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Department of Motor Vehicles-- - Arrrgh!/ OK Now!!

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Sep 17, 2020 - 10:20:22 AM
55717 posts since 12/14/2005

I read SOMEWHERE that the best time for DMV stuff is middle of the week, middle of the month.
So, Mary and I plotted this VERY carefully.

She even got her printer working, so she could print out her insurance info.
That took half an hour, Tues night.

I got to the DMV office in the strip mall, in MY car, at 7AM, Wednesday. Brought a folding chair.

There were already about SIXTY people in line.
A lady came out, set up a card table, and started checking people in, and had them stand in another line, still outside.
But at least it wasn't raining or too hot.

The line shuffled along, and, when I got about 10 people from the card table, I called Mary.
Then I sat there, and told the people in line to shuffle on past, since I was just saving a spot for my GIRL FRIEND.

Girl Friend showed up.
I gave her the chair, said I was heading for McDonald's, a block away, to get us a couple coffees and use the restroom.
That only took a few minutes, but by the time I got back, Mary was already INSIDE the building, getting it DONE.
About 10 minutes later, she was out.
Not bad. Quick and polite.


BUT it was not done.
They told her, quickly and politely, the following:
The insurance printout wasn't acceptable evidence of insurance, although they COULD have called the insurance company and asked!
AND, even though they told her-LAST time- that she did not need her birth certificate, they wanted it THIS time.
Date of birth was on her POT medical card, her MO driver's license, and her PASSPORT, but that wasn't good enough.
They want her birth certificate.
Which, of course, does not have her CURRENT last name on it!! (Married, over a half century ago!!)
So, here's my Thought Experiment:

Imagine being in Eastern Europe.
You come to the border of some Commie dictatorship.

 



A couple mean-looking guards, with automatic rifles and a bee-gas DOG demand that you step out of the vehicle and SHOW THEM YOU PASSPORT. You do, they take turns SCOWLING at it, and then....they wave you through!
It's good enough for the Evil Minions of a ruthless Commie Dictator, but it ain't good enough for the ILLINOIS DMV!!

What the hell, ain'a.....

Edited by - mike gregory on 09/23/2020 11:19:18

Sep 17, 2020 - 10:51:21 AM

Omeboy

USA

2582 posts since 6/27/2013

Did you go to the Illinois DMV website to see exactly what they required of you before you went there? In Indiana, that saves a person from having a bad experience.

Sep 17, 2020 - 10:58:30 AM
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Owen

Canada

6489 posts since 6/5/2011

Over the past few months our son has been going thru "the dance" of getting pretty well all of his "lost" ID and associated stuff replaced.  He found a stark contrast in peoples' willingness to be helpful..... MUCH better in small(er) towns than in in small or medium sized cities.   The propensity to flaunt authority, relegate common sense to the round file, or just be plain dick-headed was 'way greater in the city.    [Yes indeed, "Aarrrgh! matey."]

Edited by - Owen on 09/17/2020 11:05:19

Sep 17, 2020 - 11:11:55 AM

DRH

USA

549 posts since 5/29/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Omeboy

Did you go to the Illinois DMV website to see exactly what they required of you before you went there? In Indiana, that saves a person from having a bad experience.


If IL is anything like GA then the requirements are arbitrary.   I've never had to produce my birth certificate.  The GADMV website didn't say anything about birth certs, yet my wife gets the same abuse every time she goes in for renewal.  It's a consequence of looking foreign, I guess.

OTOH, Jennie goes through airport security unscathed.  I get frisked every time. 

Sep 17, 2020 - 11:44:03 AM

Texasbanjo (Moderator)

USA

24969 posts since 8/3/2003

In Texas, before Covid, you could make an appointment and be in and out in about an hour. If you didn't have an appointment, most people ended up sitting there for maybe 3 or 4 hours. I went last January, couldn't get an appointment, so was prepared to sit and wait. There was a nice lady there that asked if I was a senior citizen (she couldn't tell by the gray hair and wrinkles?) and when I said yes, she gave me a different colored ticket and said that number was for seniors and my wait shouldn't be long. It wasn't. I was in and out in less than an hour. I had my driver's license, insurance card and birth certificate (which I didn't need), and that was enough. They took my picture and my money and I was on my way.

