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Feb 23, 2020 - 12:51:31 PM
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donc

Canada

6209 posts since 2/9/2010

My sister the family historian still has the factory invoice complete with an owner's manual. This was 8 years before any public medical system existed in Canada so my dad got billed.




Edited by - donc on 02/23/2020 12:56:43

Feb 23, 2020 - 1:04:26 PM
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chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

A bargain basement price....

Feb 23, 2020 - 1:43:10 PM
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9290 posts since 8/22/2006

You just don’t get much for your money now days.

Feb 23, 2020 - 2:43:48 PM
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1517 posts since 11/17/2018

I wonder what the final cost was for your parents for maintenance and upkeep until you moved out.

Feb 23, 2020 - 2:59:59 PM
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Mooooo

USA

7614 posts since 8/20/2016

Was there a warranty or return policy?

Feb 23, 2020 - 4:00:16 PM

donc

Canada

6209 posts since 2/9/2010

I noticed that it took close to 3 months to pay all of this bill.

Feb 23, 2020 - 6:21:49 PM
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Paul R

Canada

12438 posts since 1/28/2010

quote:
Originally posted by Mooooo

Was there a warranty or return policy?


And have your warranties expired yet?

Feb 24, 2020 - 5:41:25 AM
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Players Union Member

DC5

USA

10067 posts since 6/30/2015

I often wonder how much medical costs would be today if there weren't insurance and government run healthcare. When I see how high my medical bills are I am grateful I have insurance, but then I wonder how high they would be if nobody had insurance. I feel that many costs are high because "somebody else is paying". I feel the same about college costs. Government loans and grants drive up the availability of money, and that drives up costs.
I also realize that if these medical costs were not covered by insurance, some of the medical miracles we have today would unlikely not exist. MRIs and CAT scans, for example. The cost to build one is very high, and probably no one would have one. But then again, once you've spent that money, you need to use the machine, so how many tests that aren't really needed are being done to keep the machine busy, and keep the money coming in to pay for it.
Most of us don't care what the costs are, as long as the insurance covers it.

Feb 24, 2020 - 7:21:35 AM

1264 posts since 4/22/2018

quote:
Originally posted by DC5

I often wonder how much medical costs would be today if there weren't insurance and government run healthcare. When I see how high my medical bills are I am grateful I have insurance, but then I wonder how high they would be if nobody had insurance. I feel that many costs are high because "somebody else is paying". I feel the same about college costs. Government loans and grants drive up the availability of money, and that drives up costs.
I also realize that if these medical costs were not covered by insurance, some of the medical miracles we have today would unlikely not exist. MRIs and CAT scans, for example. The cost to build one is very high, and probably no one would have one. But then again, once you've spent that money, you need to use the machine, so how many tests that aren't really needed are being done to keep the machine busy, and keep the money coming in to pay for it.
Most of us don't care what the costs are, as long as the insurance covers it.


Dave,

 

one example we have noticed that has made it's way from your side of the Pond is EpiPens (the aderenaline auto injectors) for anaphylaxes.  They came from one source in the US and over a few years went up from $100 to $600.  

Feb 24, 2020 - 7:28:03 AM

Trewq36

Canada

1874 posts since 11/30/2007

quote:
Originally posted by DC5

I often wonder how much medical costs would be today if there weren't insurance and government run healthcare. When I see how high my medical bills are I am grateful I have insurance, but then I wonder how high they would be if nobody had insurance. I feel that many costs are high because "somebody else is paying". I feel the same about college costs. Government loans and grants drive up the availability of money, and that drives up costs.
I also realize that if these medical costs were not covered by insurance, some of the medical miracles we have today would unlikely not exist. MRIs and CAT scans, for example. The cost to build one is very high, and probably no one would have one. But then again, once you've spent that money, you need to use the machine, so how many tests that aren't really needed are being done to keep the machine busy, and keep the money coming in to pay for it.
Most of us don't care what the costs are, as long as the insurance covers it.


A study at Yale found that....

Medicare for All Would Save U.S. $450 Billion, Prevent Nearly 70,000 Deaths a Year.

Feb 24, 2020 - 7:37:30 AM
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chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

Proper exercise and a healthy diet would also go a long way in cutting health care costs. Trouble is we don’t have to chop wood and haul water anymore....

Feb 24, 2020 - 8:23:34 AM
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Owen

Canada

5178 posts since 6/5/2011

...and reasonably healthy/intact joints would go a long way toward proper exercise.  wink

Feb 24, 2020 - 8:52:08 AM
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1264 posts since 4/22/2018

quote:
Originally posted by donc

My sister the family historian still has the factory invoice complete with an owner's manual. This was 8 years before any public medical system existed in Canada so my dad got billed.


That's a brilliant piece of family history you have there Don.  A great thing to be able to pass on too.

