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 ARCHIVED TOPIC: Replacement guitar-style tuners for Gold Tone AC-1?


Please note this is an archived topic, so it is locked and unable to be replied to. You may, however, start a new topic and refer to this topic with a link: http://www.banjohangout.org/archive/382280

danh - Posted - 03/27/2022:  18:45:02


I have a Gold Tone AC-1 I am perfectly satisfied with, except that the guitar-style tuners feel quite sloppy and don't seem to stay in tune. They are covered with a bent sheet-metal box. They remind me of some similar tuners on a Yamaha JR-1 child's guitar I have, which are also sloppy and seem to slip.

If you have replaced the tuners on your AC-1, what did you use? Did you find any sealed or open-back guitars tuners that are an exact fit without needing to drill new screw holes? I am not that interested in replacing them with planetary tuners. Thanks.

Helix - Posted - 03/28/2022:  02:25:08


I like the Schallers I have with plastic bodies, they are sealed, no slippage.

Dan Gellert - Posted - 03/28/2022:  10:13:49


A worm gear can't slip. It can stick or bind.

If you take the mounting screw(s) out, you should be able to remove the back cover, and at least apply some lube to all the bearing surfaces.

You can also disassemble the tuner. There are probably some rough spots or burrs, especially on the gear, which will benefit from some smoothing with extra-fine sandpaper or steel wool. The bearings on the ends of the worm are bent out of sheet metal, and are very prone to binding. A little adjustment with a small pair of pliers can sometimes improve them a lot.

Before you start tearing down your tuners, though, check this: A lot of what seems like slipping or sticking in the pegs is rather happening in the nut slots! Smooth them (especially at the peg side of the nut) with a folded bit of xx-fine sandpaper, and lubricate with some soft pencil lead (graphite). If you haven't recently changed your strings, do so. Old strings will exacerbate that problem.

danh - Posted - 03/28/2022:  17:46:00


Thank you for the informed reply. I removed the cover (which is now upside down). It's not folder, but it is stamped -- I was wrong about that.

The mechanism actually appears to be pretty nice, better than the open-back guitar tuners I have on a couple of guitars. You can see a nylon (maybe?) washer which makes the tuner turn easily. Perhaps it is too easy to turn, and that is what I am feeling. I don't see any slop in the gearing. The black coating on the worm and gear may be there to make them slicker; I am not sure. I will check the nut slots as you say.


Dan Gellert - Posted - 03/28/2022:  20:14:56


Kudos to Gold Tone. A fair step up from what I expected to see on the bottom of the line! I doubt that those will need the deburring I suggested, and might not even need any oil. A tiny bit couldn't hurt, though.

How's the nut and strings?

G Edward Porgie - Posted - 03/29/2022:  11:26:21


quote:

Originally posted by Dan Gellert

A worm gear can't slip. It can stick or bind.



If you take the mounting screw(s) out, you should be able to remove the back cover, and at least apply some lube to all the bearing surfaces.



You can also disassemble the tuner. There are probably some rough spots or burrs, especially on the gear, which will benefit from some smoothing with extra-fine sandpaper or steel wool. The bearings on the ends of the worm are bent out of sheet metal, and are very prone to binding. A little adjustment with a small pair of pliers can sometimes improve them a lot.



Before you start tearing down your tuners, though, check this: A lot of what seems like slipping or sticking in the pegs is rather happening in the nut slots! Smooth them (especially at the peg side of the nut) with a folded bit of xx-fine sandpaper, and lubricate with some soft pencil lead (graphite). If you haven't recently changed your strings, do so. Old strings will exacerbate that problem.






Although that is true for this type of gearing when it's in good condition, I have seen a few of these systems that di, in fact, slip. it's most always because the conventional gear is worn out or broken, but I did encounter one that had a worm gear that had been worn out by the regular gear. I suspect this only happens if the gears were poorly cut and not fitted together right in the first place.  I have found that Asian makers can sometimes screw up the most foolproof mechanisms, probably due to price-point issues or poor quality control. 



Binding, it seems to me, is also usually caused by poorly made and fitted parts. No amount of lubrication can fix too much or too little clearance between parts.

Helix - Posted - 03/30/2022:  08:29:59


Those are good quality entry level spec tuners
Gold Tone knows their stuff
No burrs, little slippage
And the first one to use black knobs

mikehalloran - Posted - 03/30/2022:  10:57:16


I would apply a tiny bit of white lube (lithium grease) and then replace the covers to keep the dust out. You'll probably never have to do that again.

Lew H - Posted - 03/30/2022:  19:01:25


If that little bolt in the center of the cogwheel is loose, that will lead to some slippage of your tuners. Check that out.

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