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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Whistle....whistle... Here Boy....!....whistling....


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/383501

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  06:09:24


Gonna get accused of it ya know..
But...
Here is the question...
Worthy of discussion ..imo...

Are People born with..
Rights..?

Or should rights be dispersed as only privlages.. by people of higher intelligence and or claim thos to be..in charge ..?

Do intelligent people have..
More Rights..than others..?

bubbalouie - Posted - 05/29/2022:  06:13:55


NO. Rich people do. Greed is the root of all of this suffering.

Michigan Lefty - Posted - 05/29/2022:  06:39:36


Whether people are born with rights depends on when and where they are born.
"Rights" are a human construct.

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  07:17:45


quote:

Originally posted by Michigan Lefty

Whether people are born with rights depends on when and where they are born.

"Rights" are a human construct.






This is an interesting  concetp... 



 



When I read it..



The immediate thought I had.. was Gene Hackman..



In the seen at the end of the movie..



Unforgiven..



 



When he is told...Deserves has got nothin..to do with it..

AndrewD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  07:50:25


We get to decide if it's a dog whistle. Not you. There was a long running thread on this a year or so ago. It more or less came down to a few options.




  • We have natural, inalienable and intrinsic rights. But some didn't think those rights necessarily extended to everybody else, saying in effect "I have the right to restrict your rights while maintaining those rights for myself".

  • Whether or not rights are natural, inalienable and intrinsic is sort of irrelevant as the only rights worth having are those that you are able to defend and exercise.

  • Rights are bestowed by some external supernatural entity.

  • In a democracy the majority get to decide the rights of all. This is very similar to the "You only have rights that you can exercise and defend" position. For example (ahh ! maybe that's what he's dog-whistling about) if the majority think that a private citizens should not have the "right" to carry lethal weapons  then so be it.



I subscribe to a version of one of these. But as the OP has, as usual, not pitched in with his opinion I maintain the right to be silent.

Owen - Posted - 05/29/2022:  07:52:50


...rights?   ... privileges?  ...absolute? ... conditional?  



The UN says this about basic human rights:  "Human rights are rights inherent to all human beings, regardless of race, sex, nationality, ethnicity, language, religion, or any other status. Human rights include the right to life and liberty, freedom from slavery and torture, freedom of opinion and expression, the right to work and education, and many more.  Everyone is entitled to these rights, without discrimination."



...fwiw, I haven't looked into the "... and many more" part recently.


Edited by - Owen on 05/29/2022 07:54:21

Texasbanjo - Posted - 05/29/2022:  08:09:08


quote:

Originally posted by Owen

...rights?   ... privileges?  ...absolute? ... conditional?  



The UN says this about basic human rights:  "Human rights are rights inherent to all human beings, regardless of race, sex, nationality, ethnicity, language, religion, or any other status. Human rights include the right to life and liberty, freedom from slavery and torture, freedom of opinion and expression, the right to work and education, and many more.  Everyone is entitled to these rights, without discrimination."



...fwiw, I haven't looked into the "... and many more" part recently.






We may have the "right" to the above, but some of those rights are taken away, like the right to life, freedom and torture, expression .... Criminals' rights are taken away and they are put in jail/prison.  Some criminals are sentenced to death.   Some freedom is expression is taken away (you can't yell "FIRE" in a building that's not burning).    And, of course, with some people if you disagree with them, you're "canceled" and can't take part in any conversations, etc.  I could go on, but that's the general idea.  



So do we have rights?  Only partially.  And only some of us. 


Edited by - Texasbanjo on 05/29/2022 08:09:57

banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/29/2022:  08:29:52


--""the UN says------"Human rights are rights inherent to all human beings, regardless of race, sex, nationality, ethnicity, language, religion, or any other status. Human rights include the right to life and liberty, freedom from slavery and torture, freedom of opinion and expression, the right to work and education, and many more. Everyone is entitled to these rights, without discrimination."

Well all-righty then! First some definitions. Rights are "inherent" which is defined as "existing in something as a permanent, essential, or characteristic attribute" and then "intrinsic, innate, immanent, built-in, inborn, ingrained, deep-rooted. essential, fundamental, basic, implicit, structural, characteristic, organic. inseparable, permanent, indelible" etc.

Now the UN seems to be channeling Ayn Rand here! ---" Rights are conditions of existence required by man’s nature for his proper survival. ---"
But I do not find Rand anymore compelling than that empty UN statement, empty because it is just words with no enforcement, regardless to what we are "entitled".
I have had to reluctantly give up my cherished concept of Natural Rights, or inalienable Rights, as there is no evidence of any such inherent nature. That reduces to wishful thinking. In reality we only have the Rights which we have the power to enforce. If we are depending upon some outside power, then our Rights are actually privileges which may be revoked at any time.

