Wow, Id get in the ol car and take a mini vaca 100 miles away.

I like how the chief says "air quality remains okay". Can anyone ever tell the truth anymore OMG!! I will say the wind died down so the smell isn't so bad right now at least where we live. I used to work in that part of town though I would hate to be there now.

We had a bad fire like that in our town and it's been 2 months and it's still a mess, water all over, debris still in place, water quality in doubt. Some of the home owners have had to leave their homes and find other accommodations due to the smell, the tainted water and the tainted air.

City and county are trying to help, but it's difficult to find anyone who will come and clean up the mess. Most clean up companies around here have bowed out.

Please be careful, watch your water if you're on a well and near enough for the runoff from the fire to seep down into it. Watch the air quality if you have any breathing problems.

I'm so glad that I live way across town from our problem and my heart goes out to those who are having to deal with the mess we have.

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Originally posted by Texasbanjo

We had a bad fire like that in our town and it's been 2 months and it's still a mess, water all over, debris still in place, water quality in doubt. Some of the home owners have had to leave their homes and find other accommodations due to the smell, the tainted water and the tainted air.

City and county are trying to help, but it's difficult to find anyone who will come and clean up the mess. Most clean up companies around here have bowed out.

Please be careful, watch your water if you're on a well and near enough for the runoff from the fire to seep down into it. Watch the air quality if you have any breathing problems.

I'm so glad that I live way across town from our problem and my heart goes out to those who are having to deal with the mess we have.

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Thank you.  We are on a well and up until now I've been more concerned it might dry up unless we get some rain. 

Thinking through this scenario, the location of the fire is about 100' below us elevation wise and all the rivers that run through Columbus run south toward the Ohio River so I would think our water would be okay?  But I will pay attention thank you.

I grew up in the 1950’s, ‘60’s in a city that had 3 paper mills,, with a south wind we’d almost gag on the emission fumes. Many cancer patients and fatalities ,, my two sisters and myself had cancer.
“ There are around 100 pulp mills currently operating in the United States, and each year they emit roughly 23 million pounds of hazardous air pollutants, including benzene, mercury, and the potent carcinogen dioxin.”

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Originally posted by chuckv97

I grew up in the 1950’s, ‘60’s in a city that had 3 paper mills,, with a south wind we’d almost gag on the emission fumes. Many cancer patients and fatalities ,, my two sisters and myself had cancer.
“ There are around 100 pulp mills currently operating in the United States, and each year they emit roughly 23 million pounds of hazardous air pollutants, including benzene, mercury, and the potent carcinogen dioxin.”

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Dave and I worked for a petrochemical company here for nearly 20 years and it made all sorts of nasty chemicals that were carcinogens.   I sometimes wonder if that's what gave Dave his lung cancer.  I'll never know for sure, but a  lot of employees had cancer so it's possible.

So far it hasn't bothered me, but I didn't work out at the plants but uptown in the corporate offices.

I'm not defending pollution/polluters, but I wonder when extrapolation is warranted.  Nine kiddos in our [farm] family .... raised in beautiful west-central Man-ee-toe-bah with plenty of exercise and fresh air and a relatively straightforward diet [i.e. limited processed/convenience foods].  Four have succumbed to various cancers [one brother had 5 go-rounds] and two others have/have had one bout.  One sister developed mesothelioma after working for quite a few years in an environment with asbestos.

I chalk up the three of us that haven't been afflicted, so far, as being rewarded for our good clean livin'.  

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Originally posted by Owen

I'm not defending pollution/polluters, but I wonder when extrapolation is warranted.  Nine kiddos in our [farm] family .... raised in beautiful west-central Man-ee-toe-bah with plenty of exercise and fresh air and a relatively straightforward diet [i.e. limited processed/convenience foods].  Four have succumbed to various cancers [one brother had 5 go-rounds] and two others have/have had one bout.  I chalk up the three of us that haven't been afflicted, so far, as being rewarded for our good clean livin'.  

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Some variables I'm curious about - did you spray pesticides & herbicides on your crops? & or did your neighbours spray?  Were your sibs smokers or heavy drinkers?  How was your well water?   Was there a history of cancer in your ancestors? 

We, and some of our neighbors, did spray, but not anywhere near the extent that it's done today, and Dad found that he got pretty good weed control with rates for 2,4-D mucho reduced from what was recommended.*   Only one sister ever smoked to any extent [dunno just how heavy / colon cancer] and none abused alcohol to any significant degree.  Water was from a +/-80' dug well .... high iron content, although it got plenty of positive reviews (?) re. taste from visitors, relatives. I haven't much of an idea about ancestors' history.... though I don't recall any of my grandparents, or my father's or mothers siblings as having had cancer. 