Nowadays, you have to make an appointment either by phone (impossible) or on the internet (almost impossible) and if you do get through finally, usually have to wait 2 to 3 months for an appointment. My daughter and her husband have been waiting since June and have an appointment early in October. Both their licenses will be expired by that time, but because of Covid, they will be able to renew without having to take a written or driving test. He's a truck driver, so he was sweating his CDL license.

What a difference a few months makes, huh?

Sep 17, 2020 - 12:46:13 PM

Bill Rogers (Moderator)

USA

23973 posts since 6/25/2005

Why are state DMVs all seemingly bureaucratic nightmares? Must be something about the nature of what they do.

Sep 17, 2020 - 1:15:52 PM

5787 posts since 9/5/2006

in the closest town to us if you don't arrive 1 1/2 to 2 hours before opening,, plan on several hours of waiting,, this is the drivers license office. the office with tags is not quite as bad ,,,,,, depending on the day. ..but the drivers license office is a nightmare.

Sep 17, 2020 - 2:23:43 PM

Lynne (Moderator)

USA

5068 posts since 3/3/2003

When we moved from Calif to Arizona we went into the DMV without an appointment.
We registered 3 cars, and both of us got the new travel drivers license.
It took less then an hour. BUT that was 2 years ago I understand it takes quite a while to get an appointment and then a very long wait.

Sep 17, 2020 - 2:28:06 PM
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10260 posts since 2/22/2007

Bill R asked ----"Why are state DMVs all seemingly bureaucratic nightmares? ---"

They are merely the only bureaucracy that almost everyone has to deal with. Ever dealt with codes dept? Business license? Liquor board? Insurance board? Tried to get an environmental impact certificate? Talk about bureaucratic nightmares! And you are always dealing with indifferent employees who cannot be fired and whose job performance will not impact their salaries or career advancement.
One of my main objections to the proposals of the left to put the state in charge of everything is that they would turn all of life into a bad day at the DMV.

Sep 17, 2020 - 2:49:42 PM

QldPicker

Australia

87 posts since 4/17/2020

This is a really dumb question and NOT in any way to be taken as a criticism.

Why is necessary to physically front up to renew vehicle registration/insurance?

Here in Oz it can all be done online. The process can be done at a customer centre, however most people do not venture there UNLESS there is some specific problem that cannot be dealt with online.

Sep 17, 2020 - 3:03:57 PM

Owen

Canada

6489 posts since 6/5/2011

Bill-e... not everybody "on the left" advocates that the state be in charge of "everything," ...unless we're still in logical fallacy territory.     In that vein, sometimes, I look at it as choosing between being screwed by bureaucratic bungling/incompetence or being screwed by design by private enterprise.  wink

Sep 17, 2020 - 3:06:08 PM

55717 posts since 12/14/2005

She moved from Missouri to Illinois, and apparently NEEDS a local license.
her old one HAS expired.
She was there some time ago, and had everything INCLUDING birth certificate, EXCEPT for social security CARD ( if I remember her story right).
And they told her- back THEN-that she didn't need the birth certificate, but DID need the SS card, not just tell them the number.

I'll ask her in more detail, when next we meet.

Sep 17, 2020 - 3:24:59 PM
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10260 posts since 2/22/2007

Owen, I do understand that sentiment, but with corporations we usually have a choice of who we deal with or if we will have to deal with anybody at all. With the government there are no options. And most businesses have some need to please their customers in order to retain them. Again, with the gov we get no choice.
And if you do find a private enterprise who operates with the same disdain and disregard for customers as does the government, then often it is due to an actual or virtual monopoly, and that monopoly can only be created by government regulation. A true Free Market must cater to it's customers.

I must say that I do encounter some helpful friendly people working in government offices. But that is due to their individual natures. The system itself does not reward or encourage this and most importantly, does not penalize the lack of helpfulness.

