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nc2va2nc - Posted - 05/26/2023: 11:43:05
Can anyone explain what the notation circled in red means? It looks like an open to open hammer on the same string? I’m a beginner and I don’t get it….
Thank you!
thisoldman - Posted - 05/26/2023: 12:34:26
As I understand it you will pick the open 5th string, letting it ring out for 2 quarter notes (or a half note), then pinch the 5th and 1st for the same duration. So 1-2, 3-4 if you are counting.
Texasbanjo - Posted - 05/26/2023: 14:25:56
I read it just the way thisoldman does.
You don't see too many quarter notes in banjo music. Two quarter notes tied together would get 2 beats (in 4/4 time). It's just an easy way to end a roll.
banjoak - Posted - 05/26/2023: 14:56:18
Those are tie marks, used as thisoldman stated, to indicate striking the string once, but tied together for the duration of both.
The way the TAB or software used, doesn't have easy way to write half notes.
Edited by - banjoak on 05/26/2023 14:57:24
nc2va2nc - Posted - 05/26/2023: 15:06:59
Thank you! Lots of simple things I don’t know yet!
Edited by - nc2va2nc on 05/26/2023 15:07:26
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/27/2023: 06:15:54
I suspect that whoever wrote those tabs didn't mean for you to learn that measure as a thing you would do regularly. Rather, it strikes me as just a way to fill up a measure in tempo so that you have a two-measure phrase that you can repeat over and over when practicing.
RB3 - Posted - 05/27/2023: 06:26:00
If I were you, I'd try to find some different instructional material. I don't see the purpose in learning to play the measure in question. It's not anything that you will be doing in the context of actually playing a song.
stanleytone - Posted - 05/27/2023: 06:26:07
Hit once, count twice!
nc2va2nc - Posted - 05/27/2023: 07:02:24
quote:
Originally posted by RB3
If I were you, I'd try to find some different instructional material. I don't see the purpose in learning to play the measure in question. It's not anything that you will be doing in the context of actually playing a song.
I'm looking at a few different things. Videos, etc. I was trying to find a chart of the rolls, and I saw this. Do you have suggestions?
Texasbanjo - Posted - 05/27/2023: 08:21:58
How about a good beginner instruction book w/CD/DVD? There are many on the market that don't cost a fortune and take you step by step in your learning experience.
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/27/2023: 08:53:59
quote:
Originally posted by RB3
If I were you, I'd try to find some different instructional material. I don't see the purpose in learning to play the measure in question. It's not anything that you will be doing in the context of actually playing a song.
Like note-pinch, note-pinch (all quarter notes) instead of nooooote-piiiiinch (half notes).
Edited by - Ira Gitlin on 05/27/2023 08:54:38
Ira Gitlin - Posted - 05/27/2023: 08:56:02
quote:
Originally posted by nc2va2nc
quote:
Originally posted by RB3
If I were you, I'd try to find some different instructional material. I don't see the purpose in learning to play the measure in question. It's not anything that you will be doing in the context of actually playing a song.
I'm looking at a few different things. Videos, etc. I was trying to find a chart of the rolls, and I saw this. Do you have suggestions?
I do Zoom lessons. I can give you a good orientation to get you started.
iragitlin.com/music-instruction
Old Hickory - Posted - 05/27/2023: 08:58:55
quote:
Originally posted by banjoak
The way the TAB or software used, doesn't have easy way to write half notes.
?
TablEdit software lets you choose half notes in exactly the same way you choose quarters, eighths, and sixteenths. -- from a palette, menu or keystroke.
In tab, either handwritten or computer-generated, half notes tend to be indicated with shorter stems that don't come as close to the fret number as stems for quarters. This can be very subtle and easily missed. Whole notes in tab have no stem, same as in notation.
I've read there's a musical reason for using shorter duration notes with ties (two quarters tied to be a half, two halves tied to be a whole) than the equivalent full duration note, but I sure don't remember what it is.
Jack Baker - Posted - 05/27/2023: 09:30:13
Ken,
It's because the Tabledit PDF of the same song only shows a vertical note stem like it was a 1/4 note but it would sound for two counts...Jack
Edited by - Jack Baker on 05/27/2023 09:35:31
banjoak - Posted - 05/27/2023: 15:05:32
quote:
Originally posted by Old Hickory
quote:
Originally posted by banjoak
The way the TAB or software used, doesn't have easy way to write half notes.
?
TablEdit software lets you choose half notes in exactly the same way you choose quarters, eighths, and sixteenths. -- from a palette, menu or keystroke.
In tab, either handwritten or computer-generated, half notes tend to be indicated with shorter stems that don't come as close to the fret number as stems for quarters. This can be very subtle and easily missed. Whole notes in tab have no stem, same as in notation.
I've read there's a musical reason for using shorter duration notes with ties (two quarters tied to be a half, two halves tied to be a whole) than the equivalent full duration note, but I sure don't remember what it is.
In regular notation, the use of ties; beams, and sometimes rests... is to help to show the underlying meter; convention is to avoid having a visual empty void where a the beat occurs; makes easier to read.
I didn't know about the half stem, but I'm not much familiar with TAB software; nor much even use TAB.
I do note that TAB or notation, by hand or with software; person writing isn't necessarily aware of some of the ways to do things.
Edited by - banjoak on 05/27/2023 15:11:29
thisoldman - Posted - 05/28/2023: 08:35:32
Charts of rolls? I went over to the "learn" tab on the upper left side of the page, typed in "rolls" in the (tab) search box and came up with this
Old Hickory - Posted - 05/29/2023: 09:27:13
Ricky Mier has developed -- and teaches -- a concept he calls Modes of Rhythm that treats banjo picking movements not as rolls, but as combinations of two-finger patterns. He defines every possible 4-note combination. This is an alternative to viewing picking movement as forward (T-I-M), backward (M-I-T), or square (T-I-T-M) rolls, or the longer combinations.
Whether it's useful, I don't know. For tab of Ricky's lessons, you need to support him at Patreon. But his videos are mostly free for the watching. Ignore the character he plays and focus on the content. In his most recent videos, he's toned down the character.
The rolls study by Mickey Cochran linked above by ThisOldMan is excellent in the practice it provides. It's especially great at showing the variety of strings that can be picked in the different rolls, that middle finger can pick the second string, and that T-I-T-M can be used to ascend across four strings: 4-3-2-1.
But it's important for the learner to note Mickey's repeated use of the word "Patterns" to label what's being taught. As he shows, eight notes picked T-I-M-T-I-M-T-M is not "forward roll." It's one forward roll "pattern" designed to make three notes of forward roll fill an 8-note measure, with a two-note make-up, for easy and endless repetition. A student should not get the idea rolls must fit into measures and always start over on the first beat of a measure. That may well be how they're played most of the time. But they don't have to. And it's when players extend rolls over measures and start them on off-beats or up-beats that music becomes more interesting.
Edited to add: Sorry for thread drift. This addresses a previous comment, but it's not about notation.
Edited by - Old Hickory on 05/29/2023 09:28:53