Feb 24, 2020 - 9:56:55 AM
Players Union Member

DC5

USA

10067 posts since 6/30/2015

quote:
Originally posted by Trewq36
quote:
Originally posted by DC5

I often wonder how much medical costs would be today if there weren't insurance and government run healthcare. When I see how high my medical bills are I am grateful I have insurance, but then I wonder how high they would be if nobody had insurance. I feel that many costs are high because "somebody else is paying". I feel the same about college costs. Government loans and grants drive up the availability of money, and that drives up costs.
I also realize that if these medical costs were not covered by insurance, some of the medical miracles we have today would unlikely not exist. MRIs and CAT scans, for example. The cost to build one is very high, and probably no one would have one. But then again, once you've spent that money, you need to use the machine, so how many tests that aren't really needed are being done to keep the machine busy, and keep the money coming in to pay for it.
Most of us don't care what the costs are, as long as the insurance covers it.


A study at Yale found that....

Medicare for All Would Save U.S. $450 Billion, Prevent Nearly 70,000 Deaths a Year.

 


I don't buy it.  I'm currently on Medicare, and I have to carry supplemental insurance because Medicare doesn't cover everything.  All insurance rations health care in deciding what procedures they will and will not pay for.  There is no reason to believe that Medicare would change this, as it currently rations health care.  I am only in favor of this if it is truly FOR ALL.  That means millionaires, billionaires, and mostly ALL ELECTED AND PUBLIC EMPLOYEES are also on it.  Don't like when those who write laws exempt themselves from the laws.

Feb 24, 2020 - 11:19:47 AM

244 posts since 1/28/2011

quote:
Originally posted by DC5
quote:
Originally posted by Trewq36
quote:
Originally posted by DC5

I often wonder how much medical costs would be today if there weren't insurance and government run healthcare. When I see how high my medical bills are I am grateful I have insurance, but then I wonder how high they would be if nobody had insurance. I feel that many costs are high because "somebody else is paying". I feel the same about college costs. Government loans and grants drive up the availability of money, and that drives up costs.
I also realize that if these medical costs were not covered by insurance, some of the medical miracles we have today would unlikely not exist. MRIs and CAT scans, for example. The cost to build one is very high, and probably no one would have one. But then again, once you've spent that money, you need to use the machine, so how many tests that aren't really needed are being done to keep the machine busy, and keep the money coming in to pay for it.
Most of us don't care what the costs are, as long as the insurance covers it.


A study at Yale found that....

Medicare for All Would Save U.S. $450 Billion, Prevent Nearly 70,000 Deaths a Year.

 


I don't buy it.  I'm currently on Medicare, and I have to carry supplemental insurance because Medicare doesn't cover everything.  All insurance rations health care in deciding what procedures they will and will not pay for.  There is no reason to believe that Medicare would change this, as it currently rations health care.  I am only in favor of this if it is truly FOR ALL.  That means millionaires, billionaires, and mostly ALL ELECTED AND PUBLIC EMPLOYEES are also on it.  Don't like when those who write laws exempt themselves from the laws.


I don't buy it either.  In the first place, medicare isn't free.  The premium is held out of my social security check.  My wife does not have social security, so medicare bills us for her premium.  Then, medicare does not pay anywhere near the amount of the bill.  I had a minor surgical procedure done recently.  The bill was $337.  Medicare paid 128.52.  Not even half.  That is why we have to buy a supplement, which is private insurance and pretty expensive for the best plans.  I am not sure medicare is such a great  program as the politicians claim. 

Feb 24, 2020 - 11:31:09 AM
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chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

Other than medical checkups to renew my driver’s licence, I haven’t ever had to pay a medical bill. Yes, it comes out of our taxes, but I still think it’s better than for-profit healthcare.

Feb 24, 2020 - 12:22:16 PM
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donc

Canada

6209 posts since 2/9/2010

If public health care is not available to everyone how can it legitimately be called 'public health care ' ? Contracting out the insurance to private companies is the same as contracting an Army and Navy of private mercenary fighters to defend the borders of the country. It may work but who would ever choose it ? Countries with public medical care usually provide adequate coverage. My employer also provided a supplementary optional plan to cover 80% prescriptions and 80% of dental work. As a retiree I now pay $90 a month for that coverage for the 2 of us. Anything to do with a hospital or a doctor is almost always 100%. Cosmetic surgery is usually not covered. Private insurance companies are leeches. Get rid of them !!

Feb 24, 2020 - 12:26:32 PM
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Paul R

Canada

12438 posts since 1/28/2010

quote:
Originally posted by chuckv97

Other than medical checkups to renew my driver’s licence, I haven’t ever had to pay a medical bill. Yes, it comes out of our taxes, but I still think it’s better than for-profit healthcare.


it's way better. We don't have "pre-existing conditions". It's a level playing field. Your social status doesn't determine your outcome. And it's much more efficient and less costly overall. We don't pay CEOs' huge salaries. I go for my PSA test, no bill. I go for the prostate appointment at the hospital, no bill. I go to the ER, no bill. My nephew went to the States and had an emergency and got billed for $130,000 for about a day and a half. That's nuts. I won't go south of our border without getting insurance.

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:10:44 PM

chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

Yep, I always buy travel health insurance when I go south in the winter. My company paid most of it when I drove truck full time.