Owen - Posted - 05/29/2022:  08:40:25


.... off onto a tangent........ when I was young, every [farm] dog would respond to "whistle, whistle..."[here boy].   When we went to the remote reserves no [rez] dog would respond to "whistle, whistle..." [here boy].

BTuno - Posted - 05/29/2022:  08:49:24


First one has to BELIEVE that ALL people are "equal" PERIOD

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:06:54


quote:

Originally posted by AndrewD

We get to decide if it's a dog whistle. Not you. There was a long running thread on this a year or so ago. It more or less came down to a few options.




  • We have natural, inalienable and intrinsic rights. But some didn't think those rights necessarily extended to everybody else, saying in effect "I have the right to restrict your rights while maintaining those rights for myself".

  • Whether or not rights are natural, inalienable and intrinsic is sort of irrelevant as the only rights worth having are those that you are able to defend and exercise.

  • Rights are bestowed by some external supernatural entity.

  • In a democracy the majority get to decide the rights of all. This is very similar to the "You only have rights that you can exercise and defend" position. For example (ahh ! maybe that's what he's dog-whistling about) if the majority think that a private citizens should not have the "right" to carry lethal weapons  then so be it.



I subscribe to a version of one of these. But as the OP has, as usual, not pitched in with his opinion I maintain the right to be silent.






Like the..."they"...



Who are the..."We"..?



 



 



N...aperently...  the .."We"...have decided... that ..i...  have no say ....



 



By happen chance...



Would .."We".. be a small group of..smart friends..?



 



Oh..



I believe  we are born with rights..



But if .."We"(everybody who was born)..do not defend them..or maintain them..



Will only have what others may grant us..



 



Btw..here you go ..again...trying to turn the thread into one ..about the poster..



 



N..not the subject...



 



Is there an issue about discussing this subject...further...?



 



 

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:09:08


quote:

Originally posted by BTuno

First one has to BELIEVE that ALL people are "equal" PERIOD






This is another interesting thought..



 



Thankyou.

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:13:42


Who gives the ..right to the person that has decided..that..that person..has the right to take away rights of another person..?

Might it be...the person..who submits..?

banjo bill-e - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:26:34


For society to defend Rights for all the society has to be united in it's core values. In protecting your Rights I protect my own, is the idea, and there is strength in that, but that requires unity. Perhaps that is the reason that unity is actively under attack these days? To reduce us all to helplessness?

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:31:25


Divide n concur....?

AndrewD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:35:45


quote:

Originally posted by STUD

quote:

Originally posted by AndrewD

We get to decide if it's a dog whistle. Not you. There was a long running thread on this a year or so ago. It more or less came down to a few options.




  • We have natural, inalienable and intrinsic rights. But some didn't think those rights necessarily extended to everybody else, saying in effect "I have the right to restrict your rights while maintaining those rights for myself".

  • Whether or not rights are natural, inalienable and intrinsic is sort of irrelevant as the only rights worth having are those that you are able to defend and exercise.

  • Rights are bestowed by some external supernatural entity.

  • In a democracy the majority get to decide the rights of all. This is very similar to the "You only have rights that you can exercise and defend" position. For example (ahh ! maybe that's what he's dog-whistling about) if the majority think that a private citizens should not have the "right" to carry lethal weapons  then so be it.



I subscribe to a version of one of these. But as the OP has, as usual, not pitched in with his opinion I maintain the right to be silent.






Like the..."they"...



Who are the..."We"..?



 



 



N...aperently...  the .."We"...have decided... that ..i...  have no say ....



 



By happen chance...



Would .."We".. be a small group of..smart friends..?



 



Oh..



I believe  we are born with rights..



But if .."We"(everybody who was born)..do not defend them..or maintain them..



Will only have what others may grant us..



 



Btw..here you go ..again...trying to turn the thread into one ..about the poster..



 



N..not the subject...



 



Is there an issue about discussing this subject...further...?



 



 






Calm down. We as in "everybody but you". You can't say "I'm about to make a dog whistle statement". If you do it's not a dog whistle statement. We're talking  semantics not politics.

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:49:37


C'mon Andy...
I get accused of dog whistling..by folks on here. Alot..
The same folks..too..
..I am calm.. in fact I am smiling. As I type this..
Rather amused by yer last comment..

Thanks..