Sep 17, 2020 - 3:42:22 PM

Owen

Canada

6489 posts since 6/5/2011

...then private insurance companies [for one example] up here are not operating in a true free market.  I've found that they'll jerk a guy around secure in the knowledge that they're all operating pretty much the same and the policyholders switching companies very likely evens out in the long run.  But, I do get your theoretical stance.... too bad it doesn't play out that way more often.

Edit: Appliance  and furniture companies up here apparently use the same play-book as the insurance companies..... customer service.... what's that??  I could go on...and on...and on... but I have a niggling suspicion that it wouldn't do a whole lot of good.   FWIW, I advocate some sort of balance.

Edit #2: ...add grain companies to the list.... I haven't kept tabs since I quit farming in 2000, but I doubt they've done a 180 after 100+ years of a very successful (?) business model.

Edited by - Owen on 09/17/2020 15:55:39

Sep 17, 2020 - 4:18:22 PM

5787 posts since 9/5/2006

quote:
Originally posted by QldPicker

This is a really dumb question and NOT in any way to be taken as a criticism.

Why is necessary to physically front up to renew vehicle registration/insurance?

Here in Oz it can all be done online. The process can be done at a customer centre, however most people do not venture there UNLESS there is some specific problem that cannot be dealt with online.


in my state you can do a normal yearly registration online... it takes about 2 to 3 weeks to get. you must first get your car to pass inspection and then it goes in the system. once in the system you can renew.  tags and taxes are paid at the same time on renewal,,along with providing proof of insurance,,,which is normally on the registration card.

Sep 17, 2020 - 5:36:16 PM

2317 posts since 7/20/2004

Here in Iowa all you need to renew your license, or change your in state residence is your old valid license. Vehicle annual registration can be done by mail or online. I had to renew my DL this month. Made an appointment and was in and out in 15 minutes.

Sep 17, 2020 - 5:55:03 PM
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bubbalouie

Canada

14254 posts since 9/27/2007

Sep 18, 2020 - 8:42:10 AM

Texasbanjo (Moderator)

USA

24969 posts since 8/3/2003

Update on getting your license changed to another state and renewed.

My daughter and her husband went to the DMV per their appointment and it was a fiasco. They got there and didn't have to wait too long, but then the problems began. They needed my daughter's wedding certificate (she's been married for 15 years), which she didn't have, and her birth certificate (which she didn't have). She had her driver's license from another state, her proof of insurance, her proof of residence and looks like that should have been enough, right? Wrong.

Her husband also had problems as one of his information IDs had a different address than the rest so they wouldn't renew his license. He has to go back to the bank and have them change the address to his current one.

And can they get this information and go back today? Oh, no, they had to get on the internet and make another appointment..... 6 weeks from now.

Really? I just don't understand why it's so difficult moving from state to state and trying to do what is right; i.e., transfer your license.

Sep 18, 2020 - 9:14:14 AM

2176 posts since 1/16/2010

I do it all “online”. I’ll never waste my time going into a DMV office again...negative on all aspects in there.

Heck Mike, with all the time you spend online...it ought to be a sinch to figure out and do...if that’s even an option.

I just renewed our tabs online and in 3 days they arrived at my house in the mail. Pretty convenient.

Dow

Sep 18, 2020 - 9:48:16 AM

Paul R

Canada

13201 posts since 1/28/2010

We go to the Service Ontario office. Go in, get in line (five to ten minutes - right away if it's not crowded), get a number from reception, find a seat and wait for your number to be called. Maybe twenty minutes - depending upon the size of the crowd. Could be less. When your number is called go to the wicket shown on the screens. For plate sticker renewal (every two years) show your insurance and registration. Show your Drive Clean inspection if needed (every five years). Driver's license, show your old one. Have your letter of renewal (that they sent you) with you, filled in. Health card (we have universal health care) and driver's license renewal (both every five years) usually come up at the same time (expiry, renewal dates on your birthday). Service Ontario does more than just drivers. Stand against the white background while the clerk takes your photo. They punch a hole in your old license. Get your temporary i.d. and go home. The new cards will come in the mail. I don't know that I've spent more than forty-five minutes to an hour getting stuff done there.

