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Apr 17, 2024 - 4:35:03 PM
2 posts since 8/1/2023

Hey all – I've got a bit of a mystery to solve for a banjo I just purchased. Any idea what the specs are for this banjo and where it came from? Apologies if this is against the rules linking there. 

Apparently someone who holds the rights to the Bacon & Day name was thinking about relaunching the name with a new affordable banjo line, but didn't end up going through with it. 

My research has led me to think potentially Fender intended to relaunch Bacon & Day, but ended up going with Gretsch as this appears to have some similarities to the Broadkaster banjos produced in the 2010s. They also seem to show some similarities to the Morgan Monroes, but that all might just be a case of banjos being made in a factory in China with slightly different decorative features.  

Apr 17, 2024 - 4:52:51 PM
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3540 posts since 4/7/2010

Fender has never had anything to do with Bacon & Day. Gretsch purchased the Bacon Banjo Co's assets and trade name after the (if my geezer memory is correct) September 1939 New England hurricane. As far as I can tell, Gretsch still owns the Bacon and Bacon & Day trade marks. The fact that the Reverb banjo with the B&D name on the peghead has a Fender vibe is that the banjo was likely made at the same Chinese factory that makes current Fender instruments.

Bob Smakula

Apr 17, 2024 - 5:05:24 PM

2436 posts since 2/9/2007

That faux patina hardware bugs me, especially on a banjo that otherwise looks fresh out of the factory.

Apr 17, 2024 - 5:07:18 PM
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rcc56

USA

5093 posts since 2/20/2016

Your guess is as good as mine, but if I read the following correctly, the current owner of the Bacon and Day trademark is a "Corporation" called Dynamic Music, based in New Berlin, Wisconsin. I don't know who that is, but a google search yields no website for the company or real clue to what they do. Looks like either a small time operation, a non-entity, or possibly someone who tries to acquire trademarks for reasons unknown [possibly for no good purpose]. Note that an "Abandonment Notice" was mailed in 2009. trademarkencyclopedia.c...n-and-day/

Perhaps someone knowledgeable in trademark law can explain the trademark's status and/or the "TEAS extensions" and the significance of the abandonment notice.

Edited by - rcc56 on 04/17/2024 17:07:54

Apr 17, 2024 - 5:43:39 PM

2 posts since 8/1/2023

Thanks for the replies! The trademark filing info has thickened the plot! Looks like Cascio Interstate Music, a musical instrument store in New Berlin, WI up until it closed somewhat recently, was also in the business of producing / importing instruments. Seems like they went through the process of having some prototypes made after acquiring the rights and sitting on the word marks, but it ultimately wasn't worth it.

Apr 17, 2024 - 6:54:16 PM

794 posts since 5/29/2015

Apr 18, 2024 - 12:31:56 AM
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Players Union Member

rmcdow

USA

1402 posts since 11/8/2014

quote:
Originally posted by rcc56

Perhaps someone knowledgeable in trademark law can explain the trademark's status and/or the "TEAS extensions" and the significance of the abandonment notice.


Trademarks, in order to stay currently registered, require a fee to be paid to the USPTO.  $525 is due to the USPTO five years after registration, then every 10 years after that per class of goods, basically forever if you want to maintain the mark.  If a mark is abandoned, which this one appears to have been abandoned, anyone can register it again if they pay the fees and re-register it.  It is likely that Gretch abandoned the mark at some point, and someone thought they could make a business using that mark, and registered it.  I didn't try to register the mark on the USPTO site, but my guess is that since it is abandoned, anyone could register it again if they want to pay the fees.  The USPTO sends out abandonment notices when you don't pay the fees every 10 years, and the mark is up for grabs if the fees are not paid.

Edited by - rmcdow on 04/18/2024 00:34:03

Apr 18, 2024 - 11:32:03 AM

8253 posts since 9/21/2007
Online Now

quote:
Originally posted by rmcdow
quote:
Originally posted by rcc56

Perhaps someone knowledgeable in trademark law can explain the trademark's status and/or the "TEAS extensions" and the significance of the abandonment notice.


