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Sep 22, 2020 - 10:04:25 AM
174 posts since 3/16/2008

Hi Everybody,

I have a banjo rim with a wooden tone ring that has been cut for a one piece flange. Is it possible to recut the rim so that it could be made into an openback?

I'm guessing that the answer is "No" because doing so would make an 11" tone hoop not fit properly, but I may be overthinking or under-thinking it. Not sure which!

I don't know if it helps or not, but I have attached a photo.

Thanks for helping me think it through!

All the Best, Ron


Sep 22, 2020 - 10:12:28 AM
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1588 posts since 10/12/2011

Re-cut, probably no.  You can make it an open back, but you would need to find a bracket band to replace the flange. The band I'm thinking of is the same dimensions as a OPF but with out the flange part. To bad you didn't have a TPF that would be easy. I recall seeing a flange like I mentioned but I can't recall where I saw one. Worst case is that you could find a OPF that fits your banjo and cut off the flange part leaving the bead so your hooks have something to mount to.

Edited by - buckholler on 09/22/2020 10:13:48

Sep 22, 2020 - 10:18:53 AM

174 posts since 3/16/2008

Ah, thanks Scott. I didn't consider that option. I'll have to look around a little and see if there is anything like a bracket band for sale.

Sep 22, 2020 - 10:27:10 AM
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11135 posts since 6/2/2008
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Contact Bill Rickard. He might have one of his discontinue bracket bands still in stock. They have a 10-3/4 inch inside diameter with no step inside.

If your rim is cut for 10-11/16 flange, it will probably work because the top of the brack flange will press up against the ledge of wood that has an 11-inch outside diameter.

If your rim is cut for 10-13/16 flange, it probably won't work because the 10-3/4 inch bracket flange won't fit. You can easily and inexpensively get the rim trimmed a little.

Another option is to get a one-piece flange and cut it down so all that's left is a ring with hook holes. Lots of sawing and filing, but it's doable.

Sep 22, 2020 - 10:45:03 AM
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1269 posts since 2/9/2007

Sep 22, 2020 - 10:54:49 AM

174 posts since 3/16/2008

Old Hickory, I wrote to Bill so we'll see what he thinks.

Dan Gellert I like that, but it would definitely be beyond my ability to make such a thing!

Sep 22, 2020 - 11:22:19 AM
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3338 posts since 5/29/2011
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When Bill still sold his bracket flange you could have a fine rim turned for about the same cost. That might be your best bet. Save the rim you have for a resonator banjo.

Sep 22, 2020 - 11:52:02 AM
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Players Union Member

Blackjaxe47

Canada

1559 posts since 6/20/2014

Ken LeVan might be the other source to contact. He uses bracket bands on a lot of his builds and he is a member here.

Sep 22, 2020 - 1:50:01 PM

174 posts since 3/16/2008

Bill's shop doesn't make them any more. Ken LeVan ? Do you have any thoughts?

Sep 22, 2020 - 1:59:38 PM
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13207 posts since 6/29/2005

quote:
Originally posted by rooksbay

Bill's shop doesn't make them any more. Ken LeVan ? Do you have any thoughts?


I did some kind of post on this way back—a rim cut for a OPF is a perfect candidate for a bracket band—that would be the way to convert it to an openback—I think I showed pictures of it.  The bracket band would have to be fitted to the rim.

Ken

Sep 22, 2020 - 2:30:38 PM
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Helix

USA

12937 posts since 8/30/2006

I’ve used five of Bills short shoulder flanges which are steel. I still use one

I bought 3 broken Pre war pot metal flanges. You cut them on the band saw

If you’ll contact me off forum we can discuss

They weigh less than a pound and you can still use a variety of resonator mounts or magnet mount

Or you can explore what suits you

B bands have their fans .  I would not put one on a bluegrass rim

I think it's better to go for the best personal sound rather than equipment that may or may not produce for you, the player

and yes that is a Cherry archtop woody 


 

Edited by - Helix on 09/22/2020 14:40:33

Sep 22, 2020 - 2:39:32 PM

174 posts since 3/16/2008

That's a cool idea, Larry!

Sep 22, 2020 - 2:51:43 PM
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Helix

USA

12937 posts since 8/30/2006

Thank you because it requires no cutting

Another way would be to steam a slat 1/8” x 2” x 34.55” Into a 10” diameter circle and restore the thickness of the lower part of the rim

Maple does this well, so do Poplar and Alder
Remove the finish below the ledge and Glue the strip in place
That’s why my suggestion just to use a modified pre-war metallurgical specimen


 

Sep 22, 2020 - 3:21:59 PM
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Fathand

Canada

11662 posts since 2/7/2008

Alternative to a bracket band is glue a strip of about 1/8" wood to the narrow part of the rim and then turn or sand it til the ring is one consistent diameter.
Cheaper and lighter but more labour than a bracket band.

 

Oops! Helix just said this.

Edited by - Fathand on 09/22/2020 15:23:18

Sep 22, 2020 - 3:27:47 PM
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187 posts since 11/29/2012

Gold Tone sells one with the shoes and bolts $72:

goldtonemusicgroup.com/goldton...rts/b1163


 

Edited by - 35planar on 09/22/2020 15:29:17

Sep 22, 2020 - 3:38:40 PM
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174 posts since 3/16/2008

Thanks, Mark!

Sep 22, 2020 - 3:49:59 PM
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187 posts since 11/29/2012

Not certain what the measurements are, but I think if you email or call, they respond.

Sep 23, 2020 - 9:26:46 AM
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Helix

USA

12937 posts since 8/30/2006

Gold Tones are Gibson spacing and friendly so yes it is compatible

Still interested in what you the player chooses

Sep 23, 2020 - 9:45:43 AM

174 posts since 3/16/2008

Helix

I'm going to have to mull it over some. I never liked the way the bubinga (sp?) sounded when it was on a resonator banjo, so I'm not 100% sure I want to invest a lot, but I hate having unused parts around too, and I suspect it could sound exactly right in a non bluegrass kind of banjo. So the itch to tinker is there.

I guess the goldtone would be a nice balance between the cheaper option and less time intensive too.

Edited by - rooksbay on 09/23/2020 09:59:07

Sep 23, 2020 - 10:49:18 AM
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11135 posts since 6/2/2008
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Another idea: Create a tube-retaining bead by gluing, nailing or screwing a band of wood around the currently exposed band, then use the tube portion of a two-piece, tube and plate, flange to assemble the pot. 

You can also rout a channel all around the rim and set the new bead into that, but that's a more serious endeavor.

Sep 23, 2020 - 4:28:05 PM
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Helix

USA

12937 posts since 8/30/2006

I tinkered my way into a trademark

The Gold Tone band looks good but what length hooks?

Tube banjos are the most wood in a banjo rim
They are upside down
I bought tubes on line
I have a tube roller and have rolled 3/8” red brass pipe
But the chrome plated steel pipe is still available from suppliers as I understand
Wooden flanges with Radial pieces too short to flex I think are in the archives

Sep 24, 2020 - 8:40:51 PM
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11135 posts since 6/2/2008
Online Now

quote:
Originally posted by Helix

the chrome plated steel pipe is still available from suppliers as I understand


This eBay seller almost always has one for sale. I bought one for my long-delayed open back project.

In a pinch, you can buy a complete two-piece flange. Sell the plate part if you're certain you won't need it.

Sep 25, 2020 - 5:44:46 AM
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174 posts since 3/16/2008

Hey, Thanks Ken!

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