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Sep 15, 2019 - 1:58:58 PM
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70071 posts since 5/9/2007

It's too bad good topics like food safety,prioritizing well-being and empathy can't be discussed without going over the edge.

Sep 15, 2019 - 2:12:58 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

It's not so much the topic, but who is involved discussing it, and how they manage to work their own personal agendas into the discussion.

The usual suspects...

Edited by - OldNavyGuy on 09/15/2019 14:14:08

Sep 15, 2019 - 2:22:16 PM
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70071 posts since 5/9/2007

I like eating the seafood from right here.I never worry about its origin or quality.

Sep 15, 2019 - 2:25:26 PM
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Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

...  I wish I could [reliably] figure out where the edge is.    

Edited by - Owen on 09/15/2019 14:29:34

Sep 15, 2019 - 3:14:24 PM
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Bill Rogers (Moderator)

USA

22303 posts since 6/25/2005

Shutting down a topic is always a judgment call, but most of the time it’s based on a cumulative sense of comments and the general tenor.of the discussion. Less common is locking a topic for a blatant rule-breaking post. So, yeah, knowing where that “edge” falls is at best a thoughtful guess.

Sep 15, 2019 - 3:23:48 PM
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Texasbanjo (Moderator)

USA

23278 posts since 8/3/2003

The edge can be where rule breaking comes in, either in the form of politics or religion or flaming. And, as Bill said, if rule breaking continues , then eventually we have no choice but to lock a thread.

Sep 15, 2019 - 3:39:06 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

quote:
Originally posted by Bill Rogers

<snip> ... So, yeah, knowing where that “edge” falls is at best a thoughtful guess.


Thanks, Bill. I assume I'm safe in assuming that you're not interested in my ideas of how the "guessing" could be reduced.   wink

Sep 15, 2019 - 3:48:25 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:16:06 PM
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chuckv97

Canada

43391 posts since 10/5/2013

Guess I shouldn’t have mentioned the American Indian in the Paternity Leave thread..... ;-)

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:33:10 PM
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8893 posts since 2/22/2007

Usual suspect, checking in. Apologies to Jim and Steve for my part in going over the edge, truly not my intention. I don't have an agenda to advance, but I do have strong views and I am passionalte about the state of the world that we are leaving our children. I mean, it's too late in the game for me to be personally affected by these issues, but I can't help but care.
But as to Owen's question about just where that edge is, well, to me it is not political if not talking for or against any party or politician or specific proposed measure, etc.
I would think that we could discuss historical worldwide movements such as socialism and capitalism without that being considered "political". I consider such questions to be philosophical. But I'm not a mod, and I do thank the mods for doing a difficult job. I will try to not make your job any more difficult.

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:34:02 PM

Bill Rogers (Moderator)

USA

22303 posts since 6/25/2005

quote:
Originally posted by Owen
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Rogers

... So, yeah, knowing where that “edge” falls is at best a thoughtful guess.


Thanks, Bill. I assume I'm safe in assuming that you're not interested in my ideas of how the "guessing" could be reduced.   wink


Sure, post them in Improvements and Suggestions. Be specific. 

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:36:29 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

quote:
Originally posted by OldNavyGuy

Seems pretty clear...

banjohangout.org/forum/rules.asp


Okay, Jim, I notice Sherry has hidden a couple of rule-breaking posts in the "Golden Opportunity" thread  https://www.banjohangout.org/topic/356939   

Would you mind cluing/clueing (?) me in as to the specific rule(s) that were broken, and the the gist of the offending posts?   If I could actually see that, I'd be able to find the "edge" with more reliability.

Edit: Been there, done that, Bill ... as well as having personal exchanges with you and Sherry.    

Edited by - Owen on 09/15/2019 16:44:12

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:43:29 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Owen
quote:
Originally posted by OldNavyGuy

Seems pretty clear...

banjohangout.org/forum/rules.asp


Okay, Jim, I notice Sherry has hidden a couple of rule-breaking posts in the "Golden Opportunity" thread  https://www.banjohangout.org/topic/356939   

Would you mind cluing/clueing (?) me in as to the specific rule(s) that were broken, and the the gist of the offending posts?   If I could actually see that, I'd be able to find the "edge" with more reliability.


PM Sherry.

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:48:22 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

Jim, if the rules [and their application] were as clear as you feel they are, then I'd see the stuff and wouldn't have to ask anybody... it would be there in plain view.     You're the  one saying they "seem pretty clear,"  why don't you give me the low down?

Sep 15, 2019 - 4:53:48 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Owen

Jim, if the rules [and their application] were as clear as you feel they are, then I'd see the stuff and wouldn't have to ask anybody... it would be there in plain view.     You're the  one saying they "seem pretty clear,"  why don't you give me the low down?


I don't know which posts were hidden.

The majority of posters here seem to be pretty clear on what the rules are, don't ask where the "edge is", and don't get their posts removed, or their accounts locked.

 


 

Edited by - OldNavyGuy on 09/15/2019 16:56:25

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:01:23 PM
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donc

Canada

6005 posts since 2/9/2010

The outcome of some posts are as predictable as gravity. It amazes me how some posts get as far as page 2.

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:02:46 PM

Bill Rogers (Moderator)

USA

22303 posts since 6/25/2005

Sherry hid a couple of scatalogical posts which clearly violated BHO Rules #s 2 and/or 3, which are clear. The edge in both cases was a bright line.

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:03:14 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by donc

The outcome of some posts are as predictable as gravity. It amazes me how some posts get as far as page 2.


I've seen mods give multiple warnings, and the warnings are ignored.

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:07:44 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

I was following the Golden Opportunity thread and I don't know which posts were hidden... that's not "pretty clear" in my books.   