Trademarks, in order to stay currently registered, require a fee to be paid to the USPTO.  $525 is due to the USPTO five years after registration, then every 10 years after that per class of goods, basically forever if you want to maintain the mark.  If a mark is abandoned, which this one appears to have been abandoned, anyone can register it again if they pay the fees and re-register it.  It is likely that Gretch abandoned the mark at some point, and someone thought they could make a business using that mark, and registered it.  I didn't try to register the mark on the USPTO site, but my guess is that since it is abandoned, anyone could register it again if they want to pay the fees.  The USPTO sends out abandonment notices when you don't pay the fees every 10 years, and the mark is up for grabs if the fees are not paid.


A banjo company in California has made great use of "acquiring" trademarks through abandonment.

While that company actively uses one of those names, they are sitting on the rest presumably to prevent others from trademarking them.

S. S. Stewart and Fairbanks to name a couple. 

Edited by - Joel Hooks on 04/18/2024 11:34:50

Apr 18, 2024 - 12:21:43 PM
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5588 posts since 3/22/2008

To my knowledge there never was a "Bacon and Day" banjo as the OP banjo is entitled.
Day joined Bacon in 1922. Their core brands were "Bacon" and "B&D".
No "Bacon and Day".
Bacon (Banjo Co.) sold to Gretsch Mar. 1940.
Gretsch made "Bacon" and B&D" banjos.
No "Bacon and Day".
Gretsch was sold to Baldwin in 1967.
Under Baldwin the "Bacon" brand name was continued to 1972 then stopped until revived many years later but AFAIK there was never a "Bacon & Day" banjo from the originators. Until now?

Apr 19, 2024 - 10:13:34 AM
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13128 posts since 10/27/2006

quote:
Originally posted by rcc56

Your guess is as good as mine, but if I read the following correctly, the current owner of the Bacon and Day trademark is a "Corporation" called Dynamic Music, based in New Berlin, Wisconsin. I don't know who that is, but a google search yields no website for the company or real clue to what they do. Looks like either a small time operation, a non-entity, or possibly someone who tries to acquire trademarks for reasons unknown [possibly for no good purpose]. Note that an "Abandonment Notice" was mailed in 2009. trademarkencyclopedia.c...n-and-day/

Perhaps someone knowledgeable in trademark law can explain the trademark's status and/or the "TEAS extensions" and the significance of the abandonment notice.


Trademark Electronic Application System (TEAS)

Apr 19, 2024 - 10:44:10 AM

342 posts since 1/1/2016

quote:
Originally posted by beezaboy

To my knowledge there never was a "Bacon and Day" banjo as the OP banjo is entitled.
Day joined Bacon in 1922. Their core brands were "Bacon" and "B&D".
No "Bacon and Day".
Bacon (Banjo Co.) sold to Gretsch Mar. 1940.
Gretsch made "Bacon" and B&D" banjos.
No "Bacon and Day".
Gretsch was sold to Baldwin in 1967.
Under Baldwin the "Bacon" brand name was continued to 1972 then stopped until revived many years later but AFAIK there was never a "Bacon & Day" banjo from the originators. Until now?


This was my thought while reading this thread as well. Since "Bacon & Day" was never actually a trademark that was used, it was probably fairly easy to acquire and use to confuse the uninformed.

Does anyone know if that company in Wisconsin has the rights to both "Bacon Banjo" and B&D"? That's the real question.

If ANY company should have these rights, I would have to say it should be held by the new owners of OME, the Gold Tone Music Group, in order to continue the proper legacy of Bacon banjos. It's my recollection that OME was making the most recent versions of the Bacon Silver Bells, the Primrose and Phoenix models plus a version of their Grand Artist in a Silver Bell-style format.

Edited by - cebracher on 04/19/2024 10:44:40

Apr 22, 2024 - 12:49:40 PM
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13128 posts since 10/27/2006

quote:
Originally posted by cebracher

Does anyone know if that company in Wisconsin has the rights to both "Bacon Banjo" and B&D"? That's the real question.

 


Huh?

The trademark was abandoned in 2005.

Apr 22, 2024 - 3:02:24 PM

342 posts since 1/1/2016

quote:
Originally posted by mikehalloran
quote:
Originally posted by cebracher

Does anyone know if that company in Wisconsin has the rights to both "Bacon Banjo" and B&D"? That's the real question.

 


Huh?

The trademark was abandoned in 2005.

 


Gotcha, I must have misread the thread.

Chris

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