I'm thinking it was as low as 1/4 [he'd say that just a "whiff" seemed to do the job], but I'm not putting much $$ on that figure.  Interestingly he sometimes equated the rapid, twisting, undifferentiated (?) growth of the weeds as them having cancer.

Chuck, I've been reconnoitering re. variables and extrapolation.   Two of us are/were noticeably more religious (?) than the other seven.  100% of the two have had cancer, but only 57% of the seven.   

Edit: Fwiw, 'way back I did take a half-course in "introduction to statistics" or something like that.

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Originally posted by Owen

I'm not defending pollution/polluters, but I wonder when extrapolation is warranted.  Nine kiddos in our [farm] family .... raised in beautiful west-central Man-ee-toe-bah with plenty of exercise and fresh air and a relatively straightforward diet [i.e. limited processed/convenience foods].  Four have succumbed to various cancers [one brother had 5 go-rounds] and two others have/have had one bout.  One sister developed mesothelioma after working for quite a few years in an environment with asbestos.

I chalk up the three of us that haven't been afflicted, so far, as being rewarded for our good clean livin'.  

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Did you use pesticides and herbicides such as "Roundup" on the farm,Owen?

There's dozens, if not hundreds, so "such as" is a pretty wide brush.

I used RoundUp  ... late 80s to late90s .... probably averaged out to about 50 acres [out of 240ish] per year  ..... part of my rotation of breaking up pasture/hayland  to put it into barley for a couple of years.  [I also sprayed "fly spray" on the dairy cows on an as needed basis.]

My dad farmed pre-RoundUp .... mostly I recall 2,4-D and some Avadex [wild oats]. I also recall him "treating" seed wheat, in some years, with  some sort of anti-fungus/blight/ergot/?? ... it was 60ish years ago. 

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Originally posted by Owen

Chuck, I've been reconnoitering re. variables and extrapolation.   Two of us are/were noticeably more religious (?) than the other seven.  100% of the two have had cancer, but only 57% of the seven.   

Edit: Fwiw, 'way back I did take a half-course in "introduction to statistics" or something like that.

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At the risk of getting booted off this august forum, I'll posit that your more religious siblings dwelt on the erroneous "punishing God" aspects of certain denominations,,, as you know, I like to focus on the positive ,,, like th old song says," aksenshoeayt the positive". 
I would've never got cancer if'n I had've taken the doctor's advice and went for a colonoscopy 13 years ago. My "over-positivity" that I was bulletproof landed me in hot water..

Well, they were regular attenders at regular/mainstream/?? denominations ... dunno just what role a "punishing God" plays/played.   So far I've managed well enough doing without......... though I have been in churches for weddings and funerals.   And also had several meals a nice restaurant that a couple in this area operated in a church they'd bought/moved/re-purposed* ... so surely that counts for something.  

* -  was gonna use "converted," but thought it might contravene the "no religion" rule.  

Edit: How does a colonoscopy prevent cancer?   My non-medical logic says that it detects it .... hopefully sooner rather than later.

The colonoscopy detects polyps that can grow into cancer,, they nip them off. From what I’ve read most people have some cancer cells in their bodies, but their immune systems take care of them before they can spread. However, getting back to the main thrust of E. Palestine-ing , I believe a lot of the upsurge in cancer in the past few decades can be traced back to environmental issues.

"It takes approximately 10 years for a small polyp to develop into cancer. Family history and genetics — Polyps and colon cancer tend to run in families, suggesting that genetic factors are important in their development." 

This upsurge??   >>> From Cancer Canada: "Thus, although the number of new cancers diagnosed each year in Canada continues to increase because of the growing and aging population, the risk of developing the disease is declining."

From the solid-basis-for-extrapolation department:  My sister-in-law [healthy, active, good diet, etc.] had colonoscopies according to whatever schedule her docs were recommending. Things were hunky-dory .... until they weren't.  Removed part of colon.   Things again hunky-dory.  Then a recurrence that did her in.  I guess colonoscopies only prevent cancer in certain people; apparently in [some] others it extends life by a few years, and in [some] others .... ??

I don't discount the effect of "environmental issues,"  but I do wonder about the propensity [by whoever] for simple explanations for complex issues.*

* - some we know we know, some we know we don't know, some we don't know ... etc., etc.  Thank you very much Donald Rumsfeld.