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  09:51:32


So...
If I got ya strait...
You do not mind if the conversaytion..proceeds..?

AndrewD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  10:08:43


quote:

Originally posted by STUD

So...

If I got ya strait...

You do not mind if the conversaytion..proceeds..?






 



Why would anybody mind ? The usual suspects will add comment revealing what partisan political stance is being promoted here. Those that disagree with the opinion will state their case.  You will complain that you were only seeking the opinions of others. A mod will pitch in with your supporters and then, when the opposition gets too noisy,  shut the thread down. Doesn't really need a crystal ball, just a knowledge of the term 'groundhog day'.

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  10:16:13


Not too far off course...!
Just a bit of role reversal in there.. ;0)

Glad to have yer blessing... :0)

You have now really amused me..
N..I mean that in an extremely friendly way..

It's kinda feels like we are at the pub.. n having a beer... :0)

Owen - Posted - 05/29/2022:  10:17:57


Andrew: "Doesn't really need a crystal ball, just a knowledge of the term 'groundhog day'.



.... and the rest of us can count on Yogi: bleacherreport.com/articles/65...st-quotes


Edited by - Owen on 05/29/2022 10:21:33

AndrewD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  10:33:10


Sometimes it feels like I've accidentally wandered into a Millwall supporters pub.

And are there really no more opinions on whether pickled cockles are a delicacy or a punishment ?

5B-Ranch - Posted - 05/29/2022:  10:35:21


quote:

Originally posted by AndrewD

quote:

Originally posted by STUD

So...

If I got ya strait...

You do not mind if the conversaytion..proceeds..?






 



Why would anybody mind ? The usual suspects will add comment revealing what partisan political stance is being promoted here. Those that disagree with the opinion will state their case.  You will complain that you were only seeking the opinions of others. A mod will pitch in with your supporters and then, when the opposition gets too noisy,  shut the thread down. Doesn't really need a crystal ball, just a knowledge of the term 'groundhog day'.






You have a choice,or a annihilated right,to participate or not to participate. Just drop off a reactionary comment of disdain and carry on with normal routines.

ChunoTheDog - Posted - 05/29/2022:  11:14:02


The only laws that truly govern us (and anything) are the laws of physics.

The rest is all words on a page invented by some humans. Just because the Supreme Leader says one cannot do XYZ, it doesn't mean that XYZ is not doable.

No such thing as rights, it's all just societal coercion. You can definitely exist outside of that framework, it's just difficult in the developed world to do so.

ChunoTheDog - Posted - 05/29/2022:  11:15:45


quote:

Originally posted by AndrewD

quote:

Originally posted by STUD

So...

If I got ya strait...

You do not mind if the conversaytion..proceeds..?






 



Why would anybody mind ? The usual suspects will add comment revealing what partisan political stance is being promoted here. Those that disagree with the opinion will state their case.  You will complain that you were only seeking the opinions of others. A mod will pitch in with your supporters and then, when the opposition gets too noisy,  shut the thread down. Doesn't really need a crystal ball, just a knowledge of the term 'groundhog day'.






Someone should start a fringe far-left thread to keep the UK folks happy

5B-Ranch - Posted - 05/29/2022:  11:55:15


quote:

Originally posted by ChunoTheDog

quote:

Originally posted by AndrewD

quote:

Originally posted by STUD

So...

If I got ya strait...

You do not mind if the conversaytion..proceeds..?






 



Why would anybody mind ? The usual suspects will add comment revealing what partisan political stance is being promoted here. Those that disagree with the opinion will state their case.  You will complain that you were only seeking the opinions of others. A mod will pitch in with your supporters and then, when the opposition gets too noisy,  shut the thread down. Doesn't really need a crystal ball, just a knowledge of the term 'groundhog day'.






Someone should start a fringe far-left thread to keep the UK folks happy






Could it be that the fringe far left think that the world is broken and they are the only ones that can fix it?? 

STUD - Posted - 05/29/2022:  12:07:55


Fringe far left.......?


!!! :0o ....OMG..!

FFL...!
They'er..after us now Boys....! :0o





Just funnin....

5B-Ranch - Posted - 05/29/2022:  13:06:39


quote:

Originally posted by STUD

Fringe far left.......?





!!! :0o ....OMG..!



FFL...!

They'er..after us now Boys....! :0o











Just funnin....






You weren't supposed to have figured it out STUD. They must neutralize you. Be prepared for deprograming to begin immediately. Do not Answer the door prepare for breeching.  

STUD - Posted - 05/30/2022:  05:01:33


You could ..."spot on"..... 5-B...

A Scooby snack fer you...!

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