I was wondering about the GT and RK bluegrass banjos. The RK songster is like $600, way cheaper than anything comparable. Is it any good at that price point? The RK 35 & 36 seem to be very reasonable, but listening to the RK 75 and GT Twanger OB3, the later banjos seem so much more lively.
I'm not a very good player TBH. I played a Gold Tone open back for years. It's probably not worth it for me to drop $1800 on a banjo, but was interested in getting a decent bluegrass banjo and learning bluegrass. Just wondering what people's opinions of these banjos are, or maybe something comparable.
Edited by - 6stringedRamble on 12/08/2024 13:24:04
Don't get the songster. It's a much more cheaply made banjo. Stick with the RK 35 or 36 or the equivalent GT's.
My best advice actually is to "learn bluegrass" on your current banjo that you like. Back when Earl, et al, were playing on the roof of the concession stand of a drive in movie, or on a school house steps, you needed the natural forward amplification that a flathead resonator banjo provides.
You don't need that now. Now, when the band wants more banjo, the sound guy slides his finger up the tab on his ipad.
Couple of years ago I saw a really strong regional bluegrass band and the guy was playing a Goodtime. I think he was trying to prove a point that most of it was the sound system. And yes he did, he convinced me alright.
Edited by - Eric A on 12/08/2024 14:21:19
The RK Madisons and the GoldTone OB-3 have full flathead tone rings. And both use good rings. The only downside to a full flathead banjo is weight. Ross Nickerson has the RK-35 (maple) for 1099 with free shipping (he has an ad here with it also). Banjo Ben also has free shipping, but it looks like they are sold out right now (You can call Jake and ask him). Elderly has them, but I don't know that they are doing free shipping.
There is a used 36 (mahogany) in the classifieds. You'll save on sales tax, but will pay shipping.
An RK-35 or -36 is all the banjo most of us would ever need. It is definitely performance grade. The OB-3 also is a good banjo, but they tend to cost more. Whether they are worth more is subjective.
The Songster may be the best new bluegrass banjo you can buy for $600. But it's a learner's instrument. $600 isn't what it used to be. It's equal to $73 back in Spring of '70 when I bought a lesser-than-this beginner's aluminum-rimmed banjo for $59 or $69. So, the Songster, to my mind, is a lot more banjo for not much more money than a beginner could have bought back in my day. (It would be another 2 years before I got serious about learning and took lessons).
If one can afford it, I think it's better to start on something like this than the lower priced bottlecaps or other lower-cost resonator banjos, including the resonator versions of Gold Tone Cripple Creeks and Deering Goodtimes. You already have the Gold Tone open back and want more.
I'd say the Songster is more "economically" made -- not necessarily "cheaply" made -- than Recording King's RK35/36 or the Gold Tone OB-150. It has a thinner wood rim made with more plies on top of which is a rod style tone ring. That's some of the lower-cost stuff. But it has the same US-threaded hardware as the RK35 and the mahogany neck could very well be structurally the same as the RK36: built-up heel, grafted headstock, no handstop.
I think you get a lot for your money. But it's a banjo that a good player will eventually outgrow.
Used RK35s start at only $200 more. New, they cost about twice as much as the Songster. Likewise the competitive Gold Tone OB-150. These are serious gig- and jam-worthy instruments. They're more economically made than the RK75 and Twanger, but the parts that produce sound are top notch. On the RK35 and 36, the entire pot (maybe minus the resonator) is the same as the RK75. I don't know whether Gold Tone's OB150 has the same tone ring as the Twanger. But I expect the rim, flange and other hardware are the same.
Those $1800-$2000 banjos certainly have some construction features that make them cost more. How much better they sound, I can't say.
I believe the Songster is a step up from your Gold Tone open back. From your self-description, I agree you don't need an $1800 banjo. If you can afford a used RK35/36 or OB150 at around $800, you'll have the best value in a real bluegrass banjo.
This message is getting long. I'll end with lower cost used options. The same $600 as a new Songster should be more than enough to get you a used Epiphone MB250, Fender Leo, or one of the Korean or Chinese Masterclones such as Washburn, Fender or Morgan Monroe. Maybe even older banjos such as Alvarez. I forget the model numbers to look for. But you want the heavy ones with mastertone style tone rings. There were some other brands of Gibson copies but I forget the names. I never used to recommend these banjos new. Thought they were overpriced. But now with the price of used RK35 starting at around $800, I think those Masterclones are decent buys at $600 and less. The ones I'm talking about are more banjo than the Songster.
Have fun shopping. And good luck.
quote:
Originally posted by Eric AMy best advice actually is to "learn bluegrass" on your current banjo that you like. Back when Earl, et al, were playing on the roof of the concession stand of a drive in movie, or on a school house steps, you needed the natural forward amplification that a flathead resonator banjo provides.
You don't need that now. Now, when the band wants more banjo, the sound guy slides his finger up the tab on his ipad.
Couple of years ago I saw a really strong regional bluegrass band and the guy was playing a Goodtime. I think he was trying to prove a point that most of it was the sound system. And yes he did, he convinced me alright.