Sorry about your sister, Owen. I lost 2 sisters recently from cancer. It could be your sister’s recurrence was a fast-growing cancer that the colonoscopies, which are often scheduled every 3-5 years (maybe every year in her case) , didn’t catch in time. Once the cancer cells spread outside the colon (mine did) you’re on thinner ice (hice in Moan-ray-all).
No, I don’t subscribe to simple solutions to complex issues,, hence my pondering over banjo education and motivational seminars to encourage daily practice of at least one hour per day, divided up into 2 or 3 sessions, with total concentration - no distractions from political blather on the radio.

p.s. , as for the upsurge/downsurge ,  I'm now thinking that more screening and colonoscopies early on are lowering the numbers. From my balcony, I can't see it, but I've been reading about the new 1.4 billion dollar cancer centre that's just opened in Cowtown here. 

Getting diagnosed as early as possible such as with a colonoscopy is key in a healthy outcome.
Early detection is of course important in surviving any kind of cancer.
A thorough medical history and regular testing is key.

There are of course fast-growing cancers that happen.

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Originally posted by steve davis

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Originally posted by Owen

I'm not defending pollution/polluters, but I wonder when extrapolation is warranted.  Nine kiddos in our [farm] family .... raised in beautiful west-central Man-ee-toe-bah with plenty of exercise and fresh air and a relatively straightforward diet [i.e. limited processed/convenience foods].  Four have succumbed to various cancers [one brother had 5 go-rounds] and two others have/have had one bout.  One sister developed mesothelioma after working for quite a few years in an environment with asbestos.

I chalk up the three of us that haven't been afflicted, so far, as being rewarded for our good clean livin'.  

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Did you use pesticides and herbicides such as "Roundup" on the farm,Owen?

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There is no evidence that MSG (glutamate ..... Roundup) causes cancer.  The fact that there have been some huge jury awards is not scientific evidence that Roundup caused the litigants cancer.

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Originally posted by BanjoLink

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Originally posted by steve davis

quote:

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Originally posted by Owen

I'm not defending pollution/polluters, but I wonder when extrapolation is warranted.  Nine kiddos in our [farm] family .... raised in beautiful west-central Man-ee-toe-bah with plenty of exercise and fresh air and a relatively straightforward diet [i.e. limited processed/convenience foods].  Four have succumbed to various cancers [one brother had 5 go-rounds] and two others have/have had one bout.  One sister developed mesothelioma after working for quite a few years in an environment with asbestos.

I chalk up the three of us that haven't been afflicted, so far, as being rewarded for our good clean livin'.  

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Did you use pesticides and herbicides such as "Roundup" on the farm,Owen?

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There is no evidence that MSG (glutamate ..... Roundup) causes cancer.  The fact that there have been some huge jury awards is not scientific evidence that Roundup caused the litigants cancer.

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John, I hope this isn't a big tobacco scenario. Can you link us some articles supporting your claim? 
 

ed. , I found this : "

The reason behind the ban is that according to the Cancer Agency of WHO, this herbicide can cause cancer. This year, individuals with non-Hodgkin lymphoma filed a lawsuit against glyphosate manufacturers, including Roundup. Experts have discussed the potential carcinogenicity of glyphosate in a recent nine-week trial. In January 2024, the case’s closing statements are expected. This lawsuit seeks to address health issues associated with glyphosate exposure.

What is the controversy?

The controversy stems from the alleged link between glyphosate and health risks, including worries related to carcinogenicity. While some studies indicate a connection, others contend the evidence is weak and patchy.

The International Agency for Research on Cancer of WHO categorises glyphosate as "likely to cause cancer in humans." This declaration sparked heated debate among agricultural scientists."

I expect there are m-a-n-y chemicals that can cause cancer, so for me it's worthwhile to bear in mind "recommended rates." 

IF glutamate is likely to cause cancer in me, why do we have some in our kitchen cupboard?

IF glyphosate is likely to give me cancer, why do I have some in the garage?

Roundup has been on bad lists since the 70s.There is still pressure to get it removed from the market.

“I ain’t broke, but I’m badly bent”
It’s a testament to the human immune system that most of us are still alive, fcol.
Have you been behind an old car from the 50’s or ‘60’s lately? ,,,, the exhaust fumes are horrendous. We used to sit in traffic jams on the QEW back in the day breathing that stuff in on hot summer days with the windows rolled down.

"..... with the window rolled down." sounds like an alternate version of the old joke, "It really hurts when I push right here, Doc ... etc."    

Sheesh, Owen,, s. Ontario summers around the humid Great Lakes are often 90*F with 90% humidity. Back then it was cooler to have the windows down, nobody noticed or complained about the fumes cuz we were all “normalized” to it.
(fwiw, we used to smoke cigarettes with the windows down while yer friendly gas station guy filled’er up)