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:12:02 PM
Players Union Member

DC5

USA

10067 posts since 6/30/2015

quote:
Originally posted by chuckv97

Other than medical checkups to renew my driver’s licence, I haven’t ever had to pay a medical bill. Yes, it comes out of our taxes, but I still think it’s better than for-profit healthcare.


Philosophically, I agree.  A single payer system, paid for with tax dollars, is a better, and more fair system.  But look at what country we are talking about.  Without trying to make this political, would you trust your health care to the usual gang of idiots we keep putting into office?  Not that they ever actually balance the budget, but when they claim they are trying too, it is always Medicare and SS that they first bring the axe to.  I cannot trust them with my health insurance needs.  At least with private insurance there is some competition, and I can change my insurance every year during open enrollment, so they need to work to keep me.  A government monopoly scares the crap out of me.  Look at our interstate highway system.  We have rotting bridges, and roads in disrepair all over the country.  Every 4 years I get scared to death on what we're about to face for the next 4 years.  And it doesn't matter who wins.

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:14:36 PM
Players Union Member

DC5

USA

10067 posts since 6/30/2015

quote:
Originally posted by Paul R
quote:
Originally posted by chuckv97

Other than medical checkups to renew my driver’s licence, I haven’t ever had to pay a medical bill. Yes, it comes out of our taxes, but I still think it’s better than for-profit healthcare.


it's way better. We don't have "pre-existing conditions". It's a level playing field. Your social status doesn't determine your outcome. And it's much more efficient and less costly overall. We don't pay CEOs' huge salaries. I go for my PSA test, no bill. I go for the prostate appointment at the hospital, no bill. I go to the ER, no bill. My nephew went to the States and had an emergency and got billed for $130,000 for about a day and a half. That's nuts. I won't go south of our border without getting insurance.


Just out of curiosity, what did he have done in the E.R., and did he actually have to pay that bill?  Certainly if he only had a cast put on a broken leg, the bill would not be that high, but if he had to have 6 bullets removed, and an emergency liver transplant, that was a bargain. 

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:19:34 PM

Owen

Canada

5178 posts since 6/5/2011

 
Originally posted by latigo1
   I am not sure medicare is such a great  program as the politicians claim. 

I'll add my yes up to the politicians  (??) [i.e. Chuck, Don and Paul] in the last few posts.... even though I suspect we're preaching to the choir.     [And, like I said in the Abbott vs Gregory thread.... I (really) intend no disrespect.  wink  ]

Edited by - Owen on 02/24/2020 13:35:13

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:33:53 PM

chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

Last month I spent a night in the ER in Arizona with the kidney stone. Two prescriptions cost me $15.34 . Glad I had bought the insurance.

Edited by - chuckv97 on 02/24/2020 13:34:22

Feb 24, 2020 - 1:35:41 PM
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chuckv97

Canada

47737 posts since 10/5/2013

quote:
Originally posted by Owen
 
Originally posted by latigo1
   I am not sure medicare is such a great  program as the politicians claim. 

I'll add my yes up to the politicians  [i.e. Chuck, Don and Paul] in the last few posts.... even though I suspect we're preaching to the choir.  


Me...a politician..??  Wash your mouth out with soap, pilgrim! 

Feb 24, 2020 - 5:09:58 PM

Owen

Canada

5178 posts since 6/5/2011

Nice bit of family history Don.   

If my math is working, $75 in 1950 that doubles every decade should be about $9600 in 2020.  Would that be in in the realm of "reasonable" nowadays, for a routine (?) delivery and a couple of days (?) in hospital?    [It's a slow evening here in Russell.]

Feb 24, 2020 - 5:18:50 PM

Paul R

Canada

12438 posts since 1/28/2010

quote:
Originally posted by DC5
quote:
Originally posted by Paul R
quote:
Originally posted by chuckv97

Other than medical checkups to renew my driver’s licence, I haven’t ever had to pay a medical bill. Yes, it comes out of our taxes, but I still think it’s better than for-profit healthcare.


it's way better. We don't have "pre-existing conditions". It's a level playing field. Your social status doesn't determine your outcome. And it's much more efficient and less costly overall. We don't pay CEOs' huge salaries. I go for my PSA test, no bill. I go for the prostate appointment at the hospital, no bill. I go to the ER, no bill. My nephew went to the States and had an emergency and got billed for $130,000 for about a day and a half. That's nuts. I won't go south of our border without getting insurance.


Just out of curiosity, what did he have done in the E.R., and did he actually have to pay that bill?  Certainly if he only had a cast put on a broken leg, the bill would not be that high, but if he had to have 6 bullets removed, and an emergency liver transplant, that was a bargain. 


I'd have to ask my brother for specifics, but it seemed to be some sort of seizure - but don't quote me. He was taken to one hospital ($30 thou, may have been 40) and then sent elsewhere ($100,000). He wasn't in either that long (may have been more than a day in the second). I'm fairly certain he took out insurance. The thing is, on this side of the border, he wouldn't have a bill to pay, period.

Today I did my colon cancer test and brought the stuff (yecchh) to the lab. No fee. It's part of the province-wide screening programme. It makes sense. It's cheaper on the medical system to catch these things early.

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