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Jan 21, 2021 - 2:07:32 PM
13383 posts since 6/29/2005

I know that Gibson started using some kind of black composite material for peghead veneers quite a while back. 

Does anyone know what it was and whether it's still available?

Thanks,

Ken

Jan 21, 2021 - 4:31:13 PM
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beegee

USA

22179 posts since 7/6/2005

Jan 21, 2021 - 5:42:41 PM

13383 posts since 6/29/2005

quote:
Originally posted by beegee

fiber overlay


Thanks!

I thought it was something like that—is it readily available?

Jan 21, 2021 - 6:26:18 PM

roydsjr

USA

706 posts since 5/17/2007

The answer Bob gave is a clickable link and it goes to Amazon.com that has it for $14.95 and free shipping.

Jan 22, 2021 - 3:54:42 AM

13383 posts since 6/29/2005

quote:
Originally posted by roydsjr

The answer Bob gave is a clickable link and it goes to Amazon.com that has it for $14.95 and free shipping.


Thanks—I hadn't realized that was a link.  I notice it comes in different thicknesses. I'll certainly give it a try.

Jan 22, 2021 - 6:28:01 AM

11479 posts since 6/2/2008

The description makes me think it's the same this fiber veneer sold by LMII. If that's the case, then note LMII's comment that it doesn't sand well.

This stuff is used for layering. It creates purfling through exposed edges. It's the sides that scrape well.

Jan 22, 2021 - 6:37:59 AM

13383 posts since 6/29/2005

quote:
Originally posted by Old Hickory

The description makes me think it's the same this fiber veneer sold by LMII. If that's the case, then note LMII's comment that it doesn't sand well.

This stuff is used for layering. It creates purfling through exposed edges. It's the sides that scrape well.


Trying to get away from using wood for black peghead veneers, and I'm trying to find the same stuff that Gibson has used in the past, as I am first using it on a J-45 peghead. The only other thing I find is black ABS, which would be problematic in several ways.  

I ordered a piece of the fiber stuff in 2mm and am going to try to plane it down to .060", which is the thickness of my inlays.  We'll see if it will plane—if not, I wasted $20.

Edited by - Ken LeVan on 01/22/2021 06:38:35

Jan 22, 2021 - 6:56:10 AM
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beegee

USA

22179 posts since 7/6/2005

quote:
Originally posted by Ken LeVan
quote:
Originally posted by Old Hickory

The description makes me think it's the same this fiber veneer sold by LMII. If that's the case, then note LMII's comment that it doesn't sand well.

This stuff is used for layering. It creates purfling through exposed edges. It's the sides that scrape well.


Trying to get away from using wood for black peghead veneers, and I'm trying to find the same stuff that Gibson has used in the past, as I am first using it on a J-45 peghead. The only other thing I find is black ABS, which would be problematic in several ways.  

I ordered a piece of the fiber stuff in 2mm and am going to try to plane it down to .060", which is the thickness of my inlays.  We'll see if it will plane—if not, I wasted $20.


Not a waste of $$....tuition in the School of Hard Knocks

Jan 22, 2021 - 10:51:29 AM

11479 posts since 6/2/2008

Don't know if these guys know what they're talking about, but someone in this discussion on a guitar forum says the material is plasticized fiber. Someone else says it's Micarta.

Jan 22, 2021 - 11:12:17 AM

11479 posts since 6/2/2008

Don't know if the person on the previously linked guitar forum was correct about the overlay being Micarta. But if you want to try that stuff, here's a sheet that might produce two overlays for $4.49.

Edited: my arithmetic is bad. Pegheads would have to be short to get two.

Edited by - Old Hickory on 01/22/2021 11:14:21

Jan 22, 2021 - 1:03:33 PM

rcc56

USA

3325 posts since 2/20/2016

Why don't you just use a piece of plain maple or birch and dye it black? The cost is lower.

Jan 22, 2021 - 2:06:27 PM

13383 posts since 6/29/2005

That's what I've been doing all along for upwards of 50 years.  If it's a peghead where you see the wood and the wood is part of the design, then, of course, I use wood.

If it's just a black peghead, then what it's made of is of no importance—black is black—over the years, I have used cherry, applewood, walnut, and mahogany dyed black—probably others, and even ebony, but it's a waste of ebony, and I no longer use endangered wood, certainly not on a black peghead.

The way I make peghead veneers nowadays is by cutting the inlay from .060" or thereabouts material and cutting a matching hole all the way through the peghead veneer, putting in the inlay, and filling the gaps with black epoxy or something similar.  Some of my peghead inlays are magnesium or copper, which is .060".  It helps o if the veneer material is the same thickness as the inlay

In researching the SJ-Country Western guitar (and I am working on a couple as a "background project"), I came across this shot from the Gibson Montana factory—the veneer is some kind of black fiber material—it looks so nice and flat, looks like it glues, looks like you could cut out the inlay outline with a jeweler's saw or scroll saw without it breaking along the grain, and you could flatten it level with the inlay without baring the wood by sanding through the stain and then have to painstakingly stain it around the inlay, looks like it would take finish—solves a multitude of problems for me for black pegheads—probably why Gibson used it.

Jan 22, 2021 - 3:07:01 PM

DRH

USA

591 posts since 5/29/2018

Those Gibson overlays look like black Garolite. McMaster Carr sells several types of Garolite. It was/is commonly called phenolic among engineers, though the Garolite brand now includes grades that use epoxy.

Jan 22, 2021 - 5:12:17 PM

13383 posts since 6/29/2005

quote:
Originally posted by DRH

Those Gibson overlays look like black Garolite. McMaster Carr sells several types of Garolite. It was/is commonly called phenolic among engineers, though the Garolite brand now includes grades that use epoxy.


Thanks Doug,

I'll look that up.  I have used phenolic for a number of things including lathe faceplates. The kind I am familiar with is extremely hard.

Ken

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