Over the years, I've had a couple of posts hidden and/or edited [because my computer skills were lacking, and I inadvertently put up a wrong link], and have never had my account locked. I don't see how those things help me see where the edge is.... and I'm not expecting a knife-edge, but "in the ballpark" would be appreciated.  [...or, do you suppose, like I've wondered before, maybe I really am as "thick as pig ****. "]   

Now, I'm not saying I can't ever tell... just that I can't reliably tell.  That's kinda like knowing a guy lies half the time... all I have to do is figure out which side of the line it's on.  Easy-peasy... or in other words,  "seem pretty clear."!

I know it's not against any specific rule, but I'd like to see a rule reigning in guys whose primary objective  seems to  be to be annoying bozos.

Edit: Bill it would be nice if I could see it for myself, and not have to take somebody else's word for it.  ...and in the long run I think that would reduce the mods' workloads.   I acknowledge that posts might be so egregious they demand immediate removal.  A mod's note making note of this and the subsequent suspension meted out would get things under control fairly quickly, [and in plain view], no?   I'm not computer literate enough to offer any suggestions re. the suspended guys who create new accounts.

Edited by - Owen on 09/15/2019 17:19:44

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:13:31 PM
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Bill Rogers (Moderator)

USA

22303 posts since 6/25/2005

Well, we’re not going to leave up posts with potty- mouth language or sexual references. And we do banish serial trolls regularly. Some come back with new names and are locked out again. No bright-line rule needed for that.

Sep 15, 2019 - 5:32:03 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Owen

Edit: Bill it would be nice if I could see it for myself, and not have to take somebody else's word for it.  ...and in the long run I think that would reduce the mods' workloads. 

A mod's note making note of this and the subsequent suspension meted out would get things under control fairly quickly, [and in plain view], no?


That would increase the mods' "workloads"...not reduce it.

I trust the mods' will do the right thing, and taking the mods' word for it is good enough for me.

I may not always agree, but it's the "house rules".

I pretty much know when I cross the line...when things start getting "personal", I do have a tendency to respond in kind.

But every possibility doesn't need to be codified in the rules.

Edited by - OldNavyGuy on 09/15/2019 17:38:05

Sep 15, 2019 - 6:02:31 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

Jim, I agree it would increase initially, but I think it wouldn't be too, too long before guys would see the standard, with an ensuing significant  and long-lasting reduction in the workload.   [Admittedly, I say that, never having been a moderator, and thus without knowing the minutiae of the job.]

And I'm all for reduced codifying in the rules... one rule: "be respectful" would cover a lot of territory.    And once people could see where the mods were drawing the line.... ah... you know the rest...

Sep 15, 2019 - 6:03:53 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Owen
I'm not expecting a knife-edge, but "in the ballpark" would be appreciated.  [...or, do you suppose, like I've wondered before, maybe I really am as "thick as pig ****. "]  

Bill mentioned "scatalogical" references, and your asterisked pig reference is an example.

This has become a popular technique on forums (not just BHO) to say the word...without saying the word (note: some forum software will add the asterisks automatically if it thinks the word is NSFF - not suitable for forums).

Some make it a little more obvious by adding the "clue letters" to the beginning, and ending of the asterisks.

So just because the "actual word" wasn't used, doesn't mean it can't be figured out, when placed in context.

Another technique to being "clever" is using slang terms the poster thinks no one will ever notice, or understand the meaning.

Google is your best friend in finding out what a term means.




 

Edited by - OldNavyGuy on 09/15/2019 18:13:55

Sep 15, 2019 - 6:09:29 PM

795 posts since 11/17/2018

quote:
Originally posted by Owen
one rule: "be respectful" would cover a lot of territory.   

It's already there...

Courteous Communication
Communicating on the Web in an all-text medium is a challenge, and it's always good to think twice before you hit that "Post" button. Realize that each time you reply, you're replying to a real person, with real feelings just like yourself. Try to write messages that cannot be easily misunderstood or misconstrued to mean something you didn't mean. And please, please use descriptive subject lines when you post a new topic!

Pretty clear when someone is not being respectful...either online or in real-life.

Sep 15, 2019 - 6:17:05 PM

Owen

Canada

4065 posts since 6/5/2011

Okay, Jim, you say that sometimes you tend to "respond in kind,"  i.e. take your cue from something that's been posted.   What's the diff when I take a cue [eg. the asterisked pig  ****]? ... am I not simply taking my cue from stuff that's previously been accepted in  the posts, and  using the standard that's in plain view? 

If it was a no-no, then wouldn't the mods would warn me ... along with the dozens (?) of others that do similarly?    I've got no real problem with any rule, so long as it's judiciously and evenly applied... and it surely would help me to see how things are being done, 'though I acknowledge that they don't get much lower on the totem pole than I am. 

Edit: Point taken re. courteous communication, thanks.  Which raises the point of the "annoying bozos" I previously mentioned...and their posts that are anything but courteous or respectful, and thus break that rule left, right and center. 

Edit #2: any thoughts about my idea of short term pain [more work initially ] for long term gain [less work in the long run]? .

Edited by - Owen on 09/15/2019 18:29:20

Sep 15, 2019 - 9:47:19 PM

1168 posts since 1/31/2011

There is always the option to agree to disagree and move on. You're not going to change the minds of a bunch of ol' coots that have established priorities and views of the world.

So ingrained in fact that very smart people will support the most vile leaders because they are the party of choice or to advance an agenda.

Save your breath, time and sanity. Get your 10 cents in and go pick a spell.

Edited by - Disco Kid on 09/15/2019 22:03:41

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