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Oct 18, 2021 - 5:15:27 PM
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889 posts since 10/4/2018

I recently started baking bagels in a lye solution and it has given them such a delicious taste and texture, but I can't remember how they tasted when I was in New York...all I know is they were great. My question is, are the delicious NY bagels dark in color or pale in color? Lye makes bagels dark like pretzels, well not that dark, but pretty dark. And it gives them a certain crunch and chewiness at the same time. Some say good NY style bagels need to be boiled in lye and others say in sugar water. I would like to know because I'm not returning to NYC any time soon. Thanks. Feel free to relate any bagel related stories.


Oct 18, 2021 - 6:30:38 PM
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slammer

USA

3387 posts since 12/30/2008

I’ve had bagels  in NYC and just about anywhere else in the country!!! I can’t remember the color of them and yes they were good, but I’ve had good bagels at a lot of places.
One of the best I’ve had was about an hour away from here in Munising Mi. But the place is closed now. I say if you like your bagels and they meet your satisfaction stick with the recipe and the hell with “NYC” bagels. Call em your own and enjoy the hell out of em. They look amazing to me!!! IMO a bagel should have a little color and a chewy crust and tender center . There are lots of opinions and tastes for bagels just like there are pizzas!!!
From the looks of yours……….I’ll take anyone of those with a good schmear of cream cheese and some Lake Michigan smoked salmon or a plain one toasted and loaded with butter and a little peanut butter!!! Also fond of a schmear and topped with a cranberry compote or cranberry relish around Thanksgiving!!!
I would say Bagels are one of my favorites, but Fig would probably hand my ass to me…..again!!!
If yours taste half as good as they look, Don’t you dare change anything!!!
BTW, I’ll take 2 dozen!!!
Slammer!!!

Edited by - slammer on 10/18/2021 18:43:31

Oct 18, 2021 - 7:07 PM
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493 posts since 10/18/2020

quote:
Originally posted by Good Buddy

I recently started baking bagels in a lye solution and it has given them such a delicious taste and texture, but I can't remember how they tasted when I was in New York...all I know is they were great. My question is, are the delicious NY bagels dark in color or pale in color? Lye makes bagels dark like pretzels, well not that dark, but pretty dark. And it gives them a certain crunch and chewiness at the same time. Some say good NY style bagels need to be boiled in lye and others say in sugar water. I would like to know because I'm not returning to NYC any time soon. Thanks. Feel free to relate any bagel related stories.

 


Cant answer your question but those in your photo look goooooood

forgot i will take 8 dozen if you dont mind LOL

Edited by - Don Smith1959 on 10/18/2021 19:10:34

Oct 18, 2021 - 7:36:14 PM
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bubbalouie

Canada

15496 posts since 9/27/2007

I've been following your posts on pretzels as we tried them too. They turned out great! We used a soda water bath.

Terry has been keeping her sourdough going pre pandemic. She made a pumpkin spice chocolate chip bundt cake yesterday. I tried some of the trimmings but way too sweet for me!  When we were looking into pretzels we notice bagels were made the same. I'll have to talk her into trying them!

https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2014/08/09/338591194/for-a-proper-pretzel-crust-count-on-chemistry-and-memories

Edited by - bubbalouie on 10/18/2021 19:36:41

Oct 19, 2021 - 7:38:20 AM
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rinemb

USA

14128 posts since 5/24/2005

Real NY bagels are no longer real. They are as big as volkswagon tires, big holes, very little chew, and not the surface you get with a lye water bath. I think to get them that big they now roll a long rope and connect the ends, instead of shaping a ball and using your fingers to make a small hole that mostly fills in when cooking.
And even Lenders did away with their little frozen bagels, (at least we cant find them) that were the size of sliders not the size of a large burger bun.
Most of what I know about NY bagels are from my wife and MIL (she grew up in a couple of NYC boroughs.
We keep ordering at great expense old family made bagels in NY, and they ain't the same. Wife just bought some foods overnighted from Katz, same dissappointment. Panera's ahve better bagels then NYC, but that is not saying much. Sorry, NYC
I bought the container of lye to make bagels and pretzels. I have done the pretzels, and next time in town we will make our own "old fashion/real" bagels.
Ok, I am done with my rant. Brad

Oct 19, 2021 - 7:39:23 AM
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rinemb

USA

14128 posts since 5/24/2005

quote:
Originally posted by Good Buddy

I recently started baking bagels in a lye solution and it has given them such a delicious taste and texture, but I can't remember how they tasted when I was in New York...all I know is they were great. My question is, are the delicious NY bagels dark in color or pale in color? Lye makes bagels dark like pretzels, well not that dark, but pretty dark. And it gives them a certain crunch and chewiness at the same time. Some say good NY style bagels need to be boiled in lye and others say in sugar water. I would like to know because I'm not returning to NYC any time soon. Thanks. Feel free to relate any bagel related stories.

 


Those look good to me.  Congrats.  brad

Oct 19, 2021 - 11:54:57 AM
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889 posts since 10/4/2018

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess I stick to this baking technique and experiment a bit. In case anyone is interested: I have tried the sugar bath in the past, which was actually malted barley syrup and/or molasses with salt mixed in 2-1/2 qt of boiling water. I also just stopped using the baked baking soda method that Bubba was talking about....1/4 cup of baking soda that had been baked at 200F for 1 hour, mixed into water and brought to a boil. Now I take the same amount of water along with 2 TBS of Food Grade Lye powder and bring that to a boil. This technique tastes and looks the best. As far as making the dough goes, it takes at least three days to make. On the first day, I mix equal amounts of water and flour and add in a tablespoon of starter. I let this stand over night, covered on the kitchen counter. The next day, I mix the dough ingredients along with the previous night's preferment and after it has doubled (sometimes I just leave it in the fridge over night), I stretch and fold it every half hour for two and a half hours. Then I shape the dough and leave it overnight in the fridge again and in the morning it is ready for boiling.