Interesting points. But i think a resonator banjo also has a different timbre. I mean the history of modern american instruments seems to be the 1920s when more amplicatioin was needed, eg the banjoele and the steel stringed dreadnought. I'm not sure why the 1920s was when people decided they needed louder music.
I wonder if instruments will be used at all in coming generations. With a BT speaker, ipad and AI I'm guessing teens these days can make any kinda of music they want with less effort and skill than ever before in history, not that they were trying to hard before with their full adoption of rap music.
quote:
Originally posted by Old HickoryThe Songster may be the best new bluegrass banjo you can buy for $600. But it's a learner's instrument. $600 isn't what it used to be. It's equal to $73 back in Spring of '70 when I bought a lesser-than-this beginner's aluminum-rimmed banjo for $59 or $69. So, the Songster, to my mind, is a lot more banjo for not much more money than a beginner could have bought back in my day. (It would be another 2 years before I got serious about learning and took lessons).
If one can afford it, I think it's better to start on something like this than the lower priced bottlecaps or other lower-cost resonator banjos, including the resonator versions of Gold Tone Cripple Creeks and Deering Goodtimes. You already have the Gold Tone open back and want more.
I'd say the Songster is more "economically" made -- not necessarily "cheaply" made -- than Recording King's RK35/36 or the Gold Tone OB-150. It has a thinner wood rim made with more plies on top of which is a rod style tone ring. That's some of the lower-cost stuff. But it has the same US-threaded hardware as the RK35 and the mahogany neck could very well be structurally the same as the RK36: built-up heel, grafted headstock, no handstop.
I think you get a lot for your money. But it's a banjo that a good player will eventually outgrow.
Used RK35s start at only $200 more. New, they cost about twice as much as the Songster. Likewise the competitive Gold Tone OB-150. These are serious gig- and jam-worthy instruments. They're more economically made than the RK75 and Twanger, but the parts that produce sound are top notch. On the RK35 and 36, the entire pot (maybe minus the resonator) is the same as the RK75. I don't know whether Gold Tone's OB150 has the same tone ring as the Twanger. But I expect the rim, flange and other hardware are the same.
Those $1800-$2000 banjos certainly have some construction features that make them cost more. How much better they sound, I can't say.
I believe the Songster is a step up from your Gold Tone open back. From your self-description, I agree you don't need an $1800 banjo. If you can afford a used RK35/36 or OB150 at around $800, you'll have the best value in a real bluegrass banjo.
This message is getting long. I'll end with lower cost used options. The same $600 as a new Songster should be more than enough to get you a used Epiphone MB250, Fender Leo, or one of the Korean or Chinese Masterclones such as Washburn, Fender or Morgan Monroe. Maybe even older banjos such as Alvarez. I forget the model numbers to look for. But you want the heavy ones with mastertone style tone rings. There were some other brands of Gibson copies but I forget the names. I never used to recommend these banjos new. Thought they were overpriced. But now with the price of used RK35 starting at around $800, I think those Masterclones are decent buys at $600 and less. The ones I'm talking about are more banjo than the Songster.
Have fun shopping. And good luck.
I didn't realize Gold Tone had a banjo in the $1k prince range (Gold Tone OB-150). Thanks for letting me know. I did know about the Washburn B16 and thought about that one. but BHO always advises against brand name guitar companies that offere a few chinese made banjos. People here usually advise a US made boutique banjo or one of the actual companies that over overseas made banjos as a major product line, such as GT or RK.
You guys really helped me figure out what i should be looking for if I pull the trigger. Around the $1k mark new, around $700 used. Well I'd probably stick to GT OB-150 or RK 35. It's a project for a future time, but I was just wondering what I ought to be looking for when I get around to it.
quote:
Originally posted by Eric AMy best advice actually is to "learn bluegrass" on your current banjo that you like. Back when Earl, et al, were playing on the roof of the concession stand of a drive in movie, or on a school house steps, you needed the natural forward amplification that a flathead resonator banjo provides.
You don't need that now. Now, when the band wants more banjo, the sound guy slides his finger up the tab on his ipad.
Couple of years ago I saw a really strong regional bluegrass band and the guy was playing a Goodtime. I think he was trying to prove a point that most of it was the sound system. And yes he did, he convinced me alright.
If you can't make em dance with a Goodtime you won't be able to do it with a PreWar or other wonderful instrument.
quote:
Originally posted by 6stringedRambleI was wondering about the GT and RK bluegrass banjos. The RK songster is like $600, way cheaper than anything comparable. Is it any good at that price point? The RK 35 & 36 seem to be very reasonable, but listening to the RK 75 and GT Twanger OB3, the later banjos seem so much more lively.
I'm not a very good player TBH. I played a Gold Tone open back for years. It's probably not worth it for me to drop $1800 on a banjo, but was interested in getting a decent bluegrass banjo and learning bluegrass. Just wondering what people's opinions of these banjos are, or maybe something comparable.
I have a RK 80. I like it just fine, but am only a hobby banjo player, not a pro. But when I want to get that resonated 3 finger sound I am quite happy with my choice.
I'm not a fan of ponying up the price of a new Goodtime Artisan, but Alison Brown sure can make one sing. An open back, no less.
And here's Ryan Cavanaugh on an Artisan Goodtime 2 (resonator model). They're much better values used.
