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Jan 7, 2025 - 12:57:59 PM

pasdimo

France

381 posts since 12/7/2017

I recently bought a very beautiful Leedy Hollander tenor banjo, which plays very well. However, I was not totally convinced with the weatherking head it had, so I decided to try a Renaissance. As you know this banjo has a top tension flat head and needs a high crown model. Unfortunately the tension hoop doesn’t go down far enough and the strings hit the tension hoop. I tightened to 90 on the drum dial, and don’t dare to go further. These banjos have also a very efficient (if not the best) neck angle adjuster, so I tried to modify the neck angle using several bridges with different heights. No result, the problem remains.
The most surprising is that the weatherking head has exactly the same crown height (1/2 inch) and works fine. Do I missed something ? Is it because the weatherking is more flexible and stretchable ? The last solution would be to file the tension hoop (the low part underneath the strings), but I’m rather reluctant.
By the way, I never understood the differences between weatherking, wheather king and fiberskin, I attached a pic, what kind do I have ?
Thanks for your help.


 

Jan 7, 2025 - 1:15:39 PM

898 posts since 5/29/2015

Try loosening the head somewhat. Then tighten down the top third of the hooks until the tension hoop cutout/dip for the fingerboard on the tension hoop is at the same level as the fingerboard. Then tighten up the rest of the tension hoop.

Jan 7, 2025 - 1:18:37 PM

898 posts since 5/29/2015

Another possibility is that the hole that the dowel rod goes through is taller (more rectangular) than the square neck dowel. (I'm assuming that is banjo has a wooden dowel). It is possible that the neck just needs to be pushed up until the wood dowel is touching the top of the hole in the rim for the dowel. if so put a wooden spacer under the dowel to keep it in its highest position.

Jan 7, 2025 - 2:02:28 PM
likes this

2613 posts since 2/9/2007

quote:
Originally posted by pasdimo


By the way, I never understood the differences between weatherking, wheather king and fiberskin, I attached a pic, what kind do I have ?
Thanks for your help.


Someone else probably knows just when Remo used Weather King vs. Weatherking as their general brand name for plastic drum heads,  They're all mylar film, though some folks say the formula they used before EPA standards  made a better sounding head, and the "flesh" hoops aren't attached the same way now as they used to be.  Fiberskyn is the same material, with a layer of some fibrous stuff kind of like Tyvek stuck to it (except the very earliest ones which had a layer of woven fabric).

I'm not sure if Renaissance heads are exactly the same plastic (just a different color).  They are very similar, but I think they may be just a bit stretchier than the white or clear ones. 

As for your problem, all plastic heads do stretch out a little under tension. I'd say to get the new head cranked down (evenly!) as tight as you dare, let the banjo sit in a warm place for a few days, and then re-check it with the Drum Dial.  Loosening and tightening it a couple times may help it stretch out a bit.  Make sure the bearing surface of the tone ring is really smooth (I usually use 0000 steel wool), and maybe wipe on a light coat of wax.

Jan 7, 2025 - 8:32:27 PM
Players Union Member

RioStat

USA

6432 posts since 10/12/2009

Your photo shows a Fyberskin, which is supposed to look like a natural skin/hide head.

Weather King (two separate words) are the mythical "pre-EPA" heads, supposedly the textured spray coating was a different formulation, until the US EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) declared one of the ingredients harmful.

Weatherking (one word) was the designation after the new formulation was put into use, after the above mentioned EPA ruling went into effect, I believe in the early 1970's.

This is what Dan Gellert is referring to in his post above.

And, yes, Remo heads are made of Mylar polymer, which in its original form is clear, thus the use of a textured, white, spray coating, used on "top-frosted" and "bottom-frosted" heads. 
 

Smooth white Remo heads have white pigment added directly to the Mylar when it is being extruded, so you get white (smooth) heads with no frosting/coating on them. Same with the smooth, shiny black Remo heads, black pigment added directly to the Mylar polymer.

I'm not sure how / what is used in / on the Fyberskin heads

Jan 7, 2025 - 8:43:34 PM

deke46

Australia

195 posts since 8/30/2009

I had a similar problem and received the following advice from one I trust implicitly.

Occasionally Remo is slightly off in their crown heights. They are not made with rocket science precision.

On your Vega mandolin-banjo; Many Vega tension hoops are exceptionally tall. Even the high crown is too fall for the head and tension hoop to be in the correct place. When I need a higher crown head for a Vega instrument, I install the head tighter than I want it. Then with the neck removed, I heat the head with a heat gun, then tighten a little more. Repeat until the tension hoop is a little lower than where you want it to live. Loosen the head a little so the head is not super tight.

Jan 8, 2025 - 6:52:35 AM

4983 posts since 10/13/2005
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I'd get a head diameter, high crown, 1/16" wider than your current head diameter. banjered

Jan 8, 2025 - 12:57:59 PM

DSmoke

USA

1485 posts since 11/30/2015

As Derrick mentioned you can heat the head to get the tension ring to sit lower. I did this yesterday on a Vega with a Renaissance head. You can use a heat gun or hair dryer, warm it up tighten your nuts, repeat. I like to warm it up and push down in the center when I am done. Also, you can go to at least 95 on the drum dial without fear of it breaking. The Ren heads typically drop 2 pounds or so after a few days. I like my tension rings to sit perfectly even but occasionally it might have to be slightly lower where it meets the neck to get it below the level of the frets. I'd love to see the banjo when you're done.

Jan 8, 2025 - 1:15:12 PM

sethb

USA

831 posts since 2/16/2005

All great ideas and suggestions!  I would add one thing to them, to supplement the suggestion about using "a light coat of wax." 

Most music stores sell something called "drum wax" in a lipstick-sized tube container.  It's used by drummers as an edge lubricant when they're replacing their drum heads.  I think the same stuff could also be used on a tone ring before a new banjo head is installed. 

I have a tube of the stuff, which I bought several years ago in anticipation of replacing my banjo head.  But I haven't had to replace the head, so I've never used it and I can't say whether it's good or bad, helpful or not.  But it seems to me that anything that would help get a banjo head to proper tension ought to be a good thing.  SETH

Edited by - sethb on 01/08/2025 13:17:42

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