructed until you know how chords influence them, and how all that is rooted in the applicable scale.

Now that you're a year in, it's time to learn some music theory.

Jan 13, 2025 - 12:29:46 PM
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16101 posts since 6/2/2008

quote:
Originally posted by jsinjin

What has helped:
Saying notes while I play them. I like to know the notes that make up each chord and what notes I’m playing so I write them out and I make sure I know what each one is. It’s a goal of mine to understand music theory as well as play music.


This is great. A lot of people never actually learn the notes. Knowing where the notes are and knowing the notes that make up every chord is valuable knowledge.

But believe me when I say there will come a time when you don't think of every note as you play it. I think you play clawhammer. While that's not as rapid-fire as three-finger, there are tempos where there are too many notes in too little time for the brain to identify each one. You will eventually play more by chord as well as by sense.

quote:
Originally posted by jsinjin

What hasn’t worked for me
Playing in jam sessions with experts. They’re simply too good, the songs are not easy to understand, the key isn’t know and the groups I’ve been to have not been forgiving at all of beginners even though it was open. Learning to play isn’t something that’s done well with groups of people who already play music well 


I hope in the several responses I posted to you last year I never said get out and play with others . . . before you're ready.

It is an absolute mistake for a beginner or someone who can barely get through a song to expect to participate in a full-speed jam of performance-capable ear players with extensive knowledge of the old time or bluegrass canon, thorough understanding of how music works, and a broad musical vocabulary to play on their instruments.

You're an academic, as I recall. Teaching something in math or the sciences. So you well understand prerequisites.

We wouldn't expect someone who never took math beyond high school Algebra I to know what's going on in Advanced Multivariable Calculus. Nor would anyone who has spent years gaining the experience to belong in that class expect the instructor to dial back the curriculum for the student who doesn't belong there. That doesn't make the class unwelcoming. That's the class being what it was created to be.

Jams have prerequisites, too. When you're ready for a jam, you have to find the right one.

Others have already mentioned slow jams geared to beginners. The best will be led by experienced players, because someone needs to know what's going on and be able to hold a song together. There are also all-levels jams, where the people who attend are supposed to expect there will be players above and below their level.

Attending just to listen before you're ready to play is a great idea. And so is listening in general. I think it's extremely difficult to learn clawhammer or bluegrass banjo without listening to banjo music. It's the only way to understand what it's supposed to sound like. 

Good luck

Jan 13, 2025 - 2:29:32 PM

195 posts since 4/19/2024

Thanks OH!

I’m not wise in the ways of banjo education but i am very aged and wise in the ways of difficult technical education. What I have learned about pedagogy is that we have taken a quantum leap from 2000 to now even beyond the changes in learning that occurred after the baby boomers were educated.

A book called “Rise of Superman” written in ancient times of 2015 followed the changes in several disciplines as opportunities to decode learning methods changed. As those disciplines opened options for learning there was a jump in the number of “elites” but also a jump in the number of people becoming casual hobbyists in the discipline.

What I’ve learned from my own courses is that there are several “general” learning types including those students who read and solve problems, those who sit in class with rapt attention and hear lectures, those who watch video instruction and those who work in groups. Of those I have standouts in each learning type and a general bell curve. But I’ve found that the pace of learning has accelerated across the continuum with all of these learning modes.

What I know about myself in learning banjo is that I will never be great at banjo and have no desire to be. I do enjoy the practice and learning the songs and theory. I have taken the advice to get instruction and that’s helped. Other ways have worked or not worked for me.

I think that for my goals, my set of goals that Hilarie B. Reviewed will work.

Jan 14, 2025 - 11:45:08 AM

53 posts since 11/10/2010

It may or not be practical for you, but rather than looking for a jam session, perhaps you can find a beginning to intermediate fiddle player and learn some tunes in D that the fiddle player wants to practice. Try inventing something that goes along with what they are doing. Common first fiddle tunes for fiddle players (unless they are Irish oriented) are soldier's Joy, Over the waterfall and Liberty. Irish players play those tunes but they also have another large esoteric repertoire that as a fiddle player, I am not very familiar with. Fiddle tunes in D (at least simple ones, with limited chords) are easy to play with double C tuning (capo on 2nd fret of course). Once you figure out one or two, the rest will be much easier. Double C tuning is my favorite for fiddle tunes because it's not too difficult to find some of the melody or guide tones and still keep chords and rhythm going. Fiddle players, those who play old time music, love playing with a banjo player. The fiddle and the banjo really can be a complete band.  It's the 5 string banjo's raison d'etat.

Edited by - wendellfiddler on 01/14/2025 11:48:29

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