I wish I could send you guys some, because they are just as delicious as they look. 8 dozen would take me a long time to make, since I only make a dozen at a time. Enjoy your bagels everyone!

p.s. I made a garden/herb shmear with produce from my garden and it is wonderful with these bagels. I make Plain, Sesame, Everything, and Asiago bagels, sometimes Onion bagels as well.

Edited by - Good Buddy on 10/19/2021 11:55:50

Oct 19, 2021 - 4:51:30 PM
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slammer

USA

3387 posts since 12/30/2008

Mike, I have nothing but time on my hands and don’t mind a 8 dozen wait time !!! LOL
Onion bagel with schmear for me please!!! Enjoy the hell out of them as they Really do look great!!!
Slammer!!!

Oct 19, 2021 - 6:16:07 PM
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bubbalouie

Canada

15496 posts since 9/27/2007

Mike! Our pretzels were pretty good but they didn't have that malt taste like in the skinny store bought ones in a plastic bag. I did see about using molasses & we always have some in the back of the fridge.

I will look into malted barley syrup too. Ran the bagel idea past head office. Will keep you posted.

Oct 19, 2021 - 6:44:27 PM
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889 posts since 10/4/2018

quote:
Originally posted by bubbalouie

Mike! Our pretzels were pretty good but they didn't have that malt taste like in the skinny store bought ones in a plastic bag. I did see about using molasses & we always have some in the back of the fridge.

I will look into malted barley syrup too. Ran the bagel idea past head office. Will keep you posted.

 


I got a bag of Larissa Veronica Malted Barley Flour through Walmart delivered to my house, that puts in the barley flavor in my bagels. I put in 1 TBS into 800g bread flour or 1/2 TBS per loaf of bread that I make. I got malted barley syrup through Breadtopia.com. You also can find bread flour with barley flour in it, look at the ingredients on the bag of flour you buy. The local supermarket stopped carrying the brand with the malt barley flour included in the bread flour. I want to say White Lily unbleached bread flour, but I'm not positive.

Oct 19, 2021 - 6:58:12 PM
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bubbalouie

Canada

15496 posts since 9/27/2007

If we keep this up we might be able to flush out an old member that was an expert baker on here BConk.

He was into sourdough & old style bread making.

Oct 19, 2021 - 7:24:48 PM
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Brian T

Canada

18866 posts since 6/5/2008

BConk was running on a wild yeast that I recall he cultivated off some grapes.
Had a jar in his fridge to work out of for his "boules."
I wanted a piece of it but before that could happen, his culture died.
He kind of lost enthusiasm, I think. It was a magnificent yeast.

Ever since, I have been rolling bunches of my own (organic) grapes in sugar water, hoping to pick up a wild yeast. Not a dang thing has ever happened. Like my grapes are bleach sterilized. I can't even grow nasty stuff.

Oct 20, 2021 - 4:44:45 AM
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rinemb

USA

14128 posts since 5/24/2005

I did learn, I have to be much more careful about slinging lye water around the kitchen. Got some on one of my wife's tablecloths, stained a pan, burned my wrists-above my gloves, etc. But I still have 2 lbs of lye granules to use up. except for the bit I poured down the drain since it was in hand.
My bagel adventure is next. brad

Oct 20, 2021 - 1:01:15 PM
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12427 posts since 6/2/2008

quote:
Originally posted by rinemb

Real NY bagels are no longer real. They are as big as volkswagon tires, big holes, very little chew, and not the surface you get with a lye water bath.


Maybe a lot of them. But not all.

During my brief 3-year relocation to Prospect Heights, Brooklyn, 2013-16, I discovered Bagel Hole in Park Slope. Old fashioned small bagels. Looked and tasted authentic to me. But what do I know. I grew up in the Maryland suburbs of DC. In the '50s and '60s our bagels came from either Posin's or Katz's kosher supermarkets in the District or Wheaton. They probably came from Baltimore or maybe New York. I think it was many years before there were bagel shops.

Bagel Hole was 1-1/4 miles from our apartment and not a convenient walk just to grab a few. And not worth driving and losing a parking space! So I only had theirs a few times. Our usual source was Bergen Bagels, near Barclays Center. 10-minute walk. They looked and tasted right, but were the modern-day large size. I really don't know when or why bagels got big.

These days, our main go-to is Goldberg's New York Bagels, a few few miles away in Silver Spring, Maryland. From this picture, their bagel appears to be not too big:

Pretty authentic. Closed Friday afternoon and Saturday. Line out the door Sunday morning.

Oct 20, 2021 - 3:48:29 PM
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rinemb

USA

14128 posts since 5/24/2005

Ken, I am forwarding your source for "old" style bagels to my wife. I am sure she will be ordering some by morning. Thanks, Brad

Oct 21, 2021 - 6:02:33 PM
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12427 posts since 6/2/2008

I'm on the hook now!

I have no idea how they hold up to being shipped half way across the country.

First time I bought them, I was on my way from Brooklyn to an annual poker game in south-central Pennsylvania, so they only had to stay fresh in a paper bag overnight. And they did.

Oct 21, 2021 - 6:43 PM
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44 posts since 1/25/2021

About time a NYCer stepped in here.
Your lye bagels look right. Mazel.
Of course the real trick is in the texture and taste. If you can get that in a photo, show me how.

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