Edited by - Paul R on 09/18/2020 09:53:04

Sep 18, 2020 - 10:22:50 AM

Buddur

USA

2808 posts since 10/23/2004

Do you have AAA? If so, make an appointment and go to one of their offices.

Or, like Dow said, do it online.

Sep 18, 2020 - 10:46:32 AM

587 posts since 8/14/2018

quote:
Originally posted by mike gregory

I read SOMEWHERE that the best time for DMV stuff is middle of the week, middle of the month.
So, Mary and I plotted this VERY carefully.


Here in MA, during the plague times, you need an actual appointment to visit the RMV. And in non-plague times, you're better off doing as much as possible online or by mail and only doing actual visits when essential. It's far easier to deal with than the old days when everything had to be done in person.

The RMV here has a pretty extensive web page detailing what forms of paperwork are acceptable as id. You can easily check before you go. Probably what caught you up is that states are pushing to make their licenses function as federal 'RealID' cards, which have stricter documentation requirements than a regular driver's license. That's why they would have wanted a birth certificate, to show citizenship/legal residence.

Edited by - MacCruiskeen on 09/18/2020 10:48:08

Sep 18, 2020 - 6:38:42 PM

1194 posts since 8/7/2017

My thoughts about all the papers required to renew driver's license:
In the US, the driver's license is the equivalent to a passport in other countries. Once you got it, you can use it to prove all sorts of things to other people who question your identity.

This does not in any way excuse the execrable service we have all experienced in dealing with the "Govment". I'm with BanjoBill-e with this one. Of course, if you have No choice, you get bad behaviour from petty tyrants, no matter who signs their paycheck. I saw this in Bozeman: after Walmart built a store here, the local store clerks all of a sudden became helpful :-) It was really noticeable.

Sep 19, 2020 - 4:42:35 AM

Texasbanjo (Moderator)

USA

24969 posts since 8/3/2003

quote:
Originally posted by Texican65

I do it all “online”. I’ll never waste my time going into a DMV office again...negative on all aspects in there.

Heck Mike, with all the time you spend online...it ought to be a sinch to figure out and do...if that’s even an option.

I just renewed our tabs online and in 3 days they arrived at my house in the mail. Pretty convenient.

Dow


Not everyone CAN do it online.  Many  people aren't computer savvy/don't have a computer at all.   When you get my age, you can renew on line once and the next time your license renewal comes up you HAVE to do it in person, they won't take online renewal. 

Sep 19, 2020 - 6:35:09 AM
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Owen

Canada

6489 posts since 6/5/2011

quote:
Originally posted by BrooksMT

<snip> This does not in any way excuse the execrable service we have all experienced in dealing with the "Govment". I'm with BanjoBill-e with this one. Of course, if you have No choice, you get bad behaviour from petty tyrants, no matter who signs their paycheck. I saw this in Bozeman: after Walmart built a store here, the local store clerks all of a sudden became helpful :-) It was really noticeable.


Brooks, what's your plan of action when the private enterprise petty tyrants don't follow the theoretical model?   [Please don't tell me to spend $10,000-$12,000 on a lawyer to collect $7000.... been there, done that; and I think m-a-n-y others have as well.]

And while we're extrapolating, here's another one.  Back when I was trying to farm, any small business that I used in Yorkton, SK would accept a personal cheque... no questions, so I assume it must have been my honest face.   Soon after Superstore, and one other big outfit [possibly Wal-mart, I don't recall] set up shop, with their secure (?) payment systems, etc., all of a sudden my face, and the faces of many others, wasn't so honest looking anymore.  FWIW, up here I didn't notice any change in the "helpfulness" of small merchants or their clerks.   Go figure.

Edit: Sherry, your daughter's experience sounds similar to my son's.... in the city.  B-i-g difference in smaller towns.   The policies (?) seem to differ widely even from office to office..... not just gov't. agencies, but banks as well.

Edited by - Owen on 09/19/2020 06:40:27

Sep 19, 2020 - 7:09:43 AM

55717 posts since 12/14/2005

ILLofNOISE State Law is different from many of the laws in the states cited by several of you..
And OF COURSE, one cannot take the ROAD TEST (which IL requires for persons of a certain age) online.

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